Pakistani man carried out bombing near US consulate in Jeddah: Saudi ministry

[Nilgiri]

Not claims; evidence.

Show me the evidence and state the source.

 

[Joe Shearer]

And that's what I am contesting you on.

Remember Batla House Encounter. A Policeman Died in that.
Difference is, no Police died in Ishrat and 3 other terrorists encounter.

Point though, there is clear evidence that she was a terrorist. Hence, without any obvious evidence, which is proven in courts that there was malicious intent on part of govt machinery, I would give them the benefit of doubt.

And no, I don't think govt killing terrorists who are planning to kill innocents as murder.



It looks like the duty is one way street.
Where is the "duty" of citizen to back and protect the police who is protecting them?

Look at how IB officer Mani was put through hell so that Congress could frame BJP on Ishrat.

You are nobody to give anybody the benefit of the doubt. That is for the courts to prove. I will not reply to any further posts by you. You have already established yourself as the dullest of Indian members, without exception.

Show me the evidence and state the source.

It is on court records. I am not planning to do your homework to prevent you from making disastrously wrong statements. Do your own dirty work. I do my own and comment only when I know my facts are correct.

 

[DesiGuy1403]

You have already established yourself as the dullest of Indian members, without exception.

That was uncalled for. You have abused me, where I have been civil with you.

when I up the ante and reply to your insults, you will give me negative rating.

Beyond that, you have no evidences to back up what you are saying either. Should the insult you threw at me, apply to you as well?

The moment citizens stop supporting the very people who protect them, they loose the right to demand protection.
The disservice certain sections do to security forces is unbelievable.
India is the only nation where soldiers who die in line duty are abused by their ungrateful citizens.
It is the unkindest cut of all.

 

[American Pakistani]

What a disgraceful moment for all pakistanis throughout the world. Anywhere there is similar sort of incident and there is pakistan's name involved. When will pakistan's army act to get normal pakistanis rid of this disgraceful shame? There should be zero tolerance against mulla makkari.

 

[Nilgiri]

It is on court records. I am not planning to do your homework to prevent you from making disastrously wrong statements. Do your own dirty work. I do my own and comment only when I know my facts are correct.

Court records have now been shown to be tainted by false testimony. The case is still ongoing in that regard to get to the truth.

I would advise you not to take any set of instances as indisputable evidence till the court case is completed.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Court records have now been shown to be tainted by false testimony. The case is still ongoing in that regard to get to the truth.

I would advise you not to take any set of instances as indisputable evidence till the court case is completed.

There is a difference between indisputable evidence and evidence. And there is nothing wrong with citing evidence as being stronger than newspaper speculation or tainted political propaganda.

 

[DesiGuy1403]

I would advise you not to take any set of instances as indisputable evidence till the court case is completed.

Naa...why wait for court to give it's verdict when it is more convenient and perhaps fits own agenda to spew venom at the very people who defend us.

This is a pattern I have noticed in Indians. No where in the world, no other security forces have to face the disgraceful behaviour of their ungrateful citizens.

A whole nation cheered when American forces took out OBL. they did not ask why they killed a man who was unarmed and not brought to trail. In India....I am ashamed to say, we don't deserve the work our intelligence guys do in harsh conditions, pitiful pay and ungrateful citizens.

 

[alarabi]

Some guys are trying to use the nationality of this guy to demonize the image of Pakistan.
BTW, we Saudis will never forget Ferman Ali Khan, a Pakistani guy, who sacrifices his life to save 14 lives from extreme rain flood in Jeddah the same city which was attacked 2 days ago.

May Allah rest his soul in Jannah.

 

[DesiGuy1403]

Some Indians are trying to use the nationality of this guy to demonize the image of Pakistan.
BTW, we Saudis will never forget Ferman Ali Khan, a Pakistani guy, who sacrifices his life to save 14 lives from extreme rain flood in Jeddah the same city which was attacked 2 days ago.

May Allah rest his soul in Jannah.

One guy does not represent a country or religion.
If that were the case, we Indians won't have faces to hide anywhere.

 

[Nilgiri]

There is a difference between indisputable evidence and evidence. And there is nothing wrong with citing evidence as being stronger than newspaper speculation or tainted political propaganda.

Thats all well and fine, but I would say at this juncture we must let the Indian court process proceed before coming to conclusions. There is unfortunately much politically motivated tainting from many sides. We will have to wait and trust in our judges and legal experts to get to the bottom of the matter before we can saw one set of circumstances is the absolute truth.

Its similar to how cases get re-opened all the time as new evidence comes up (often squashing old-evidence)...like how people were redeemed by DNA evidence for example when they were convicted when such evidence was not present.

This case has not even been completed yet and there are all sorts of new claims coming to light regarding what the congress administration did to various officers involved in the case to potentially skew the narrative in some way. Again it will all have to be analysed and allowed its due right to be seen by the court.

All I'm saying is I don't think we should comment on which is evidence and which is propaganda when we have no idea what was compromised due to political motives. Let the court come to a decision and we will accept that.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Thats all well and fine, but I would say at this juncture we must let the Indian court process proceed before coming to conclusions. There is unfortunately much politically motivated tainting from many sides. We will have to wait and trust in our judges and legal experts to get to the bottom of the matter before we can saw one set of circumstances is the absolute truth.

Its similar to how cases get re-opened all the time as new evidence comes up (often squashing old-evidence)...like how people were redeemed by DNA evidence for example when they were convicted when such evidence was not present.

This case has not even been completed yet and there are all sorts of new claims coming to light regarding what the congress administration did to various officers involved in the case to potentially skew the narrative in some way. Again it will all have to be analysed and allowed its due right to be seen by the court.

All I'm saying is I don't think we should comment on which is evidence and which is propaganda when we have no idea what was compromised due to political motives. Let the court come to a decision and we will accept that.

As far as you are concerned, to me, you are demonstrating a hideous point of view which is morally and legally wrong. You are supporting encounter deaths and you are supporting the principle of the police and the para-military not being held accountable for their actions, on the specious grounds that this might lead to some improvement in the situation.

Isharat Jahan and her companion are supposed to have been ISI agents, according to the counter-evidence that you might have in mind. It is said that they were deeply implicated in plots to assassinate the Chief Minister. If that is true, then the act of murder that was committed, apart from being a justiciable matter in itself, has had no practical effect. If it is the case that murdering any and every suspect can ameliorate the situation, that is stupid. The situation has only degenerated further, in terms of bankrolled interference in the country by foreign agencies.

The only outcome was a murder.

 

[Nilgiri]

You are supporting encounter deaths and you are supporting the principle of the police and the para-military not being held accountable for their actions, on the specious grounds that this might lead to some improvement in the situation.

Like I said the court case regarding Mr. Vanzara and the others is ongoing (he has been charged but not convicted). They are innocent till proven guilty. We will have to wait till the full picture and weight of evidence is brought to light and deliberated upon in court. It is an evolving picture so we should not come to conclusions about what transpired.

I am not supporting encounter killings/staged killings....but it must be proven in court of law beyond a reasonable doubt that the evidence and testimonies hold up (especially in light of the new incoming info). We only can gauge that when the verdict is reached....and see if it was really an encounter killing as charged or something else altogether (i.e liquidation of a clear and present danger to security).

None of us should be playing the role of the judge here, that is left to the courts to do.

Isharat Jahan and her companion are supposed to have been ISI agents, according to the counter-evidence that you might have in mind. It is said that they were deeply implicated in plots to assassinate the Chief Minister. If that is true, then the act of murder that was committed, apart from being a justiciable matter in itself, has had no practical effect. If it is the case that murdering any and every suspect can ameliorate the situation, that is stupid. The situation has only degenerated further, in terms of bankrolled interference in the country by foreign agencies.

The only outcome was a murder.

Again you are acting as the judge. Please let the court decide.

 

[DesiGuy1403]

Again you are acting as the judge. Please let the court decide.

That's his speciality.
When it suits him he will ask for courts decision, in other's his decision is gospel.
When it suits him supporting terrorists crime, that is until he supports one, when you protest, you are a bigot with an "agenda".

The duplicity is shocking.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Like I said the court case regarding Mr. Vanzara and the others is ongoing (he has been charged but not convicted). They are innocent till proven guilty. We will have to wait till the full picture and weight of evidence is brought to light and deliberated upon in court. It is an evolving picture so we should not come to conclusions about what transpired.

I am not supporting encounter killings/staged killings....but it must be proven in court of law beyond a reasonable doubt that the evidence and testimonies hold up (especially in light of the new incoming info). We only can gauge that when the verdict is reached....and see if it was really an encounter killing as charged or something else altogether (i.e liquidation of a clear and present danger to security).

None of us should be playing the role of the judge here, that is left to the courts to do.



Again you are acting as the judge. Please let the court decide.

Let the court decide, but you are convicted out of your own mouth.

Is liquidation of a clear and present danger to security by shooting the individuals concerned after taking them into captivity legal, according to you?

 

[DesiGuy1403]

Is liquidation of a clear and present danger to security by shooting the individuals concerned after taking them into captivity legal, according to you?

That's not what happened.
At least that's not what police and IB claim that has happened.
It was trap, the terrorists fell for it. In the shoot out they died.

Happens all over the world all the time.

Heck... this happens all over India, all the time, why is this one so special?