Pakistan will buy fighter jets from Jordan, Russia, France

[airomerix]

Unfortunately, Jordan's attempt to sell F-16 fighter jets from Falcon Peace 2 has failed because of the intransigence of the United States and its refusal to sell!

Although it successfully sold 13 F-16 Falcon Peace 1 fighter jets in 2014!

Thanks to Obama Administration I guess.

 

[Nashab]

Thanks to Obama Administration I guess.

Approval of the first deal and rejection of the second deal, ,,, two were under the era of Barack Obama

 

[batmannow]

For all the naysayers for F16, please see what we are able to achieve with the machine. It is not going anywhere soon.

oh sure ; by that u mean evn USAF should not induct more raptors and F35's in its inventory?
thy shouLD keep modifying F16s ?

 

[Trailer23]

oh sure ; by that u mean evn USAF should not induct more raptors and F35's in its inventory?
thy shouLD keep modifying F16s ?

Well, for one thing the US will NOT be inducting the F-22 (Raptor) - anymore. It last came off the production line back in 2011 after Congress decided there was no need for it, further.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_Martin_F-22_Raptor#Production_termination

Hurricane Michael didn't help either as some were damaged beyond repairs & had to be Cannibalized.

And why the debate about PAF being compared with the USAF? The USAF have more options to Military Hardware than both you & I at Baskin Robbins.

The F-16's have been the backbone of the PAF for nearly 4 decades, now. Even with the introduction of the JF-17's - there is still a fear in the eyes of the enemy with the presence of those very 70-something F-16's in our inventory.

 

[syed_yusuf]

Well, for one thing the US will NOT be inducting the F-22 (Raptor) - anymore. It last came off the production line back in 2011 after Congress decided there was no need for it, further.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_Martin_F-22_Raptor#Production_termination

Hurricane Michael didn't help either as some were damaged beyond repairs & had to be Cannibalized.

And why the debate about PAF being compared with the USAF? The USAF have more options to Military Hardware than both you & I at Baskin Robbins.

The F-16's have been the backbone of the PAF for nearly 4 decades, now. Even with the introduction of the JF-17's - there is still a fear in the eyes of the enemy with the presence of those very 70-something F-16's in our inventory.

IAF and India by and large underestimated the PAF and specially JFT. They know a lot about f-16 as they have done numerous exercises with their friends flying it. So does paf who knows all faults in su-30mki. IAF know how formidable f-16 is with paf. And how detrimental it is for paf supremecey. They totally miscalculated JFT. but PAF neither miscalculated IAF from any angle.

 

[Khafee]

@Mangus Ortus Novem @MastanKhan @araz @Tps43 @The Eagle

One can't help but wonder, what would the outcome have been, had Blk60's been used, instead of Blk52.

 

[Pakhtoon yum]

So not to beat a dead horse but what happened to the French and Russian options?

 

[GriffinsRule]

So not to beat a dead horse but what happened to the French and Russian options?

Everything is on the table, except all mighty $$

 

[Humble Analyst]

ISLAMABAD: Pakistan is considering a Jordanian offer to buy sixteen used F-16 jets in lieu of the eight advanced fighters it could not buy from the United States because of a financing row, but officials fear Washington could still throw a spanner in the works.

The case for the purchase of F-16s from the US is closed, “we are now going for a third party transfer of F-16s and have an offer from Jordan”, Defence Secretary retired Lt Gen Alam Khattak told a joint sitting of the Senate committees on defence and foreign affairs, which had been asked by Senate Chairman Raza Rabbani to review the current state of Pak-US ties and suggest the way forward.

The fiasco over procurement of F-16s, which started with Congress blocking the funding of the sale from the US government’s Foreign Military Financing Programme, brought into focus the underlying strains in Washington-Islamabad ties because of Pakistan’s alleged inadequate action against the Taliban, Haqqani network and Lashkar-i-Taiba and concerns over the scope and pace of development of its missile and nuclear programme.

Editorial: US pressure once again

Pakistani officials contend that the reasons for which US Congress withheld the financing were non-negotiable. However, the episode has forced the government to rethink its strategy of not having lobbyists in Washington and a couple of lobbying firms are expected to be hired shortly for the country’s image correction and improving relations with Congress.

Secretary Khattak conceded that the used Block-30 F-16s being offered by Jordan were not of the same quality and standard as the Block-52 that were originally intended to be bought from the US.

The Jordanian aircraft, which were manufactured in 1988/90 and upgraded in 2001/02, may have to be upgraded again to meet Pakistan Air Force’s current demands. But Pakistan, after losing the opportunity to buy new jets from the US, may immediately need them to replace the Block-15 F-16s currently in PAF’s inventory, which are due to be retired in the next couple of years.

Pakistan had earlier in 2014 bought around a dozen F-16s from Jordan, which has been modernising its fleet.

The defence secretary observed that for the state-of-the-art fifth generation fighters Russian and French markets would have to be explored.

Another defence ministry official Rear Admiral Mukhtar Khan, however, said the US had so far not objected to the deal with Jordan, but under the current environment getting American approval for the sale, a mandatory requirement, would not be easy to manage.

Adviser to the Prime Minister on Foreign Affairs Sartaj Aziz told the meeting that the government was right in not accepting the US conditions. “If the conditions affect national interest, it is better not to accept them. It was an issue of choices,” he contended while deliberating on the reasons that led to the cancellation of the F-16 deal with the US.

The Haqqani network, he said, was not a simple issue and could have caused a blowback. Moreover, he noted, the matter was linked to the border management, which the Afghan government had been resisting.

Mr Aziz further said the US had been conveyed that Pakistan would respond to the increasing imbalance in the region because of the Indo-US defence cooperation through maintaining its strategic deterrence.

He said the move for appointment of a lobbyist had been started and short-listing of prospective firms was being done.

The government has so far remained averse to hiring the lobbyist. The military, in view of the intended defence procurements including the F-16s, had last year advised the government to hire a lobbying firm, but the proposal was shot down ostensibly because of apprehensions that the lobbyist may be used by the military for its own promotion.

Foreign Secretary Aizaz Chaudhry in his testimony said that there could be no compromise on the nuclear programme and blamed the US for causing a setback to Afghan reconciliation efforts by acting in haste and eliminating Afghan Taliban chief Mullah Akhtar Mansour in a drone attack.

A number of members of the committees differed with the government explanation on not acting against the Haqqani network and Taliban.

Farhatullah Babar of the PPP said the meeting should be an occasion of introspection rather than bravado.

He regretted that after the killing of Mullah Mansour jihad was again flaunted as an instrument of policy with the Difa-i-Pakistan Council, a conglomerate of radical groups, being allowed to hold rallies.

He worried that isolation would be Pakistan’s destiny unless a course correction was undertaken.

Javed Abbasi, retired Brig John Kenneth Williams, Karim Khawaja and retired Lt Gen Salahuddin Tirmizi too expressed their concerns.

Chairman of the Defence Committee Mushahid Hussain Sayed, who co-chaired the meeting with Chairperson of the Foreign Affairs Committee Nuzhat Sadiq, said that a strategic shift in the US policy towards the region was visible.

He believed that US actions like the killing of Mullah Mansour depicted confusion in its policy on Afghanistan.

He stressed the need for institutionally strengthening the Foreign Office so that institutional decision-making by the National Security Committee, the Defence Committee of the Cabinet and the Defence Council be promoted instead of a reactive ad hoc approach which drifts from crisis to crisis.

Published in Dawn, June 14th, 2016

Thanks for sharing the date of the article should clarify things. I doubt about French selling Pak Rafale or M2k.
Russia will not sell anything significant, this is just to lure India into locking some more deals. Without funding even China will not sell anything unless PK comes up with some sort of funding.
Window shopping is not a crime

Well, for one thing the US will NOT be inducting the F-22 (Raptor) - anymore. It last came off the production line back in 2011 after Congress decided there was no need for it, further.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_Martin_F-22_Raptor#Production_termination

Hurricane Michael didn't help either as some were damaged beyond repairs & had to be Cannibalized.

And why the debate about PAF being compared with the USAF? The USAF have more options to Military Hardware than both you & I at Baskin Robbins.

The F-16's have been the backbone of the PAF for nearly 4 decades, now. Even with the introduction of the JF-17's - there is still a fear in the eyes of the enemy with the presence of those very 70-something F-16's in our inventory.

Not to mention USA is considering upgrading the F16 life from 8000 to 12000 hours. That does not mean I am saying PL should go for more F16

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

@Mangus Ortus Novem @MastanKhan @araz @Tps43 @The Eagle

One can't help but wonder, what would the outcome have been, had Blk60's been used, instead of Blk52.

The Block-60 is custom grade for the UAE, I'm not sure if LM was even offering it (without a mark-up anyways).

Ultimately, to @MastanKhan's point, the Kashmir Earthquake was a big turning point. Whatever one's thoughts may be about the decision to divert funding, there's no doubt, it changed the course.

In 2004, we were talking about up to 55 Block-52+, 30-40 'Plus Ones' (M2K-5, J-10, or even Typhoon T1), 6 Erieye AEW&C, 4 Airbus A310 MRTT (to refuel both boom and hose/drogue), 20 CN235, and, of course, 150+ JF-17s with Thales/MBDA equipment plus 60 F-16A/B MLU and 90-odd Mirage ROSE.

If the PAF had gotten that fleet, then today, 95% of our discussion would just be on upgrading the F-16s with AESA radars. Otherwise, we'd be looking ahead to Project Azm comfortably.

 

[untitled]

(to refuel both boom and hose/drogue)

How much R&D and cost will it take to convert a JF-17 in to a buddy tanker?

 

[ziaulislam]

The Block-60 is custom grade for the UAE, I'm not sure if LM was even offering it (without a mark-up anyways).

Ultimately, to @MastanKhan's point, the Kashmir Earthquake was a big turning point. Whatever one's thoughts may be about the decision to divert funding, there's no doubt, it changed the course.

In 2004, we were talking about up to 55 Block-52+, 30-40 'Plus Ones' (M2K-5, J-10, or even Typhoon T1), 6 Erieye AEW&C, 4 Airbus A310 MRTT (to refuel both boom and hose/drogue), 20 CN235, and, of course, 150+ JF-17s with Thales/MBDA equipment plus 60 F-16A/B MLU and 90-odd Mirage ROSE.

If the PAF had gotten that fleet, then today, 95% of our discussion would just be on upgrading the F-16s with AESA radars. Otherwise, we'd be looking ahead to Project Azm comfortably.

Also rapid destabilizing events that followed from 2008-2018

 

[PakShaheen79]

Surpriseeeeeeeeeeeeee ....!! We are actually buying from Egypt. PAF's way to create deception.

PS: This post is on the lighter note. Not be taken seriously.

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

Also rapid destabilizing events that followed from 2008-2018

Yeah, but 2005 was the peak -- from there, it was a steep down hill ride.

 

[MastanKhan]

@Mangus Ortus Novem @MastanKhan @araz @Tps43 @The Eagle

One can't help but wonder, what would the outcome have been, had Blk60's been used, instead of Blk52.

Hi,

Truthfully---AN OVERKILL---.

Khafee---the problem here is---that Paf did not do the job right---.

It gave away it secrets that it did not have to just TO SHOW WHAT THEY COULD DO---to hide their embarrassment in not TRAPPING the enemy on the night of the 26th.

Truthfully--and I did not want to write it before---Paf's reaction was like the THUGS---.

When an enemy is threatening openly---Paf was not ready and prepared to react to enemy's incursion---and they will lie thru their teeth to hide their ill-preparedness due to their INHERENT ARROGANCE---.

Mohammad Yousuf was a great cricketer---an never improved on his fielding---. When he would let go a boundary while fielding---he would reply---it is not a problem---I will make you the score---don't worry about my fielding lapses---.

And that is what Paf psyche is---.

Don't worry we fckd up---we will take care of it---.

In that show and strut period on the 27th---we gave away all our secrets---.

T
If the PAF had gotten that fleet, then today, 95% of our discussion would just be on upgrading the F-16s with AESA radars. Otherwise, we'd be looking ahead to Project Azm comfortably.

Hi,

If Paf had gotten that fleet---we would have peace deal signed with India longtime ago---Kashmir issue would have been resolved---and we would have been progressing forward---.

Pagf fckd up pakistan and Kashmiris by claiming to Musharraf that there was no need for aircraft now because peace is just around the corner---no reason to waste the funds---.

And these are our warriors---who are ready to lay down their arms up in advance of the enemy if opportunity came knocking---.