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Pakistan to purchase latest fighter planes, submarines: Tanveer

I laughed a lot,,now move on.
Try convincing pakistanis that mig-35 is good buy when zhuk-ae is still in trials:sarcastic:



Mi-28 is possible.

This is for you..........
15311731033_96de44843a_o.jpg
 
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This is for you..........
15311731033_96de44843a_o.jpg

Beautiful bird,no doubt.

But su-35 is much better.Even though mig-35 has an aesa radar but it has(fga-35) only 1000 t/r elements with 5-10 watts per t/r module giving it just 5-10 kwatt peak power and max range of 200 km

irbis-e is pesa but with 20 kw peak power and 400 km range,,not to mention superior engines,irst,jammers etc.
 
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@he-man

The PAK FA ; MTA ; Nuclear Subs ; Brahmos 2; MKI Upgrades ; Mig 29 K ; Nuclear reactors
are ALL fine .

Please remember India is NOT Doing a favour to Russia by buying these things
We get value for money plus TOT and above all strategic systems which nobody else will
SELL us like Nuclear Subs and Brahmos

Arms market is a BUYERS Market
All you need is money
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thats the pint all you need is money..
total pak total def budget vs india def to rusia..
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Pak stoped its IP gas piple line under pressure of USA... when power is most needed. do you think USA will allow pak to get Rusian wapson at thier behest.. ?
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India is not doing favour.. so russia is also not doing favour..
except china in asia no one can buy that scale... and again china always copy and paste and export as chinsese stuff.. which not case in india.

All pakistani frinds who want to buy list of russian stuff incudling MIG 35 .. su 30..
can you tell two ans..
How you will pay russian ?
as Russian are under sanction even by EU and Russia .. will they allow you to buy it.. ?
when france is not allowd or postone will west allow you ?
 
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As I expected

Your previous post was an emphatic one that "No jets are coming "

I thought that No Indian can say in such a straight forward manner

And yes Curiousity is my weakness; sometimes it is a bad thing ; gets you into trouble :p:

Well thanks for pointing out that Indians are not straightforward, otherwise my understanding which you thought was otherwise would have lasted a little longer (I have lived among Indians more than of your expectation). And boy I like people who are curious because that's something which I understand adds a little crisp into your life.

Now lets get back to the topic shall we?
 
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You brought up some good points to design a strategy around. Let me answer in order for you:

1) Russian gas deal is an optimal deal for you. (Sadly, being an American, I am saying this, we don't have a direct pipeline to Pakistan so I guess I can favor the Russians here). Whether I like it or not, Russia is the second largest military power. They are no longer a super power, but they are the second largest power and then there is China. I'd even put them in one basket.

So having relationships with TWO second largest powers in the entire globe is NEVER bad. And having billions of trade where they make money too, is icing on the cake. These are two veto votes in the UN, just fyi. Plus dealing with Russians, you'll overcome many issues with regards to the Central Russian estates as they are scared of the Red Bear, and will allow smooth transition of oil and gas. And in turn, Pakistan gets help, investments and advanced weapons, and corners a huge power in his court. Not a bad deal at all.

2) The Central Russian estates that don't like Russia, do like China and some even Pakistan. So you'll be covered from all angles. This is plenty of leverage there. Plus remember, these Central Russian estates all have Chinese influence and they would eventually be linked with China through road and rail links. Which means that they want to use Gawader as its cheaper too. So more business for Pakistan as the silk road develops and becomes operational.

3) After the recent meetings with the Afghans, I won't count them as a factor. They may have good relations with India. But the Afghanistan needs China for infrastructure development and the Chinese need Pakistan's help here. So at the end, Pakistan is very involved within Afghanistan, in a good way. There are shared common agreements now in place to even buy Pakistani weapons and JFT planes, plus training. So things are looking good from that side for both, Afghanistan and Pakistan.

They've agreed to let the Indian influence out of the relationships and thus you see the change in tone. Otherwise, China won't invest in it if the Afghanis keep playing the India part and tick off Pakistan. And Afghanistan will remain a "remote mountainous region" for the next three decades to come. If you want to turn it into civilization.....you'll need the Chinese for the infrastructure and the Pakistanis allowing ports to send goods, machinery and all from Karachi and Gawader. Simple is that.

4) Iran can use their port that they want to build with India. But who are they supplying stuff too? The width of Iran from this port is so big that it'll be super expensive to transport stuff from Iran......plus India doesn't need it as they have ports themselves. They may be able to build a naval base at lease or something but that's it.
Plus, when Pakistan is working with the Russians and the Chinese, the Iran factor almost fades away. Because they are pro-Russians and pro-Chinese. So in case of a conflict, they can get a shush call from either the Chinese or the Russians.

Plus, PAF having -16 block 52, JFT Block II and III's, with potentially SU-37's, why a country the size of Iran or even India want to mess with such strong 4th generation flying force? You can try it, but be ready to lose half the number of your top line jets and that's a pretty expensive proposal for any one. Iran hardly has that conflict ability anymore.

India can use Iran for Baluchistan as Afghanistan will back off of India using their land for this (if it hasn't already, that was the strong message Gen. Raheel had for the Afghanistan leadership that if they don't work well for the Pakistani interests, Pakistan will hot pursuit the terrorist back to Afghanistan). I doubt that Iran will allow India to do so, specially knowing that it might piss off the Russians or the Chinese as terrorists will try to find these foreigners working in Pakistan to target first.

So at the end, the future looks bright for Pakistan. The MAJOR danger is not from the outside right now, it is from the inside, the political unrest in Pakistan can scare away the investors. That needs to be fixed. Plus the current government MUST complete its turn, otherwise you'll lose a lot of advantages I mentioned above as they've brought in a lot of investment because of their relationships. That's what a CFO does in a company.....



1) I am not a Pakistani citizen. I just write the truth and sometimes it is not in favor of India or Pakistan. So please quit pigeon holing me. My loyalty is to the Star Spangled Banner you see in my signatures.

3) There is no law that says there have to be gradual increase in any budget. It is their money and they'll use it as they wish to. You and I have nothing to worry about. If they want to spend it all on jets, they will. We don't have a say in it.
Good luck with your super analysis...
 
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I'm pretty sure he meant helicopters. Do remember the Sharif administration has as much brain power between it as an ameba. I don't see Pakistan purchasing any fixed wing platform from Russia. Pakistan will stick with China.

I'm seriously expecting a thread to be posted soon that Pakistan will be buying Russian cryogenic engines soon, with TOT. :p:
 
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I'm pretty sure he meant helicopters. Do remember the Sharif administration has as much brain power between it as an ameba. I don't see Pakistan purchasing any fixed wing platform from Russia. Pakistan will stick with China.

I'm seriously expecting a thread to be posted soon that Pakistan will be buying Russian cryogenic engines soon, with TOT. :p:

Man the quality of forum is going down the drain.:disagree:
 
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@orangzaib so what you think will Pakistan go for Su-30 (Russian equivalent version of MKI) or Su-35 or Russia will push Mig-35s with TOT? Although PAF need Su-35 at least 03 squadrons to handle IAF until 5th gen arrived to them.
Mig-35
or
Su-35
which is better
 
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Mig-35
or
Su-35
which is better
Su-35 obviously beter than mig35 but Pakistan doesn't in need of Russia fighter. eventhough Russian defense analysts are suggesting that Russia should offer mig35 to Pakistan.
 
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@orangzaib @Umair Nawaz @Sulman Badshah
thanks for your posts but we have gone way past the scope of the thread (its not our sacred constitution though so its fine :) just saying)

I just expressed my doubts over too good to be true news first our journalists lack technical know how and the authentication of such claims, secondly something so significant would have more meat to the bone.

Iran tilting to India at the expense of Pakistan is too far fetched, granted we have differences and issues with Iran due to activities of USA/ KSA against it through our land but Iran & Pakistan also suffer the insurgency of the Baloch nationalists & sectarian terrorists and it will suffer same fate. I cant , also speak for India on how America will see India cozying up with Ayatullahs either. if Su 3x family was on cards then Pakistan would have gone for Chinese J-11 but it didnt so I dont know
Yes u are right but lets agree that in this new economic boom that we might get soon let not leave iran empty handed. Since indians are opportunists and they may exploit it specially infront of irani nationalists there and which in turn will more strengthen Indian case or credibility in irani eyes. And who knows in future ie lets says after 30 years to 50 years what comes out. For that atleast more trade and SAARC entry might help our cause. Lets be not like indians for what they did with us in the last decade for our pursuit for peace with them. U never let yr opponent go empty handed as far as international relations are concern. In IR u need to look things in long run. Since indians buying the oil amisd all sanctions in int. pressure is huge thing in iran.

I said to mr F.O.X. also when ISIS released the indian hostages in iraq that u never know where these small little gestures take u to! After the 1979 revolution of iran and their no support for us in the kashmir cause has build iran india relations this big today. So if we still completely ignore iran specially when the GCC are funding the jundullah type people here too might go somewhere given the background of how indians build international relations. Completely ignoring iran today might cost us dearly tomorrow since now we are again going with our kashmir cause and our defences in rear are still vulnerable in the long run!

No offense but calling a whole nation stupid shows the level of your stupidity...!
And even if we are stupid as u claim, we are hugely proud of this stupidity which has got us way way way ahead of u guys in the global senario.
No dude im not saying this im just echoing the

Katju says 90% Indians are idiots | Business Line

Why I said 90 per cent of Indians are ‘fools’ – The Express Tribune

and same said by yr journalist......KRISHNA POKHAREL

India, a Nation of More Than 1 Billion ‘Fools’ - India Real Time - WSJ

And i know what he means by that since these guys surely know a thing or two.

Rafale is a tricky issues, it is just not about buying that aircraft. There are issues of liabilities, there are issues of M88 ToT, India is actually not interested in the M88 engine as whole, but the engine's core tech., and mainly did France provide the metallurgy of SCB in which India failed tremendously.

The main purpose is not just built the Rafale in India like JF-17. But also bring the necessary tech, in which DRDO failed to develop in LCA and Kaveri program.

And one more thing, Kaveri was also tested with M88 core, and it worked perfectly. But again that not indigenous at all.
There are millions of factors involved in such a case, from International Relations POV the mistal ship deal with france and russia is very significant in this case and in the latest putin's visit u may see india also pressurizing france or going away from that deal if yr india can play its cards right and ''keep'' the Russo-Indian relations alive for its own good. Another factor of the credibility of france as a partner in order to smoothly transfer the technology etc are also taken into consideration.

But again these are assumptions right now lets see what comes out.

Great answer from a phd student(claims!!)............:angel:
:lol: ok my dear indie friend!
 
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