Pakistan pitches for mutual demilitarisation of Siachen after Lance Naik Koppad's death

[Robinhood Pandey]

Losers always have an excuse to make.



Ppl can cry us another Siachen and we will occupy that as well if required

 

[Abingdonboy]

Because the Pakistani move itself was a result of Indian escalation of the issue, the detection of Indian patrols and the realizing in Pakistan that India was planning a military operation to occupy the glacier. India 'preempted' a Pakistani military operation that India herself was the cause of.

And round and round we go down this "he started it, now he did", as I have said- it is all meaningless. One way or another one side was victorious, the other the loser. These are the ground realities today, no amount of historical revisionism will change these facts so why even bother?

The ISI is not an omnipotent deity, and fanboys are called fanboys for a reason, but for you to use fanboy jingoism as justification in an argument is a pretty poor reflection on you. Sure there was incompetence, no institution is perfect.

The entire justification by the Pak military for the hold they have in every aspect of Pakistan was that they keep Pakistan safe, if they are unable to keep Pakistan safe from the world's most dangerous man then is the ROI congruent with this continued myth? Either way, it is a very poor showing and should have provoked far more introspection than it did.

Hi,

How do you know there was no WMDin Iraq ?

Did they find them? It's been 13 years now.

It is a matter of historical record that these were lies used to justify the 2003 invasion.

Like I said earlier - if you want to stick to petty point scoring by distorting the context in which the word 'roam' was used, find someone willing to stoop to that level of intellectual disingenuity and trolling to engage with. If you have any further rational and serious arguments to make, I'm all 'eyes'.

Okay fair enough, perhaps I shouldn't have taken you literally but that is a minor point. You have failed to address the more serious points as these go to the very core of Pakistan's society.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Disputed means ' finders keepers .. losers weepers" . Pak should know this .. surely.

Then why is India whining and crying about 'Kargil'? Given India's military aggression in Siachen that preceded Kargil, India has no grounds to whine, cry and do a Bollywood tamasha about Pakistani actions in Kargil.

It says a lot more than this . Only you seem to chose to ignore.

Back in 83 -84 Pak was not a nuclear state.

What you're ignoring is the fact that your second line above validated my point - India and Pakistan were not both nuclear States in 1984 and global realities had not transitioned over to the post-Cold War global dynamic - those 2 factors are the major points of diversion when analyzing international reaction to Kargil compared to Siachen.

I appreciate the discomfort this subject creates to loyal & intelligent Pakistanis .

It's more an exasperation at the sheer inanity and tunnel vision presented in arguments and analysis (if it can even be called that given how superficial it is) on the subject by so many in the West and India.

 

[salarsikander]

Did they find them? It's been 13 years now.

Hi,

So why didnt I see his body ? I have seen Saddam's, Qaddafis but not his :S

I mean an entire country was up against this for last 13 years and yet when we was supposedly captured, not a single proof was shown

 

[Abingdonboy]

Then why is India whining and crying about 'Kargil'? Given India's military aggression in Siachen that preceded Kargil, India has no grounds to whine, cry and do a Bollywood tamasha about Pakistani actions in Kargil.

What whining? India addressed the Kargil intrusion swiftly and without hesitation. If anything, Pakistan's actions on Siachin can be classed as "whining", but this line of argument really is spiralling into a very juvenile line.

Hi,

So why didnt I see his body ? I have seen Saddam's, Qaddafis but not his :S

I mean an entire country was up against this for last 13 years and yet when we was supposedly captured, not a single proof was shown

Oh come on, so who did they kill in Abbotobad?

I imagine why no picutres were released of his corpse was because those SEALS did some pretty uncivilised things to him. From what I've heard this included a few operators emptying their entire magazine into him once he was dead and (i'm not sure how creidble this is) they may even have started to dismember on the flight back to Afghanistan.

After all that his body was dumped into the Arabian Sea.

 

[salarsikander]

Oh come on, so who did they kill in Abbotobad?

Hi,

Oh come on ! they can invade an entire country on the pretext of non-existent WMD !

what does a little hollywood type drama matter ?

Is that the reason they told you for not releasing pictures ?

Because I am not sure if you have heard of Gitmo detainees scandal which was far more worse and inhumane,
so my dear your argument here is totally invalid

 

[Abingdonboy]

Hi,

Oh come on ! they can invade an entire country on the pretext of non-existent WMD !

what does a little hollywood type drama matter ?

Is that the reason they told you for not releasing pictures ?

Because I am not sure if you have heard of Gitmo detainees scandal which was far more worse and inhumane,
so my dear your argument here is totally invalid

Well we can agree to disagree then, but even the GoP has accepted that OBL was in Abbotobad so I'm not sure there is any point in denying it further.

 

[Areesh]

India was the victor- end of story, the reasons behind it are meaningless, had it been the other way around you would be just as dismissive. India is willing to accept the cost of such a presence, perhaps Pakistan isn't because it gains almost nothing from doing so.

India is a victor since it occupies Siachen. It occupies Siachen. Never denied that. No matter how meaningless your occupation of Siachen is, still you are victors to a needless conflict.

You don't need to mention that again and again.

 

[salarsikander]

Well we can agree to disagree then, but even the GoP has accepted that OBL was in Abbotobad so I'm not sure there is any point in denying it further.

Hi,

Its not about disagreeing, it's about you being biased here.

You can agree that WMD invasion was lie but a little drama type operation was genuine LMAO ( because Pakistan was involved)

If any of statement were true. USA would have bombed the shit out of us. Imagine a country spent more than trllion dollar on chasing a ghost and finding its shadow just next to prestigious academy !

US would have swallowed us

Point is, do you remember 196 U2 Incident ? A country like ( Tiny) Pakistan has to listen to powerful country !

 

[Areesh]

And that has trained us so well ... that Even Global Military comes to us for COIN trainings: US Army keen to learn from India's counter-insurgency operations - timesofindia-economictimes

Obviously no other country faced sh!t in so many forms. You are unique example as a shithole.

 

[Abingdonboy]

India is a victor since it occupies Siachen. It occupies Siachen. Never denied that. No matter how meaningless your occupation of Siachen is, still you are victors to a needless conflict.

You don't need to mention that again and again.

I'm just saying that we needn'y get bogged down with our different interpretations of histroy. We should accept the ground realities as they exist today and move on from there. Always looking backwards is a most regrettable course of action.

 

[Areesh]

I'm just saying that we needn'y get bogged down with our different interpretations of histroy. We should accept the ground realities as they exist today and move on from there. Always looking backwards is a most regrettable course of action.

What you are actually saying is that Pakistan should accept and respect your aggression in Siachen.

For that as a Pakistani I can only say. LPC. Thank You.

 

[Thəorətic Muslim]

Well we can agree to disagree then, but even the GoP has accepted that OBL was in Abbotobad so I'm not sure there is any point in denying it further.

OBL is regardless. Pakistan is facing a war of survival and in war you prioritize. The Pakistani Taliban is higher on the treat level than a butchered terrorist organization that USA itself considers headless long before Op. Neptune.

Drone attacks in the Tribal Wild Wild Lands are used to eliminate leaders of the Afghan Taliban, not members who threaten the existence of Pakistan.

Pakistan isn't America neither is India, they aren't nations that have $Tens of Billions of dollars to spare in search of 1 man. But since you have an existential view of India you're welcome to wire $Billions to the State Treasury of Pakistan.

Just like every nation only carries out Operations that threaten it's national security, Pakistan is no different.

 

[HAIDER]

New Delhi:On a day Siachen braveheart Lance Naik Hanamanthappa Koppad died, Pakistan on Thursday said time has come for "urgent" resolution of Siachen issue between it and India by mutually withdrawing troops from there to ensure more lives are not lost due to harsh conditions on the glacier.

Representational image. AFP

Koppad, who was admitted to Army hospital after being rescued alive three days ago from beneath tonnes of snow six days after an avalanche hit his post in Siachen at an altitude of 19,600 feet, died earlier in the day.

"These tragedies only reinforce the need to resolve the issue... urgently and through peaceful means, through dialogue," Pakistan High Commissioner Abdul Basit said while referring to a proposal of mutual withdrawal of troops from Siachen made by his Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif at the UN General Assembly last year.

"So, we strongly feel that the time has come to ensure that more lives are not lost due to harsh conditions in Siachen," the Pakistan envoy added.

PTI


Pakistan pitches for mutual demilitarisation of Siachen after Lance Naik Koppad's death - Firstpost

This is water source and these glaciers are extremely important. Diesel fumes and barrels, bombing and shelling is destroying this glacier slowly. These frequent avalanche are not good sign for future environment.

 

[MilSpec]

Then why is India whining and crying about 'Kargil'? Given India's military aggression in Siachen that preceded Kargil, India has no grounds to whine, cry and do a Bollywood tamasha about Pakistani actions in Kargil.

demarcated, vs non demarcated (kargil vs Siachen) if you can truly comprehend that, Having read the last few pages, it seems weird that you are raising "point scoring" while all along that's exactly what you have been doing.
And the bollywood tamasha was is primarily due to your fancy dress operation in kargil, perhaps you would remind us who the combatants were?

 

[third eye]

Then why is India whining and crying about 'Kargil'? Given India's military aggression in Siachen that preceded Kargil, India has no grounds to whine, cry and do a Bollywood tamasha about Pakistani actions in Kargil.

India is merely rubbing it in - in more ways than one.

How difficult is it to understand ?

What you're ignoring is the fact that your second line above validated my point - India and Pakistan were not both nuclear States in 1984 and global realities had not transitioned over to the post-Cold War global dynamic - those 2 factors are the major points of diversion when analyzing international reaction to Kargil compared to Siachen.

You brought out the Nuke angle.

It says a lot more - It underscores Pak inability to do anything locally & internationally on Indian stands & actions.

It's more an exasperation at the sheer inanity and tunnel vision presented in arguments and analysis (if it can even be called that given how superficial it is) on the subject by so many in the West and India.

Whatever sails your boat.