Pakistan F-16 Discussions 2

[BATMAN]

Q. Any memorable experiences that you would like to share?

A. On one occasion – in one of the international Anatolian Eagles - PAF pilots were pitted against RAF Typhoons, a formidable aircraft. There were three set-ups and in all three, we shot down the Typhoons. The RAF pilots were shocked.

Now where is that fellow who was asking about difference in PAF and other airforces of the world..
100% kill rate.... is killing man.

 

[BATMAN]

Here you go, Batman:

Thanks my dear but it is not same picture it was more back (2 o'clock angle) rather than side and a/c was flying from left to right.

 

[M8R]

Mani2020 there is a lot of difference between kill device and tracking device otherwise you would see Turk's complaining even if Turk's can live with Tracking devices in their F-16's then why can't we?Just don't use these F-16's for nuclear weapons and there is no problem.

 

[M8R]

Quoting Krused from other thread

^ Here is an APP picture of the three aircrafts. The single-seater is carrying the serial-number: 902. Which is a Pakistani F16 C Block 52.

Here is a higher res pic of the same aircraft.

 

[air marshal]

A high tech fighter aircraft F-16 C/D Block 52 landing at PAF Base Shahbaz.

 

[air marshal]

 

[Kompromat]

They are saying that F-16's refuled in the air - i smell KC-135 coming our way someday.

 

[air marshal]

 

[MastanKhan]

Now this will answer many people who were thinking that digital codes typo things are just joke and that are amateurish thinking on the behalf of some young childs as Mastan Khan said to me when i brought that issue few months back

Hi,

Thanks for remembering me with those kind words---it is always a pleasure---it is always a pleasure to hear from people who are in awe of me. Thankyou again-----

Hidden codes and tracking devices sealed equipment are nothing new---they had bben in a different form on our earlier F 16's as well---pak was never authorized to undo the seals on the earlier equipment either. So---as the technology advances---here are new items involved.
Now as for the kill switch---there is no such thing---no air force would accept a kill switsh---only those that have sold their souls. Now giving a source code to someone is a different issue---would the source codes ofamraams be given to india in case of comabt---I don't know---would the IFF transponder signal of the BLK 52 be given---I doubt it very much---.

The US knows very well where the F 16's are going to be used---they are not idiots---.

They will be be used as pakistan sees them fit for the occassion. The BLK 52 is for keeping the balance in power in the region---the scale was tilting too far off to one side---something had to be done---that is why the BLK 52---paf would have never ordered anything with a kill switch---. There are no kill switched on fighter aircraft---.

That is what you might have been talking about in your earlier posts about kill switches----.

Now there are active sensors / transponders and there are passive sensors transponders---active sensors / transponders are active all the time----they relay wave---they use battery power so they can be sourced about their location----passive sencors transponders are those that come active if there is an incidence---.

If they are active all the time---they can be located and found---anything that relays a signal can be located---so the sensor on that turkish plane was a ssensor that could come active when tampered.

For some of you engineers and others with any common sense know that any thing that release a signature of its presence---can be detected---if it can be detected---it can then be jammed as well.


Mani---good man---don't ride on that wave too high---do a little more research---Nowhere in that article did I read anything about a kill switch---.
The instrument in that turkish plane was something to do with tampering.

 

[Comet]

^ @ MK: Talking about AAMRAM, there is a disable switch in it, I guess. I read it somewhere that AAMRAM can deactivate if fired against friendly aircraft. Some software is built into the AAMRAM that detects if the targetting aircraft is friendly or not.

Of course, friendly means USAF and not IAF.


Edit: I missed the word "not" in "USAF and not IAF"

 

[razgriz19]

They are saying that F-16's refuled in the air - i smell KC-135 coming our way someday.

well they cant fly 13000km+ on just internal and external fuel...
i get wat u mean but i dont think PAF would buy that....f-16s radius is good enough to defend our airspace

 

[M8R]

Umairp what you are talking about is not AMRAAM But IFF sensor which does not detect NATO Aircrafts as hostile where as Indian Air Force jets unless are on NATO frequency would show up as hostile.Guys honestly you people are too much conspiriacy theorist.Unless US want nuclear war over in here it won't support either side in war.

 

[naseebkhanniazi]

thats good i just saw these jet on tv iam really happy good luck paf and good luck pakistan

 

[dbc]

I found an interesting as well as worrying thing for Pakistani fans in that interview

This will answer Mastan Khan and other people who were desprately wanting US technology and were saying that there is nothing like restrictions we can use it where ever and whenever we want


Q. One of the stories going around is that the Block 52s are coming with strings attached: (i) the PAF can only base them in one airbase, Jacobabad; (ii) they cannot be used for offensive operations beyond Pakistan’s borders; (iii) some sort of monitoring mechanisms will be put in place to monitor the location of each aircraft and (iv) PAF cannot take them outside Pakistan without the permission of the US. Are these correct?
To some extent, yes. However, it is important to understand the background to these conditions.
When the PAF asked for the Block 52, the initial US reaction was “no”. Their main concern was that if this potent technology could be released to Pakistan, sooner or later, it would end up in the hands of the Chinese who would reverse engineer it. It was the PAF that offered a solution. We could place the Block 52s in a separate airbase where the Chinese would have no access. This meant an airbase that had no Chinese aircraft. We could not base them in Sargodha because we would not deny the Chinese access to our most important airbase. Jacobabad was a forward base which had been revamped by the Americans for Operation Enduring Freedom, including a new first-class runway, so it was the first choice. The US agreed to this proposal provided that it would have the right to monitor the aircraft.

To recall an interesting little story: soon after the first F-16s were delivered to Pakistan in the mid-80s, the PLAAF Chief visited Sargodha. The Americans were there as well. As a gesture of courtesy, the PAF showed the PLAAF Chief one of the F-16s and let him sit in the cockpit. Some US technicians were there looking on. As soon as the PLAAF Chief sat in the F-16 cockpit, the first thing he did was to start measuring the HUD with his fingers, you know, when you extend your little finger and thumb to measure something? This worried the Americans.

Q. What are the monitoring mechanisms? I have heard they will have US personnel stationed at Jacobabad
The US personnel stationed at Jacobabad will be transitional. They will be training PAF aircrew on the maintenance of the Block 52. Most of these US personnel will be from Lockheed Martin. The US does not need to have personnel physically present in Jacobabad to monitor the Block 52s.

Q. Could you elaborate?
They have ways of keeping an eye on the Block 52s without being personally present. The main concern is the transfer of cutting-edge technology – the avionics and radar, the Joint Helmet Mounted Cueing System (JHMCS) the Sniper pod. They have put digital seals all the sensitive technologies, which can only be opened via a code, which only they know. If there is a malfunction or these parts need to be serviced, they will be taken out of the Block 52s and shipped back to the US for repairs/servicing. If we try to pry open these systems without the codes, inbuilt alarms will be relayed to the Americans, which will be a breach of the contract.

Q. Will the Americans be able to track the locations of the Block 52s through some sort of tracking devices hidden inside the aircraft?
If there are tracking devices then they will be inside the sealed systems, like the avionics suites or the sniper pods because we will not have the ability to look inside. If their Predator and Reaper drones are transmitting their GPS locations via satellite so can a Block 52 F-16.

Even though Turkey produces the F-16, there are some components that are manufactured in the US and only come to Turkey for the final assembly. In one incident, a Turkish Block 50 crashed and the pilot was killed. They salvaged the wreckage and laid it out in hanger and started putting together the pieces to find out the cause. They found a piece of sealed equipment which had cracked open and inside they found some device that looked like a bug. Upon inquiry, it turned out to be a tracking device.

Q. Doesn’t that worry the PAF?
I’m sure it does. However, the PAF considers the Block 52 a “bonus” aircraft.We are not depending on it for our entire air defence. It is a temporary force multiplier until we have enough squadrons of JF-17s and FC-20s. The opportunity to know what the latest technology is capable of is enough justification to purchase these aircraft.

Q. If the PAF cannot cross the border with these Block 52, what is the purpose of the Sniper pods and the air-to-ground munitions that we are getting?
Those are for use against terrorists who are waging a war against Pakistan. The fact is that the Block 52s will give us the capability to mount successful counter insurgency operations against terrorists in the tribal areas.

This interview is not of a lay man but a PAF pilot who is flyong in Turkish airforce as well as responsible for the PAF block 52+ command and have spent 450 flying hours on f-7p before transforming to an f-16 pilot
Now this will answer many people who were thinking that digital codes typo things are just joke and that are amateurish thinking on the behalf of some young childs as Mastan Khan said to me when i brought that issue few months back

you'all are so gullible it isn't even funny, you can figure out it your F-16 is "transmitting" with a 10$ piece of equipment from Radio shack

 

[MastanKhan]

^ @ MK: Talking about AAMRAM, there is a disable switch in it, I guess. I read it somewhere that AAMRAM can deactivate if fired against friendly aircraft. Some software is built into the AAMRAM that detects if the targetting aircraft is friendly or not.

Of course, friendly means USAF and IAF.

Hi,

It is known as the source code---like the ones french gave to the british agains the exocet---.

Now think about it---the U S gives the soucre code for the amraam to india---okay---which means that america is allowing the amraams sold everywhere to be neutralized by indian air force---secondly---what if the source codes are somehow sold by or just given to the russians---the whole of american air to air missile system may be neutralized---.

If the russians get their hands on one source code----they can find the standard that they are based upon----you computer nerds will know more than me---.

PEOPLE NEED TO UNDERSTAND SOMETHING---THE U S WILL NEVER LET ITS EQUIPMENT FAIL AGAINST THE RUSSIAN EQUIPMENT---ANYTIME ANYWHERE---under no circumstances---these things don't happen just like that.

What if after the fact the pakistanis say that the american equipment performed inferior to he russian----their were no source codes involved---america is lying to hide its inferior stuff---inj actual war the russian equipment was superior to american----so damned if the americans provide proof about source codes and damned if they don't.

Pakistan is a testing ground for american equipment agains the russian equipment without america going to war with russia---this is their test ground---actual test ground---pakistan---if the american thought that the BLK 52, its fire control radar and the amraam could not take out the might and pride of the indian air force---they would have never sold the blk 52 and package to pakistan---they would have offered something that would---.

People need to learn how the american mind thinks and works---america will never let its equipment come second best to the russian.

Now----please don't get me wrong----be as critical to me that you can be---but if there is something that makes sense---please keep that in mind.

There is no question ever asked---that is termed as a stupid question---but some of them they get you twisted.

One last----there is nothing impossible in this world---suppose if the americans give away the source codes---then it means that for them the cource codes have become REDUNDANT---they have gone into higher and diifferent level of technology out of this world.

You know that american electrnoic warfare planes could be getting into breaking into the DATALINKING computer of the enemy aircraft while in flight----that is possibly a big big thing now---a computer system on the electronic aircraft---so high tech that it can break into the enemy aircrafts computer while flying towards each other---is it available---or is it coming---I don't know.