Pakistan F-16 Discussions 2

[GriffinsRule]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1345434440286146560

Full interview here, starts from 26:00

Sanity and reality still prevails in PAF

 

[Raider 21]

Sanity and reality still prevails in PAF

Shehzad Chaudhry knows his stuff. He was one of the pioneering F-16 pilots in PAF and has seen how far Project Falcon has come.

 

[MastanKhan]

Shehzad Chaudhry knows his stuff. He was one of the pioneering F-16 pilots in PAF and has seen how far Project Falcon has come.

Hi,

He is also a part of the F16 MAFIA---.

 

[SQ8]

Shehzad Chaudhry knows his stuff. He was one of the pioneering F-16 pilots in PAF and has seen how far Project Falcon has come.

In other words - he has the education & experience to back up his claims and hence doesn’t sound like a ranting fool.

 

[mingle]

Shehzad Chaudhry knows his stuff. He was one of the pioneering F-16 pilots in PAF and has seen how far Project Falcon has come.

Let's see about vipers we will find it very soon in month or two

 

[Mig hunter]

And here we go.. We have very short term memory.. What is the use of that fancy toy which has so many strings attached and you have always fear of not having much use of it in a prolonged war. He is referring 27 Feb operation which was just one shortie op. Just imagine a prolonged conflict and uncle Sam does its trick which is always done by her eg 99 Kargil conflict, 65 and 71. They always blocked the spares and aid.
I think it is fare to say we are more attracted toward fancy toys and gora mentality than their actual effectiveness and national resolve. What Chaudhar sab is preaching doesn't reflect the American attitude towards us. When people like him are at the helm of affair we get the exact treatment which we always got from Uncle Sam ie sanctions, suspension of military aid during critical times when we needed it the most. Can he not see what they are doing now they are passing the bill to throw you out from major non NATO ally.
It's shortsightedness and acting more like famous F 16 Mafia who can't see the bigger picture but only F 16.

 

[Tomcats]

. Can he not see what they are doing now they are passing the bill to throw you out from major non NATO ally.
It's shortsightedness and acting more like famous F 16 Mafia who can't see the bigger picture but only F 16.

Actually that bill is 2 years old, it got thrown out before while republicans were in power, its highly likely that it will too with the democrats. He probably does see the bigger picture, hence why he is being realistic about it, JF17 alone will not win a war nor did it win 27th Feb. The Americans could've considered the usage a breach but did not which shows their attitude at least during that time. If a war does break out Pakistan will use those F-16s when it's life is on the line and the Americans know this.

 

[Windjammer]

 

[FuturePAF]

Looks like Republicans are on the verge of losing the senate. I don’t expect this bill to come back, but it also means a Democrat controlled congress will make it harder to secure the F-16 Block 72 sale. Pakistan previously procured F-16s under Republican presidents; Reagan and Bush Jr.

So this maybe the end of the F-16 Saga and the start of the J-10 era in the PAF.

 

[Silicon0000]

Leaving a capability gap open exposes us to the enemy’s adventurism. If we acquire at least 18 F-16 Block 72, out of pocket, it would buy us some time to allow our other projects to develop. It’s the cheapest and psychologically most deterrence generate option via-a-vi the Indians.

Considering everything we learned from the Block 52, procuring just one squadron of Block 72, shouldn’t break the bank but check many of the boxes of our defense needs.

They would be perfect, and they may become the core of project AZM, but currently the issue is the engine.

Buying 18-24 F-16 Block 72 should be the most cost effective and deterrence maintaining Option the PAF could go for for the next 10 years, while we wait for the T-FX/Project AZM to be ready for procurement.

Once the procurement for the T-FX begins, we can start to phase out our old F-16s just like the Turks plan to do.

Again we are looking at a PROJECTwhich is 8-10 years away from fruition. Unless you are looking at getting the production plant the Turks will cater to tbeir own needs first. So add another 5 years . If the truth be told if you are willing to wait 15 years cor the Turkish project why not build your own? The last I checked the 2 biggest hurdles might have been theTurkish engine which unless it is totally indegenous could be at the whims of the provider of parts. Pakistan's dire finqncial situation will not allow it to run 2 such projects so it will either be Azm or TFX. Given tbe choice and the timelines wbat would posters choose?
A

جب تک سر پر نہ پڑے تب تک ہم نے کچھ نہیں کرنا اور جب ضرورت پڑے تو اپنی رفتار سے دنیا کو حیران کر دینا، پاکستانی ایسی ہی قوم ہے۔


That's why It's better to have no Stop-Gap solution (unless it threatened security seriously). That will lead to quick development of JF17 and AZM.

On the other hand wishes are to have 2-4 Block 70/72 sq. plus lots of oldies from around the world with V-upgrades.

 

[Yasser76]

Looks like Republicans are on the verge of losing the senate. I don’t expect this bill to come back, but it also means a Democrat controlled congress will make it harder to secure the F-16 Block 72 sale. Pakistan previously procured F-16s under Republican presidents; Reagan and Bush Jr.

So this maybe the end of the F-16 Saga and the start of the J-10 era in the PAF.

There seems to be some weird historical linkage that implies GOP is more pro Pak than Dems. Closer examination will show that while Reagan and Bush were, it also shows that Bush Snr was the one who slapped arms embargo on Pak in 90s and Carter (Dem) was first to offer Pak weapons in late 70s. Clinton (Dem) did much to help release funds and some weapons held up by Pressler.

The three leading members (including chairperson) of the Pakistan Caucus in Congress are Dems.

Lugar-Kerry Bill was made by Dems

The two most sympathetic senior members of Congress were Kerry and Biden. Both Dems.

US acts in it's interests irrespective of what party is in power

 

[CHI RULES]

Leaving a capability gap open exposes us to the enemy’s adventurism. If we acquire at least 18 F-16 Block 72, out of pocket, it would buy us some time to allow our other projects to develop. It’s the cheapest and psychologically most deterrence generate option via-a-vi the Indians.

Considering everything we learned from the Block 52, procuring just one squadron of Block 72, shouldn’t break the bank but check many of the boxes of our defense needs.

Sir more cost effective way perhaps shall be to get V upgrade for existing two squadrons of F16 instead of going for new Block 72 squadron.

On other side PAF also has fairly large number of old jets which though due to PAF strategy and tactics are still relevant yet may lose their relevance in full scale war where qualitative platforms in large numbers do matter. If even want to use Mirage V for longer time even then there are 110+ app F7P/pg Mirage III required to be replaced.

 

[FuturePAF]

Sir more cost effective way perhaps shall be to get V upgrade for existing two squadrons of F16 instead of going for new Block 72 squadron.

On other side PAF also has fairly large number of old jets which though due to PAF strategy and tactics are still relevant yet may lose their relevance in full scale war where qualitative platforms in large numbers do matter. If even want to use Mirage V for longer time even then there are 110+ app F7P/pg Mirage III required to be replaced.

That would be fine too, but approval to get the upgrade would be the same as getting the approval to buy new planes. Cost would obviously be less to just do the upgrade, but if they are ok selling the upgrade kit, they would want us to buy new planes. Either way, the balls in Biden and US Congress’ hands.

There seems to be some weird historical linkage that implies GOP is more pro Pak than Dems. Closer examination will show that while Reagan and Bush were, it also shows that Bush Snr was the one who slapped arms embargo on Pak in 90s and Carter (Dem) was first to offer Pak weapons in late 70s. Clinton (Dem) did much to help release funds and some weapons held up by Pressler.

The three leading members (including chairperson) of the Pakistan Caucus in Congress are Dems.

Lugar-Kerry Bill was made by Dems

The two most sympathetic senior members of Congress were Kerry and Biden. Both Dems.

US acts in it's interests irrespective of what party is in power

The Dems are also anti-arms sales, so we have to look at which party of was in control of either or both houses of Congress when these arms sales were made.

Having said that, yes the Dems are more sympathetic in giving aid, but they are the party that attaches the most strings; look at the millions for a gender program in the recent US spending bill.

 

[GriffinsRule]

This bill is dead on arrival and introduced by a pro-indian congressman. Doesn't mean it will garner any support or traction

 

[mingle]

This bill is dead on arrival and introduced by a pro-indian congressman. Doesn't mean it will garner any support or traction

These are private members bills anyone can introduce it to pass it needs majority. US will keep pak on her side no matter what so pak has same wish otherway around