Pakistan F-16 Discussions 2

[baqai]

A fighter squadron from Masroor is to be transferred to Bholari shortly.

and they will be replaced with?

I was under the impression Masroor didn't have F-16s. Bholari already has F-16s.

Maybe one of the Delta's or JF-17's being transferred, not sure if Masroor still has F-7's or not

 

[Trailer23]

That's the main reason I uploaded this picture, I am not sure myself if they can carry Aim120 or not..

Up until you mentioned it, it had never crossed my mind.

Well, after going through various footage that I have (News/Music) and the images - its pretty clear they carry only Aim-9 (Sidewinders).

 

[TheTallGuy]

Up until you mentioned it, it had never crossed my mind.

Well, after going through various footage that I have (News/Music) and the images - its pretty clear they carry only Aim-9 (Sidewinders).

They ADF variant has APG66 Radar which was mated with early AIM120B versions. since we have AIM-120C5 which is advanced many fold put AMRAAM on ADF and utilize it not to full envelope does not make sense. These are the oldest of F-16s and are not upgraded to MLU status like others that PAF have. with No.9 Sqn & No.11 Sqn/No.29 Sqn

That is why No.19 Sqn is Effectively an OCU sqn

informative read
http://www.f-16.net/f-16_users_article11.html
"
The agreement consisted of two lease contracts and a Letter of Offer and Acceptance (LoA). The first lease was a no-cost lease for Jordan, covering 13 aircraft (12 A models and 1 B model, block 15 OCU's that were modified into ADF(Air Defense Fighters) versions. Under the Arms Export Control Act, the DOD was able to provide these aircraft at a no-cost lease because they had flown off over 75 percent of their life (i.e. more than 3,000 hour). Three of the B-model aircraft still had more than 25 percent of their life left and they fall under the second $4.5 million lease. Both leases cover a 5 year period. The LOA is for $215 million, covering all costs associated with upgrading those aircraft, doing the structural modifications to them, the engine upgrades, providing the support equipment, the logistics, the training.

The aircraft, all of which have flown previously by active Air Force and Air National Guard units, had been in storage for at least a year at the Aerospace Maintenance and Regeneration Center (AMARC) at Davis Monthan AFB, Tucson, Arizona before they were shipped to Hill AFB, Utah. There the Aircraft Directorate personnel from the Ogden Air Logistics Center performed structural upgrades to extend aircraft life from the designed 4,000 to 8,000 hours flying time as part of the Falcon-Up/Service Life Improvement program. They also modified the aircraft engine bay to accept the upgraded Pratt and Whitney F100-220E engine. New ground was broken with this Foreign military Sales program: taking 'used' F-16s from the desert (AMARC), completely refurbishing and modifying them and delivering the aircraft to the customer within a 17-month time frame."

Mid-life Update
For a number of years the Royal Jordanian AF recognized the need to give the leased aircraft a mid-life update in the next 2 or 3 years. It was unclear for a long time whether reference was made to the MLU-program, or just to updates in general.

In January of 2004 however a LOA for an $87 million contract was signed between Jordan and Lockheed-Martin for the update of the 17 Peace Falcon II aircraft. This modification consists of enhancements to the cockpit, avionics, sensors and weapons. These upgrades also improve system reliability and supportability. Together with this upgrade this package also includes Falcon UP and Falcon STAR structural upgrades. These structural upgrades will extend the service life to 8,000 flight hours with these aircraft being able to remain in service for another 20 years. The upgrades will be performed by Turkish Aerospace Industries in its Ankara fascilities

Armament and Stores
Main armament of the RJAF F-16s is the AIM-9 Sidewinder, although the RJAF was hoping to acquire the AIM-120AMRAAM for a long time. On November 24th, 2004 a deal was announced in which Jordan would receive up to 50 AIM-120C missiles and associated equipment in a deal worth $39 million..

These 50 AIM-120C were for MLU upgraded F-16s that RJAF purchased from Europe.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So conclusion is These are not the one we got we got PEACE FALCON 1 aircraft. so they are only able to utilize AIM-9L/Ms

Now understand why recently they (IAF) had a offensive sortie in south few weeks ago.

 

[Talon]

I hope they aren’t Minhasians, hopefully bandits

Move the only JF-17 squadron posted there? Impossible.I believe it will be a Mirage Squadron either from Rafiqui or Masroor, though not seeing it happening in immediate future

Up until you mentioned it, it had never crossed my mind.

Well, after going through various footage that I have (News/Music) and the images - its pretty clear they carry only Aim-9 (Sidewinders).

Yeah probably

Night Vision.. Repost from Facebook (Ace of Paf)

 

[araz]

I have a feeling our AIM-120Cs are not compatible with the ADFs fire control system. If someone has a picture of PAF ADF's with AMRAAM do share because I don't think I've seen them.


Umm I raised this point because I have previously said the same thing on this forum: ADF can fire AMRAAM. They were designed to carry 6 BVR missiles for Air National Guard. But..its questionable if they can fire the AIM-120C due to the old radar. I have yet to see a PAF ADF with an AIM-120C.

Interesting. Thank you for the update. I was under the impression they could fire AMRAAMS but did not realize it would be Bs only. Another thought why and how to upgrade them? Response will be appreciated?
A

 

[Viper27]

Interesting. Thank you for the update. I was under the impression they could fire AMRAAMS but did not realize it would be Bs only. Another thought why and how to upgrade them? Response will be appreciated?
A

When Windjammer used to be around there was a brief discussion on this. I did some research and concluded that our ADFs can carry AMRAAMs. I later looked into it a few days ago and realised that the Jordanian F-16s we operate are the basic ADF versions whose avionics did not go through any upgrade (unlike Jordan's current fleet). The APG radars on the F-16ADFs can carry AIM-120s (older versions) and Sparrows. They can carry six AMRAAMs. But they are not configured for AIM-120C. I am not sure if our old sparrow missiles are still in storage or have been disposed off.

We can either get older AIM-120Bs and use them with the ADF or upgrade the radars for AIM-120C.

 

[Yasser76]

Best solution here is to mix up all the A/B fleet and distribute evenly amogst 9, 11, 18 and 19 sqd and give 19 Sqd some MLUs, then all Sqds can just use the ADFs for routine tasks/training etc.

 

[Tipu7]

That's the main reason I uploaded this picture, I am not sure myself if they can carry Aim120 or not..

No they cannot. From combat perspective, these fighters are primarily meant for point air defense role.

A fighter squadron from Masroor is to be transferred to Bholari shortly.

Mirages!

I agree with you but as I mentioned the name has nothing to do with deployments, maybe because of its location/geography or maybe in future it will host some serious stuff? Idk I didn't give it this name but it sure does gets mentioned in some circles..

Geography, and soon due to infrastructure development. Unlike other bases, this base is isolated from population centers, is located at a strategic spot and will be primarily meant to counter all types of threats (aerial +armor) emerging from South and South West India. A well developed Bholari means that Masroor can be focussed more towards Maritime roles.

 

[Viper27]

Geography, and soon due to infrastructure development. Unlike other bases, this base is isolated from population centers, is located at a strategic spot and will be primarily meant to counter all types of threats (aerial +armor) emerging from South and South West India. A well developed Bholari means that Masroor can be focussed more towards Maritime roles.

In that case the ADFs need to be upgraded or some AIM-120Bs should be purchased.

 

[AMRAAM]

A fighter squadron from Masroor is to be transferred to Bholari shortly.

And a new sqn is going to be raised at masroor with JF-17Bs?

 

[TheTallGuy]

In that case the ADFs need to be upgraded or some AIM-120Bs should be purchased.

There is no option except to get them upgraded via MLU status. AIM-120B are out of production since long and i think they are out of service as well.

 

[Viper27]

There is no option except to get them upgraded via MLU status. AIM-120B are out of production since long and i think they are out of service as well.

MLU is the best option. Second best might be to search for some older AMRAAMs. Not sure if all Bs are out of service.

 

[TsAr]

I was under the impression Masroor didn't have F-16s. Bholari already has F-16s.

Masroor does not have F-16

 

[airomerix]

I was under the impression Masroor didn't have F-16s. Bholari already has F-16s.

I hope they aren’t Minhasians, hopefully bandits

and they will be replaced with?



Maybe one of the Delta's or JF-17's being transferred, not sure if Masroor still has F-7's or not

And a new sqn is going to be raised at masroor with JF-17Bs?

No. 2 Squadron is staying in Karachi. It is getting additional aircraft, potentially making it the biggest fighter squadron by fleet numbers (almost equivalent to 2 full-strength squadrons).

No. 7 sqn and No.22 sqn will go through some interchanging of assets and a Mirage sqn is expected to be shifted to Bholari. They will pose as a threat to IAF bases on the other side of the border and deter army movements.

A new squadron of AWACS is being raised at Bholari that will operate SAAB 2000's. and cover southern command and other bases in the center.

Minhasians? Aren't the fighter sqns in Karachi are specialized on sea operations?

Slightly true.

Technically PAF does not have specialized pilots per say. Squadron roles can change anytime. People make up a squadron. And people can be moved around or retrained to suit needs. That's not a challenge.

 

[StormBreaker]

No. 2 Squadron is staying in Karachi. It is getting additional aircraft, potentially making it the biggest fighter squadron by fleet numbers (almost equivalent to 2 full-strength squadrons).

No. 7 sqn and No.22 sqn will go through some interchanging of assets and a Mirage sqn is expected to be shifted to Bholari. They will pose as a threat to IAF bases on the other side of the border and deter army movements.

A new squadron of AWACS is being raised at Bholari that will operate SAAB 2000's. and cover southern command and other bases in the center.



Slightly true.

Technically PAF does not have specialized pilots per say. Squadron roles can change anytime. People make up a squadron. And people can be moved around or retrained to suit needs. That's not a challenge.

What’s going on with No.2 if it is OK to say here ?

I mean like are the Bravos finally getting their spot along with Singles ? Or a surprise ?