Pakistan F-16 Discussions 2

[untitled]

Even on target drones as mentioned earlier by a poster you dont use established AAMs but try out newer missiles during testing.

Unless you are a country that makes its own missiles and thus always has spare missiles for live training. Live training has its benefits if you can afford it

 

[Talon]

Thank You Brother, for the confirmation and helpful insight. Really appreciated!

Now could you tell us, how a modern day AESA radar reacts to jamming?

Please keep in mind, picking up the aircraft isn't the main issue.. unable to get a lock on the aircraft is the problem

 

[araz]

A mistake that Pakistani aviation geeks will keep quoting till eternity..

So did I do something wrong? Just because an event is not mentioned does not mean it did not occur.
A

 

[Talon]

So did I do something wrong? Just because an event is not mentioned does not mean it did not occur.
A

No sir you got me wrong.. the said event is mentioned too much

 

[CriticalThought]

1) Diagnostic kits?
2) Inspection is carried out after specified time intervals, just like aircrafts go through their A,B,C,D checks.
3) Some parts, irrespective of their condition, after "X" yrs in storage, are either re-furbished, or replaced.

Those measures can increase confidence, but the proof is in the pudding. It is extremely risky to have weapons that have not been used at all. Having said that, I will defer to the professionals.

Theoretically possible only on paper, given today's AESA tech, highly improbable.
Besides, what is missed by ground based radars, will be detected by AWACS/ CAP's via their Radar/ FLIR / IRST.

AESA can form multiple beams, but it is still not an X-Ray machine. If you have a physical object between yourself and the radar, you are hidden.

Mission planning in 5th gen warfare is a matter of information warfare. Knowing the number of ground radars and aerial threats is crucial. Given this, the software can either compute a trajectory, in which case the mission is a go, or fail to produce a result. As in anything, no plan is flawless and there is a chance of detection, in which case you engage. There is no such thing as 100% invisibility, but 5th gen tactics give you an increased survivability and mission success. Also, how you use this also matters. There is no substitute for cunning and deception.

 

[CriticalThought]

We have had an own goal in a training session between 2 mirages. One accidentally fired a missile at another. Fortunately the pilot ejected unharmed. You dont want a repeat of that in an exercise. Leave that to our neighbours. Even on target drones as mentioned earlier by a poster you dont use established AAMs but try out newer missiles during testing.
A

I think you quoted the wrong post. But I hear you. My personal opinion is that some kind of statistical quality control would be essential to determine war readiness, and it would involve actual firing of the missile. It is the reason why PAF would be willing to line up all the F-16s to refute claims of downing the plane, but wouldn't give an inventory of AMRAAMs to refute claims of AMRAAM dodgers. As always, these are my personal opinions. I always defer to professionals.

 

[Blacklight]

Those measures can increase confidence, but the proof is in the pudding. It is extremely risky to have weapons that have not been used at all. Having said that, I will defer to the professionals.

Bro, We do live tests, as well as use Captive Training missiles. With the order in 2006 for C5's, 12 Training missiles were also delivered.

Btw, we are desi people, pudding is like the Chinese soup we get in Pak, with too much corn flour, so we stick to halwas.

AESA can form multiple beams, but it is still not an X-Ray machine. If you have a physical object between yourself and the radar, you are hidden.

Depends on the molecular structure of the obfuscation being used.

Mission planning in 5th gen warfare is a matter of information warfare. Knowing the number of ground radars and aerial threats is crucial. Given this, the software can either compute a trajectory, in which case the mission is a go, or fail to produce a result. As in anything, no plan is flawless and there is a chance of detection, in which case you engage. There is no such thing as 100% invisibility, but 5th gen tactics give you an increased survivability and mission success. Also, how you use this also matters. There is no substitute for cunning and deception.

Tactics based upon latest tech, and intensive training, will yield better results. Absolutely!

 

[Blacklight]

Please keep in mind, picking up the aircraft isn't the main issue.. unable to get a lock on the aircraft is the problem

LOAL, 2 way data link, IR seeker, and ELINT Alh tackle this issue quiet well.

 

[araz]

No sir you got me wrong.. the said event is mentioned too much

No my brother. I got your post incorrectly. My apologies.
Kind regards
A

 

[Thorough Pro]

PN does live fire test every year with all types of weapons
PA does the same, and I assume PAF also does the same, but can't be 100% sure about PAF

The real missile firing you are referring to, happens during test & validation of new weapons only. PN or PA does so as & when a newly produced weapon has to be tested. Weapons in active duty arsenal are supposed to fired only when there are Abhis at receiving end.

 

[baqai]

We have had an own goal in a training session between 2 mirages. One accidentally fired a missile at another. Fortunately the pilot ejected unharmed. You dont want a repeat of that in an exercise. Leave that to our neighbours. Even on target drones as mentioned earlier by a poster you dont use established AAMs but try out newer missiles during testing.
A

just wondering what happened to the pilot who made the mistake?

 

[araz]

just wondering what happened to the pilot who made the mistake?

Lost his job.
A

 

[ghazi52]

Work hard guys & enjoy the process of learning & mastering your aircraft. Be proud of what you've accomplished so far. And its about to get better.

 

[Trailer23]

Well it looks like the US/Lockheed Martin just lost a customer due to financial issues.

Defense Secretary Delfin Lorenzana on Thursday said the Philippines is unlikely to acquire Lockheed Martin F-16 jet fighters for its multi-role fighter (MFR) program for now due to budgetary constraints.

 

[The Eagle]

Well it looks like the US/Lockheed Martin just lost a customer due to financial issues.

Defense Secretary Delfin Lorenzana on Thursday said the Philippines is unlikely to acquire Lockheed Martin F-16 jet fighters for its multi-role fighter (MFR) program for now due to budgetary constraints.

Shall we pray for them to lose couple of more customers, in an anger against uncle Sam. Similarly, how French lost $90 BN in 1 day due to Australia going for US subs.