Pakistan Constitution should make hijab compulsory: JI

[LURKER]

O yes there was! Not in Arab land maybe! But even the West excepts there was...Mother Mary is never shown without her head covered! The nuns cover their head, I wonder why?!

All the "olden time" Indian women cover their heads I wonder why?

The Jews have their own covering- Wonder why they cover if it was not there before Islam...

If you're trying to say that in ancient times Indian women used to cover their heads then i'm afraid you're wrong

 

[Hyperion]

Really? Which books did you read? How to be an ignorant? I am sure it will help you reach miles!

I studied in an all-gilrs catholic school run by nuns but nowhere did they suppress my religion are doing! In fact we were even given 1 period of Islamiat...

Talon, he is right about the Hijab bit. If you take Quran as a reference then it's not there. However, people are free to do whatever they want, the only one thing they shouldn't do, slap their version of morality on others.

 

[Dubious]

All your points are acceptable, but "decent covering" as you say can be achieved WITHOUT head covering or face covering, I think you didnt get what the cartoon says

Who describes decent? During the cavemen times, it was decent even if the women barely nothing, Roman times, it was decent for women to wear what I would call rubbish..Toga I think is what they call it. During the same times, slaves were presented naked in the market area and that was acceptable....

For a Hindu showing her stomach area while wearing a Saree is decent enough, for a Western girl showing 90% of her body is being decent...So, WHO decides decent?

For us Muslims, we signed an agreement when we said the Shahadah...We say there is no GOD worthy of Worship, yet we worship money, fashion, idols, Western lifestyle...

The shahadah also says, We live by abiding to the will of ALLAH....so HE decides what is decent for us not us. If you have a problem with that, then maybe you do not understand the Shahadah- 1st pillar of Islam then I would not expect you to understand the laws itself!

If you're trying to say that in ancient times Indian women used to cover their heads then i'm afraid you're wrong

Why do Hindu women cover their heads in mandirs/ in front of elders?

Talon, he is right about the Hijab bit. If you take Quran as a reference then it's not there. However, people are free to do whatever they want, the only one thing they shouldn't do, slap their version of morality on others.

Please read the Quran AND HADITH

Quran:

Surah An-Nur Ayat 31 and Surah Al-Ahzab ayat 59

 

[LURKER]

Why do Hindu women cover their heads in mandirs/ in front of elders?

This tradition of covering their(women's) heads (purdah system) started after the advent of Islam in India. It's not a compulsory norm to cover heads by women in temples...in sikh gurudwara it is compulsory.

 

[Hyperion]

Surah An-Nur Ayat 31
And say to the believing women that they should lower their gaze and guard their modesty that they should not display their beauty and ornaments except what (must ordinarily) appear thereof that they should draw their veils over their bosoms and not display their beauty except to their husbands, their fathers, their husband`s fathers, their sons, their husbands` sons, their brothers or their brothers` sons, or their sisters` sons, or their women, or the slaves whom their right hands possess, or male servants free of physical needs, or small children who have no sense of the shame of sex and that they should not strike their feet in order to draw attention to their hidden ornaments. And O ye Believers! turn ye all together towards Allah, that ye may attain Bliss.

Surah Al-Ahzab ayat 59
يَٰٓأَيُّهَا ٱلنَّبِىُّ قُل لِّأَزْوَٰجِكَ وَبَنَاتِكَ وَنِسَآءِ ٱلْمُؤْمِنِينَ يُدْنِينَ عَلَيْهِنَّ مِن جَلَٰبِيبِهِنَّ ۚ ذَٰلِكَ أَدْنَىٰٓ أَن يُعْرَفْنَ فَلَا يُؤْذَيْنَ ۗ وَكَانَ ٱللَّهُ غَفُورًۭا رَّحِيمًۭا
O Prophet! Tell your wives and your daughters and the women of the believers to draw their cloaks (veils) all over their bodies (i.e. screen themselves completely except the eyes or one eye to see the way). That will be better, that they should be known (as free respectable women) so as not to be annoyed. And Allah is Ever OftForgiving, Most Merciful.

Do you know the contextual history of Surah Al-Ahzab ayat 59? I've been raised by the "ultimate" religious ninja-scholars. If you need help, I can explain to you the historical context for which this particular Surah was inducted into the Quran.


Forget Hadith. Allah only gave guarantee for Quran to be valid till the day of judgement!

I understand Arabic, and I was taught Quran with relative historical context, no matter how unsavory the topic for my father to explain to a 5 year old. I'm moderate not because I don't know Islam, it is because I do, and I know Islam to it's core.

 

[Dubious]

Do you know the contextual history of Surah Al-Ahzab ayat 59? I've been raised by the "ultimate" religious ninja-scholars. If you need help, I can explain to you the historical context for which this particular Surah was inducted into the Quran.

I am more than happy to know. I do my own researches on religion. I love comparative religion..

 

[Dubious]

I understand Arabic, and I was taught Quran with relative historical context, no matter how unsavory the topic for my father to explain to a 5 year old. I'm moderate not because I don't know Islam, it is because I do, and I know Islam to it's core.

Interesting but it all depends on what you mean by moderate?!

If you knew Islam you would also know there is no such thing as a moderate Muslim because Islam is not extremist that you need to be a moderate...Islam is beautiful as it is...

 

[Hyperion]

I am more than happy to know. I do my own researches on religion. I love comparative religion..

Talon, let this by my only religious lesson on this forum. I shall never indulge again in such an activity.

First of all there is no reason to explain Surah An-Nur Ayat 31 to you, you're intelligent enough, read it over and over again, and conclude what your mind tells you, Allah will judge all by their own abilities of comprehension, however, if you still want I can highlight the parts that you need to focus on.

Now, regarding Surah Al-Ahzab ayat 59:

At the time when this particular Quranic ayat was issued, Muslims of time used to live in closed communities within walled cities.

There was no proper sanitation system @ homes of individuals, hence the need of "public" toilets. Now second thing, at the same time there were two different kind of women @ households. 1. Wives, sister, daughters 2. Keeps (whatever you want to call them) Now read the Ayat again, what does it say? About which women? When these women in the darkness of the night used to go out to the toilets, there were street-men and boys who used to annoy these women, without distinction between the two groups. Now once again read the Ayat. Did you get it? Or do I need to go into further detail with you. There is one corresponding Hadith to this Ayat, if I tell you, you'll be shocked!

Similarly, I can debunk different Hadith with you (though I only trust Quran). Don't judge me by my oh-so-open-liberal attitude, if necessary, I am fit to give a sermon!

Timing and purpose is everything in Islam, what time was an Ayat revealed and why, try to get this concept instilled in your logic processor!

 

[Dubious]

Talon, let this by my only religious lesson on this forum. I shall never indulge again in such an activity.

First of all there is no reason to explain Surah An-Nur Ayat 31 to you, you're intelligent enough, read it over and over again, and conclude what your mind tells you, Allah will judge all by their own abilities of comprehension, however, if you still want I can highlight the parts that you need to focus on.

Now, regarding Surah Al-Ahzab ayat 59:

At the time when this particular Quranic ayat was issued, Muslims of time used to live in closed communities within walled cities.

There was no proper sanitation system @ homes of individuals, hence the need of "public" toilets. Now second thing, at the same time there were two different kind of women @ households. 1. Wives, sister, daughters 2. Keeps (whatever you want to call them) Now read the Ayat again, what does it say? About which women? When these women in the darkness of the night used to go out to the toilets, there were street-men and boys who used to annoy these women, without distinction between the two groups. Now once again read the Ayat. Did you get it? Or do I need to go into further detail with you. There is one corresponding Hadith to this Ayat, if I tell you, you'll be shocked!

Similarly, I can debunk different Hadith with you (though I only trust Quran). Don't judge me by my oh-so-open-liberal attitude, if necessary, I am fit to give a sermon!

Timing and purpose is everything in Islam, what time was an Ayat revealed and why, try to get this concept instilled in your logic processor!

Thank you for your kind information. I am yet to read about this. You see, I too have read the Quran with 2 different languages as well as the English translation (as I understand English better than the other languages I know), plus I have read it with explanation and I have yet to read the explanation you have given....

You see, Tell your wives and your daughters and the women of the believers - it is not to a particular women type...You understand Arabic then you would know what I mean.

 

[Hyperion]

You see, Tell your wives and your daughters and the women of the believers - it is not to a particular women type

LOL, therein lyes the caveat. Try to understand it.

Read Islamic history, cross-reference it with "Makki" and "Madni" Ayats, and the associated timing with the cultural situation. Quran is a very progressive religion, try to understand the reasoning behind Ayats, and you'll feel free as bird!

I spent most of my life searching for truth in scripture. The only one that calms my soul is Islam. But Islam @ my level of interpretation, no wonder...... Allah granted me the IQ to see beyond the obvious

 

[Dubious]

LOL, therein lyes the caveat. Try to understand it.

Read Islamic history, cross-reference it with "Makki" and "Madni" Ayats, and the associated timing with the cultural situation. Quran is a very progressive religion, try to understand the reasoning behind Ayats, and you'll feel free as bird!

I spent most of my life searching for truth in scripture. The only one that calms my soul is Islam. But Islam @ my level of interpretation, no wonder...... Allah granted me the IQ to see beyond the obvious

Islam is for every era and every soul....It is not for a certain someone with knowledge ALONE....Yes, that certain someone might see it in 1 way and another person will see it in another way...That is no reason to fight but to sit and discuss not run away from it.

 

[Hyperion]

Islam is for every era and every soul....It is not for a certain someone with knowledge ALONE....Yes, that certain someone might see it in 1 way and another person will see it in another way...That is no reason to fight but to sit and discuss not run away from it.

Well, as I said, let it be the only good deed I do on PDF. Now all is done, I'll get back to my favorite time-kill activity, TROLL@PDF

 

[Dubious]

Al Muminin = Believers ( feminine plural )

Yudniina literally means to bring closer or to lower something, in this case the jilbab. Nowhere does the verse
says that the face should be covered. In fact, the verse is devoid of the word ‘face’. Like Shayk Albani said:
“This misinterpretation is contrary to the basic meaning of the word in Arabic which is “to come close”, as is
mentioned in authoritative dictionaries like al-Mufradaat by the well-known scholar, ar-Raaghib al-Asbahaanee.”

The ayah quoted from Surah Al-Ahzab only directs Muslim women to put some outer garment over their clothes,
and to draw it close around them.

If you have done your research then you would know WHEN the verse is for a certain time and WHEN it is for EVERYONE and WHEN it is for that time alone...

 

[Hyperion]

Al Muminin = Believers ( feminine plural )

Yudniina literally means to bring closer or to lower something, in this case the jilbab. Nowhere does the verse
says that the face should be covered. In fact, the verse is devoid of the word ‘face’. Like Shayk Albani said:
“This misinterpretation is contrary to the basic meaning of the word in Arabic which is “to come close”, as is
mentioned in authoritative dictionaries like al-Mufradaat by the well-known scholar, ar-Raaghib al-Asbahaanee.”

The ayah quoted from Surah Al-Ahzab only directs Muslim women to put some outer garment over their clothes,
and to draw it close around them.

If you have done your research then you would know WHEN the verse is for a certain time and WHEN it is for EVERYONE and WHEN it is for that time alone...

Talon. Sis. If that is what you comprehend, then no problem. Everyone makes their own heaven. You'll have yours, I may also be granted a whiff, maybe.......
Let's leave it at that.

 

[Dubious]

Talon. Sis. If that is what you comprehend, then no problem. Everyone makes their own heaven. You'll have yours, I may also be granted a whiff, maybe.......
Let's leave it at that.

As you wish. I am not sure why people do not finish a discussion...But I am not going to impose my views on you. However, these are not mine but of a scholar and I did not wish to impose but meant to discuss because this is my understanding and yours is VERY much different...