Pakistan conducted successful flight test of Air Launched Cruise Missile “Ra’ad-II”.

[FuturePAF]

I see jf17b more viable option for Raad¹¹.

Especially if the JF-17 engine upgrade comes through soon; Higher TWR and strengthened wings should help compensate for the heavier load.

 

[Ultima Thule]

Especially if the JF-17 engine upgrade comes through soon; Higher TWR and strengthened wings should help compensate for the heavier load.

You mean Block-3 sir?

 

[blain2]

enjoy ....

https://twitter.com/x/status/1229874442895003651

Its going to light up Gagan sahib's neighborhood all the same (regardless of it being Pak-Cheeni maal).

 

[Signalian]

Receiving mid-course updates about waypoints means there is no way for the enemy to extract the final destination from mission computers if the missile is captured intact. Coupled with unpredictable route and numerous possible enemy targets, enemy planners will certainly loose sleep over Raad II.

Negotiating way-points doesnt carry deviation of 50 km or 100 km, that enemy will not be able to determine Ra'ad's Target if it gets detected, thus high probability is there that enemy will get to know Ra'ad's target during mid-course as it will have its trajectory vectoring towards the target. The way points could be introduced for the ALCM to stay at edges of SAM radar coverage or blind spots of radar coverage and the launch platform will fire it as such from acceptable altitude and range.

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

Ra'ad-II cruise missile can hit Delhi from deep inside Pakistan: Report
Ra'ad-II reportedly features design changes, allowing more types of jets to carry it

Web Desk February 19, 2020 13:37 IST

Screengrab of Ra'ad-II missile being launched from a Mirage-III/V fighter

Pakistan on Tuesday announced it had conducted a successful test of an air-launched cruise missile called the Ra'ad-II. The Inter Services Public Relations, the PR wing of the Pakistan military, released a statement on the Ra'ad-II test, noting that the weapon had a range of 600km. The Ra'ad-II cruise missile is a modernised version of the Ra'ad-I missile, which Pakistan first test-fired in 2007 and was claimed to have a range of 350km.

The Ra'ad-II was first unveiled at a military parade in 2017.

ISPR also shared a video of the Ra'ad-II cruise missile being launched off a French-built Mirage III/V fighter. The aircraft, which Pakistan has operated for over 50 years, was also used in testing the earlier Ra'ad-I missile. Interestingly, the Mirage-III/V jet was the aircraft Pakistan claimed to have used when it attempted to bomb an Indian Army facility on February 27 last year in retaliation for the Balakot air strike.

Defence News, a reputed defence website, on Tuesday, analysed the video footage of the Ra'ad-II test and speculated that the missile had been "entirely redesigned with a new intake and control surfaces".

The original Ra'ad-I missile had a 'twin tail' configuration, "but the Ra'ad-II appears to have adopted a more compact 'X' configuration layout", Defence News reported. This would enable it to be carried on more aircraft, such as the JF-17 fighter, jointly developed by Pakistan and China. Pakistan has built more than 100 JF-17 jets and the type will be the mainstay of the Pakistan Air Force.

Quwa, a Pakistani website covering Islamabad's military, claimed the design changes may have made the Ra'ad-II missile lighter, conceivably enabling it to be carried under the wings of the JF-17.

Defence News also speculated that the "range increase would allow the missile to launch well within Pakistan’s territory while being able to hit critical targets within India—New Delhi is roughly 430 kilometers from Lahore.."

The publication observed Pakistan's need for longer-range weapons has increased as India prepares to receive the Russian S-400 air defence system. Last week, the Donald Trump administration cleared the possible sale of a medium-range air defence missile system to India, which can shoot down targets such as aircraft and cruise missiles.

Defence News quoted Mansoor Ahmed, a Pakistan strategic analyst, as saying the Ra'ad-II was "Pakistan’s answer to India’s development of the Nirbhay cruise missile". Pakistan's ability to hit targets in India has been largely limited to its fleet of ballistic missiles, the use of which could be considered a massive escalation in the event of even a non-nuclear conflict.

Moreover, cruise missiles, which fly in the atmosphere like an jet airplane, are more accurate than ballistic missiles in hitting ground targets.

https://www.theweek.in/news/world/2...t-delhi-from-deep-inside-pakistan-report.html

Fire from Lahore to hit Delhi!!! Historically speaking, Delhi's security lies in ruling over Lahore...

 

[Mrc]

enjoy ....

https://twitter.com/x/status/1229874442895003651

Warhead yield can be from sub kiloton to a 100 kilo tones ... what a moron...

Explosion is from left over fuel as dummy warhead does not explode

 

[FuturePAF]

You mean Block-3 sir?

Separate from Block 3.

The Chinese are developing a much more powerful engine, which will be a game changer. The JF-17 with the higher Thrust to Weight Ratio will be able to perform nearly as well as the latest F-16.

Current Max Thrust on the JF-17's RD-93 is 85.3 KN (19,200 lb)
The Engine being developed is expected to reach nearly 100 kn as mentioned in the following link.
http://www.jf-17.com/engine/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CAC/PAC_JF-17_Thunder#Specifications_(JF-17_Block_2)

Eventually the goal is for the Engine to reach the Thrust of GE-414 highest thrust variant at 116 KN
For reference the PAF F-16s have a max thrust of 129.7 KN (29,160 lb)

F-16 Block 52 has a Thrust to weight of 1.095 (1.24 with loaded weight & 50% internal fuel);
Thrust (28,600 lb) / Loaded weight with 50% internal fuel (23,000 lb)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gener...ing_Falcon#Specifications_(F-16C_Block_50/52)

If the JF-17 was in the same configuration (references from PAC: https://www.pac.org.pk/jf-17)
Empty weight is 14,520 lb, 50% internal fuel would be 2565 lb, 2 SD-10 and 2 PL-9 would be approx. 1300 lb. = 18,385 lb.

With the current engine at full afterburner (max thrust) Thrust to weight ratio would be 1.044, with the 100 kn engine it would be 1.22, and if reaching the GE414 level of 116 kn; TWR would be 1.41.
Realistically the plane would not be fly with just 2 BVR missiles and 2 WVR missiles and half a tank of gas.
Max takeoff weight for the current configuration of the JF-17 is 27,300 lb; and at the GE414 level, TWR would be 0.95

If the JF-17 design could shave off some weight in the Block III design TWR could be at or even greater than 1.0 and still be able to carry the 3400 lb of weapons and external pods, allowing the plane to maintain maneuverability and nearly the full range of its flight envelope despite all the weapons and fuel it is carry.

Perhaps even with the more efficient engine, the plane could super cruise and have nearly the same range as the F-16.

Negotiating way-points doesnt carry deviation of 50 km or 100 km, that enemy will not be able to determine Ra'ad's Target if it gets detected, thus high probability is there that enemy will get to know Ra'ad's target during mid-course as it will have its trajectory vectoring towards the target. The way points could be introduced for the ALCM to stay at edges of SAM radar coverage or blind spots of radar coverage and the launch platform will fire it as such from acceptable altitude and range.

The Design will need to be refined to reduce its RCS, IR, Audio, and Electromagnetic Signatures similar to the MBDA designs. the missile could also be escorted by Jammer variants of the same cruise missile similar to the MALD-J concept. A few MALD-J escorting a large SALVO of RA'AD II to Delhi on a few low probability of intercept courses get through all the way through if there is a lot of confusion in the Indian C4ISR.; Cyber Attacks, EM clutter along the border, and potential mass hysteria through PSYOPS.

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

A few MALD-J escorting a large SALVO of RA'AD II to Delhi on a few low probability of intercept courses get through all the way through if there is a lot of confusion in the Indian C4ISR.; Cyber Attacks, EM clutter along the border, and potential mass hysteria through PSYOPS.

You’ve almost re-enacted Panipat IV!!! The climax would be the be-heading of Modi/Shah/Doval/Yogi etc....

 

[Pakistani Fighter]

Separate from Block 3.

The Chinese are developing a much more powerful engine, which will be a game changer. The JF-17 with the higher Thrust to Weight Ratio will be able to perform nearly as well as the latest F-16.

Current Max Thrust on the JF-17's RD-93 is 85.3 KN (19,200 lb)
The Engine being developed is expected to reach nearly 100 kn as mentioned in the following link.
http://www.jf-17.com/engine/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CAC/PAC_JF-17_Thunder#Specifications_(JF-17_Block_2)

Eventually the goal is for the Engine to reach the Thrust of GE-414 highest thrust variant at 116 KN
For reference the PAF F-16s have a max thrust of 129.7 KN (29,160 lb)

F-16 Block 52 has a Thrust to weight of 1.095 (1.24 with loaded weight & 50% internal fuel);
Thrust (28,600 lb) / Loaded weight with 50% internal fuel (23,000 lb)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gener...ing_Falcon#Specifications_(F-16C_Block_50/52)

If the JF-17 was in the same configuration (references from PAC: https://www.pac.org.pk/jf-17)
Empty weight is 14,520 lb, 50% internal fuel would be 2565 lb, 2 SD-10 and 2 PL-9 would be approx. 1300 lb. = 18,385 lb.

With the current engine at full afterburner (max thrust) Thrust to weight ratio would be 1.044, with the 100 kn engine it would be 1.22, and if reaching the GE414 level of 116 kn; TWR would be 1.41.
Realistically the plane would not be fly with just 2 BVR missiles and 2 WVR missiles and half a tank of gas.
Max takeoff weight for the current configuration of the JF-17 is 27,300 lb; and at the GE414 level, TWR would be 0.95

If the JF-17 design could shave off some weight in the Block III design TWR could be at or even greater than 1.0 and still be able to carry the 3400 lb of weapons and external pods, allowing the plane to maintain maneuverability and nearly the full range of its flight envelope despite all the weapons and fuel it is carry.

Perhaps even with the more efficient engine, the plane could super cruise and have nearly the same range as the F-16.



The Design will need to be refined to reduce its RCS, IR, Audio, and Electromagnetic Signatures similar to the MBDA designs. the missile could also be escorted by Jammer variants of the same cruise missile similar to the MALD-J concept. A few MALD-J escorting a large SALVO of RA'AD II to Delhi on a few low probability of intercept courses get through all the way through if there is a lot of confusion in the Indian C4ISR.; Cyber Attacks, EM clutter along the border, and potential mass hysteria through PSYOPS.

Why don't we use composites to decrease the mass of the plane?

 

[FuturePAF]

Why don't we use composites to decrease the mass of the plane?

We do use some, but not as much as other 4th gen fighter use, due to costs. Block 3 is expected to use more composites than Block 2, and so performance should improve. when the 100 kn engine is used, Performance should also improve noticeably (17% increase in thrust could allow the carriage of two Ra'ad Missiles as each missile weighs around 2425 lb).

 

[ARMalik]

Lots of members mentioned Raad-2 being used against S-400. Why can't the PAF not use its Anti-Radiation missiles against S-400 instead?

 

[Shabi1]

Lots of members mentioned Raad-2 being used against S-400. Why can't the PAF not use its Anti-Radiation missiles against S-400 instead?

Yes but Raad 2 has longer range, so gives more standoff range and safety.

Also CM-400AKG which is better than Israels Rampage missiles (their answer to S300/400) seem even better options.

 

[CriticalThought]

Negotiating way-points doesnt carry deviation of 50 km or 100 km, that enemy will not be able to determine Ra'ad's Target if it gets detected, thus high probability is there that enemy will get to know Ra'ad's target during mid-course as it will have its trajectory vectoring towards the target. The way points could be introduced for the ALCM to stay at edges of SAM radar coverage or blind spots of radar coverage and the launch platform will fire it as such from acceptable altitude and range.

There is no set rule book which limits mission planning for a cruise missile. The classical literature has been shaped by the technical limitations of past decades. Ultra long endurance and mid-course corrections open up an entirely new set of possibilities which bring entirely new headaches for the enemy.

 

[Khanivore]

One good way to burn up an S-400 battery would be to send in a wave of Baburs and Ra'ads. Any major SAM threat could be exhausted using similar strategy followed by volley of loitering munitions that could search, ID and kill anything emitting radiation or thermal heat.

 

[ziaulislam]

Lots of members mentioned Raad-2 being used against S-400. Why can't the PAF not use its Anti-Radiation missiles against S-400 instead?

Because the memebers over estimates the range of s400
Its common range is ~100km not the 200-300km often quoted
Raad will never be used for that purpose