Pakistan: Christian women are considered the booty of war
- Thread starter Veeru
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What I fail to understand is how a few words by non-Muslims that are considered "blasphemy" requires them to be killed.
Now, if someone says something bad about our beloved Prophet (S.A.W.), does that become reality?
In Islam, if you see something wrong, you stop it by your hand. Now, does that mean we go on a killing spree and kill everyone who has spoken against the Prophet (S.A.W.)? If you cannot stop it by hand, stop it by your tongue; meaning prove it wrong instead of spreading baseless fataawa. If you cannot stop it by your tongue, which is usually not that case, forbid it in your heart (something we can all do).
Now, if someone says something bad about our beloved Prophet (S.A.W.), does that become reality?
In Islam, if you see something wrong, you stop it by your hand. Now, does that mean we go on a killing spree and kill everyone who has spoken against the Prophet (S.A.W.)? If you cannot stop it by hand, stop it by your tongue; meaning prove it wrong instead of spreading baseless fataawa. If you cannot stop it by your tongue, which is usually not that case, forbid it in your heart (something we can all do).
Durran3
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What if Humans started looking at other humans as Humans first rather than an object of Faith? What if other humans started looking at another human in a way that resembles him or her self biologically like how the blood flows in both their veins and how both have to chew their food to eat it... rather than object of faith? What if humans saw other humans as that who has the same basic needs both psychologically and physiologically rather than as an object of faith? What if humans saw other humans as wanting things that are in fact quite similar to what you want..... what if Humans started looking at other humans as Individuals with the same characteristics as yourself or is that something REALLY REALLY Hard to do?
Ganguly
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Thank you Paladin. It reminds me that we here in Khyber Pukhtunkhwa/NWFP have large number of Christians and if anyone knows cantonment Peshawar we have a Mosque and Church along side adjacent to each other here its such a fine example you will not find anywhere else.
And on every Christmas Peshawar PTV center prepares programs which are broadcast round Pakistan on all centers of PTV.
we have a large number of Christian singers and artists who are respected alot besides a large number of nurses from this community.
Who told you. Just google it, you will find several such instatnces. One such link is : Clear Lake church, mosque live side by side in peace | Religion | Chron.com - Houston Chronicle
Awesome
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How can you let them? Are you asking me how, or you're just saying its unbelievable for you?
1. You just let them. They can believe and proclaim their faith to be anything as they please.
2. Freedom demands that they be allowed to discredit, undermine and even if wanted to try to convert everyone from Islam to their religion. Or perhaps as you've put it, even be allowed to betray and confuse everyone into thinking their religion is the real Islam. They should be free to do so.
I will not make a low to stop him from saying that. I will say "No buddy you're wrong, because of this, this and this fact". I will make my argument better than his argument. That way my people won't be confused and betrayed and start following him like zombies.
Give some credit to the people, they aren't as dumb as you make them out to be.
You do realize that they are the ones that face death, imprisonment, they are cheated out of jobs, they have to hide who they are because neighbors won't treat them right, they are the ones who are being attacked and live in constant fear? Why? Because statements like that encourage people to hate them and fear them.
Nothing should be intolerable. Intolerance has been the scourge on Pakistan that has given rise to extremism, hatred and disunity in Pakistan. Every Pakistan should be equal in the eyes of the law, the state and all institutions. In fact anything or anyone that treats people differently based on their "religion, caste or creed" should be considered anti-Pakistani - our own founder, Quaid-e-Azam had commanded us so.
Then continue to have faith in that religion.
Even with your way you have managed to attack Islam from within. If its not this ideology then there will be something else that you will find intolerable and pick up a newspaper, and you can see what this "fitna" of intolerance has done to Pakistan.
Hardline Shia's are known to speak in some awful terms about the Khulfa-e-Rashideen, thats intolerable kill them.
Sufi's go pray to saints instead of God, kill them
Christians convert Muslims, kill them.
Who is the real enemy from within? Somebody's beliefs or your intolerance?
There is no other better way of damaging Islam and promoting GAM's religion is by making your own religion seem so bad, a religion that promotes killing a religion that is intolerant to someone's beliefs, a religion who has insecure followers, a religion whose followers themselves believe that its religion won't survive unless they forcefully threaten people from believing and saying one thing over the other. You're making Islam look bad and making the Ahmedi religion seem attractive and cool.
That is a big thing you're saying, you're breaking the fundamental tenets of freedom that a human can't live without. The freedom to believe and profess their beliefs. Think about it, belief is in the mind and you're trying to enforce things in their minds.
I find it hard to believe that true Muslims for whom the finality of the prophet is clear would divert from their religion. They will divert away if you keep making it sound like a religion for crazy people though if not to this then to some other religion.
Awesome
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Generally it is not recommended to defend your arguments based on what a religion says. We here neither promote nor oppose any religion, except for the freedom to profess any faith of an individual's choosing, however they may want it.
But if you're going to quote the Quran, please mention the Surah and the Ayat together.
The reason I'm saying this is that the word Khatam-al-Nabiyyun, must be quoted which has been used as having multiple meanings, literally meaning Seal of the Prophets, can be understood as the final prophet or the certified best prophet.
Seal of approval type of thing. Hence there is room open for interpretation.
Of course having living in an Arabic country all my life I know the subtle nuances of Arabic words. Generally the Seal of approval type of usage would be done with the word Khaatim not Khatam and even Khaatim is used as something like this is the best, no more needed. So there is more weight to one argument over the other in my view. Linguistically speaking that is.
This is how you're supposed to defend Islam, protect it. Not by being abusive calling other people's revered personalities "maniacs", or calling their entire belief system a fitna (Great evil). If you are right, you should be confident in your belief and let others speak their hearts out and then you counter the argument.
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mehru
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Yes the writer is Pakistani christian and i am with him but i disagree with him completely.He is playing a victim card here. Christian women are considered war booties? Is he out of his mind. Yes there is discrimination against Christians but they are also the most powerful and the most respected minority in our country. They have a voice and they are not powerless as this guy is portraying. Blasphemy law is responsible for Muslim deaths as well.Why he didn't point this out? Why he didn't mention other Non Muslim victims like Hindus.
Truth is that the most downtrodden and the most discriminated Non Muslim minority are Hindus in our society. They are the ones who really need our help. They have no voice, no representation at all. If Hindus say this then i will believe them because they are really not respected. They are the ones who need more protection than any other minority in our country. I wish Nasir Saeed had spoken for them as well. As a Pakistani, my concern is all minorities, not just Christians.
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H2O3C4Nitrogen
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Amnesty urges release of Pakistani Christian woman
The Associated Press
Friday, November 19, 2010; 3:29 AM
ISLAMABAD -- An international human rights advocate has joined calls for the release of a Pakistani Christian woman sentenced to death under the country's blasphemy laws.
Amnesty International on Friday also called on Pakistan to revise the law under which mother of five Asia Bibi was convicted this month.
The case stems from a dispute between Bibi and a group of Muslim women over the use of a water bowl. The other women accused her of making derogatory remarks against the Prophet Muhammad. She has been in prison for one-and-a-half years and her case has been appealed.
Pope Benedict XVI on Wednesday urged Pakistan to release Bibi.
The case has drawn attention to blasphemy laws, which critics say are used to persecute Christian and other minorities.
Amnesty urges release of Pakistani Christian woman
The Associated Press
Friday, November 19, 2010; 3:29 AM
ISLAMABAD -- An international human rights advocate has joined calls for the release of a Pakistani Christian woman sentenced to death under the country's blasphemy laws.
Amnesty International on Friday also called on Pakistan to revise the law under which mother of five Asia Bibi was convicted this month.
The case stems from a dispute between Bibi and a group of Muslim women over the use of a water bowl. The other women accused her of making derogatory remarks against the Prophet Muhammad. She has been in prison for one-and-a-half years and her case has been appealed.
Pope Benedict XVI on Wednesday urged Pakistan to release Bibi.
The case has drawn attention to blasphemy laws, which critics say are used to persecute Christian and other minorities.
Amnesty urges release of Pakistani Christian woman
H2O3C4Nitrogen
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Family waits to see if mother, accused of blasphemy, will be hanged
Itan Wali, Pakistan (CNN) -- In this village in Pakistan's Punjab province a tearful 12-year-old girl ponders if the Pakistani government will soon hang her mother.
"Whenever I see her picture I cry," Isham Masih told CNN. "I want my mother back. That's what I'm praying for."
This month a Pakistani court sentenced Isham's mother, 45-year-old Asia Bibi, to death, not because she killed, injured or stole, but simply because she said something.
Prosecutors say Bibi, who is a Christian, broke Pakistan's strict blasphemy law by insulting Islam and the prophet Muhammad, a crime punishable by death or life imprisonment according to Pakistan's penal code.
The alleged incident happened in June 2009 when Bibi, a field worker, was picking fruit in a village two hours west of Lahore. Prosecutors say when Bibi dipped her cup into a bucket of drinking water during a lunch break, her co-workers complained the water had been contaminated by a non-Muslim.
Court records show the women got into a heated argument.
Mafia Satar said she was there and heard Bibi's insults.
"She said your Muhammad had worms in his mouth before he died," Satar told CNN, a crude way of saying Muhammad was no prophet.
The town cleric, Qari Muhammad Salim, reported the incident to police who arrested Bibi. After nearly 15 months in prison came her conviction and the death sentence.
"When I heard the decision my heart ached," Bibi's husband Ashiq Masih told CNN.
Masih denies his wife ever insulted Muhammad. He said death threats forced him and his daughters, one of them disabled, to flee their village.
Neither the Koran nor the prophet Muhammad's teachings in the Hadith call for the execution of blasphemers, but Islamic scholars and jurists from generations past included the death sentence when drafting Islamic law.
Human rights groups have long blamed Pakistan's blasphemy laws for persecution and violence against religious minorities like last year's attack on a Christian village in Punjab Province and recent bombings of minority Muslim mosques.
Activists say the government has refused to amend the law for fear of backlash from Islamist groups and their followers who deem scrapping the law as un-Islamic.
At the time this report was filed, Pakistan's law minister had not responded to CNN's request for an interview.
Bibi has appealed her death sentence and asked for bail, the chief prosecutor of Punjab province told CNN.
The prosecutor, Chaudhry Muhammad Jahangir, said the appeal will be heard by the Lahore High court and a decision could be months away.
Pakistan has never executed someone convicted of blasphemy but in Bibi's village public opinion was unanimous.
"Yes, she should be hanged," a group of villagers cried out.
The town cleric, who made the initial complaint against Bibi, called her death sentence one of the happiest moments of his life.
"Tears of joy poured from my eyes," Qari Salim told CNN.
The clerics tears are in stark contrast to those shed by Bibi's daughter Isham, who wants her mother to live.
Family waits to see if mother, accused of blasphemy, will be hanged - CNN.com
Itan Wali, Pakistan (CNN) -- In this village in Pakistan's Punjab province a tearful 12-year-old girl ponders if the Pakistani government will soon hang her mother.
"Whenever I see her picture I cry," Isham Masih told CNN. "I want my mother back. That's what I'm praying for."
This month a Pakistani court sentenced Isham's mother, 45-year-old Asia Bibi, to death, not because she killed, injured or stole, but simply because she said something.
Prosecutors say Bibi, who is a Christian, broke Pakistan's strict blasphemy law by insulting Islam and the prophet Muhammad, a crime punishable by death or life imprisonment according to Pakistan's penal code.
The alleged incident happened in June 2009 when Bibi, a field worker, was picking fruit in a village two hours west of Lahore. Prosecutors say when Bibi dipped her cup into a bucket of drinking water during a lunch break, her co-workers complained the water had been contaminated by a non-Muslim.
Court records show the women got into a heated argument.
Mafia Satar said she was there and heard Bibi's insults.
"She said your Muhammad had worms in his mouth before he died," Satar told CNN, a crude way of saying Muhammad was no prophet.
The town cleric, Qari Muhammad Salim, reported the incident to police who arrested Bibi. After nearly 15 months in prison came her conviction and the death sentence.
"When I heard the decision my heart ached," Bibi's husband Ashiq Masih told CNN.
Masih denies his wife ever insulted Muhammad. He said death threats forced him and his daughters, one of them disabled, to flee their village.
Neither the Koran nor the prophet Muhammad's teachings in the Hadith call for the execution of blasphemers, but Islamic scholars and jurists from generations past included the death sentence when drafting Islamic law.
Human rights groups have long blamed Pakistan's blasphemy laws for persecution and violence against religious minorities like last year's attack on a Christian village in Punjab Province and recent bombings of minority Muslim mosques.
Activists say the government has refused to amend the law for fear of backlash from Islamist groups and their followers who deem scrapping the law as un-Islamic.
At the time this report was filed, Pakistan's law minister had not responded to CNN's request for an interview.
Bibi has appealed her death sentence and asked for bail, the chief prosecutor of Punjab province told CNN.
The prosecutor, Chaudhry Muhammad Jahangir, said the appeal will be heard by the Lahore High court and a decision could be months away.
Pakistan has never executed someone convicted of blasphemy but in Bibi's village public opinion was unanimous.
"Yes, she should be hanged," a group of villagers cried out.
The town cleric, who made the initial complaint against Bibi, called her death sentence one of the happiest moments of his life.
"Tears of joy poured from my eyes," Qari Salim told CNN.
The clerics tears are in stark contrast to those shed by Bibi's daughter Isham, who wants her mother to live.
Family waits to see if mother, accused of blasphemy, will be hanged - CNN.com
H2O3C4Nitrogen
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Pope Benedict XVI calls for release of Christian sentenced to hang in Pakistan
Pope Benedict XVI has joined a growing chorus demanding the release of a Christian woman sentenced to hang in Pakistan after being convicted of blasphemy.
The Pope told his weekly public audience in the Vatican of his "spiritual closeness" to Asia Bibi, a mother of five children, who is accused of insulting the Prophet Mohammed.
Last week The Daily Telegraph revealed that she had been sentenced to death after a mob of angry villagers, spurred on by clerics, tried to attack the 45-year-old over a dispute about whether a Christian should be allowed to handle a container filled with drinking water for Muslims.
The Pope said that Christians in Pakistan often faced violence or discrimination as he called for Mrs Bibi's "full freedom".
"I pray for those who are in similar situations that their human dignity and their fundamental rights be fully respected," he said.
Supporters of Mrs Bibi said she had fetched water for other women working in fields in Punjab province, sparking a row over whether the water was still fit for Muslims to drink.
The dispute escalated a few days later, when she was accused of making derogatory remarks against the Prophet Mohammed. She has been in prison for the past one and a half years and is thought to be the first woman sentenced to death for blasphemy.
Similar convictions are usually overturned by higher courts and Mrs Bibi's family have already lodged an appeal.
However, the verdict has drawn attention to Pakistan's blasphemy laws, which human rights campaigners believe are used to persecute the country's religious minorities and to settle personal rivalries.
Although governed by a secular party, Pakistan's conservative clerics wield considerable influence and few political leaders are willing to risk their ire by repealing the blasphemy laws.
However, Shahbaz Bhatti, Pakistan's minister for minority affairs, said the government was working to reform the law so that it could not be abused.
Pope Benedict XVI calls for release of Christian sentenced to hang in Pakistan - Telegraph
Pope Benedict XVI has joined a growing chorus demanding the release of a Christian woman sentenced to hang in Pakistan after being convicted of blasphemy.
The Pope told his weekly public audience in the Vatican of his "spiritual closeness" to Asia Bibi, a mother of five children, who is accused of insulting the Prophet Mohammed.
Last week The Daily Telegraph revealed that she had been sentenced to death after a mob of angry villagers, spurred on by clerics, tried to attack the 45-year-old over a dispute about whether a Christian should be allowed to handle a container filled with drinking water for Muslims.
The Pope said that Christians in Pakistan often faced violence or discrimination as he called for Mrs Bibi's "full freedom".
"I pray for those who are in similar situations that their human dignity and their fundamental rights be fully respected," he said.
Supporters of Mrs Bibi said she had fetched water for other women working in fields in Punjab province, sparking a row over whether the water was still fit for Muslims to drink.
The dispute escalated a few days later, when she was accused of making derogatory remarks against the Prophet Mohammed. She has been in prison for the past one and a half years and is thought to be the first woman sentenced to death for blasphemy.
Similar convictions are usually overturned by higher courts and Mrs Bibi's family have already lodged an appeal.
However, the verdict has drawn attention to Pakistan's blasphemy laws, which human rights campaigners believe are used to persecute the country's religious minorities and to settle personal rivalries.
Although governed by a secular party, Pakistan's conservative clerics wield considerable influence and few political leaders are willing to risk their ire by repealing the blasphemy laws.
However, Shahbaz Bhatti, Pakistan's minister for minority affairs, said the government was working to reform the law so that it could not be abused.
Pope Benedict XVI calls for release of Christian sentenced to hang in Pakistan - Telegraph
H2O3C4Nitrogen
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Pope pleads for life of condemned Pakistani woman
The Pope has called for the release of a Pakistani Christian woman facing the death sentence on charges of blasphemy.
Pope Benedict XVI told his weekly public audience that Christians in Pakistan "are often victims of violence and discrimination".
"I feel close to Asia Bibi and her family and I ask that she be released as soon as possible," he said.
Ms Bibi is believed to be the first woman sentenced to death under Pakistan's blasphemy law.
The 45-year-old mother was sentenced to death on Friday by a court in the town of Nankana, about 75km (45 miles) from the city of Lahore in Punjab province.
She allegedly committed blasphemy after getting into an argument last year with a group of women in her village.
No-one has ever been executed under Pakistan's blasphemy law, but about 10 accused have been murdered before the completion of their trials, correspondents say.
BBC News - Pope pleads for life of condemned Pakistani woman
The Pope has called for the release of a Pakistani Christian woman facing the death sentence on charges of blasphemy.
Pope Benedict XVI told his weekly public audience that Christians in Pakistan "are often victims of violence and discrimination".
"I feel close to Asia Bibi and her family and I ask that she be released as soon as possible," he said.
Ms Bibi is believed to be the first woman sentenced to death under Pakistan's blasphemy law.
The 45-year-old mother was sentenced to death on Friday by a court in the town of Nankana, about 75km (45 miles) from the city of Lahore in Punjab province.
She allegedly committed blasphemy after getting into an argument last year with a group of women in her village.
No-one has ever been executed under Pakistan's blasphemy law, but about 10 accused have been murdered before the completion of their trials, correspondents say.
BBC News - Pope pleads for life of condemned Pakistani woman
H2O3C4Nitrogen
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CLAAS is saddened by death sentence for Christian mother-of-two in Pakistan
UK: November 18, 2010. (PCP) The Centre for Legal Aid, Assistance and Settlement (CLAAS) has received with sadness the news that Asia Bibi has been sentenced to death for blasphemy by a session court in the province of Punjab. The Christian mother-of-two, from Ittanwali, was sentenced by the court on Sunday. The news is especially regretful as CLAAS had been providing free legal aid to Asia until her husband Ashiq Masih decided to transfer her case to local Muslim solicitors who had no experience in dealing with blasphemy cases.
We believe this decision played a crucial part in the resulting ruling against Asia. Joseph Francis, director of CLAAS Pakistan, has again offered free legal assistance to Asia but cannot proceed without the consent of her family.
Our lawyers have considerable experience in blasphemy cases and most recently won the acquittal of Rubina Bibi, who had been charged with blasphemy under section 295-C of the Pakistani penal code in Pakistan, blasphemy charges carry a death sentence.
Until now, Christians sentenced to death in Pakistan have been freed by the high court and Supreme Court and we are hoping for the same outcome for Asia.
Despite this possibility, however, even Christians who have had their death sentences overturned have had to spend years in prison and, even once found innocent, are unable to lead normal lives because of fear of attack. Many have to go into hiding for years.
The Pakistani government has made no effort to reform the discriminatory laws that put the lives of Pakistans Christians at constant risk.
It is unclear how many years Asia will have to spend in jail. Even if she appeals the sentence in the high court, it may take years before her case is even heard.
Asia was charged with blasphemy by fellow field labourers after discussing her faith with them. They pressured her to convert to Islam and she and her daughters were later attacked by local Muslims.
CLAAS is extremely concerned about the sentence as it proves that the blasphemy laws are being misused with little protection or justice for victims.
Joseph Francis, director of CLAAS Pakistan, said: CLAAS was successful in securing the release of Rubina Bibi and her son. We stand ready to protect the rights of more innocent victims. Unfortunately the sentencing of Asia Bibi is yet another sign of the great danger facing Pakistans Christians. We are working for the release of Christians facing blasphemy charges, including Ruqyia Bibi and Munir Masih, who have been sentenced to 25 years in prison. We believe God is on our side.
Please pray:
· For the immediate release of Asia Bibi and the possibility of returning to a safe life with her husband and two children
· That Ruqyia Bibi and Munir Masih will be acquitted of false blasphemy charges and released from jail
· That Rubina Bibi and her family can rebuild a normal life and be supplied with adequate shelter, food and clothing
· Legal aids involved in the cases, that they can have wisdom and strength and secure the release of innocent Christians from prison
Nasir Saeed, coordinator of CLAAS UK, said: We have voiced our concern over the blasphemy laws with the Pakistani government and at the international level and we will continue to do so until they are changed in such a way that they can no longer be misappropriated by radicals and extremists looking for a way to settle their personal scores and make life difficult for Christians. Cruel and harsh treatment is a sad fact of life for Pakistans Christians.
Pakistan Christian Post
UK: November 18, 2010. (PCP) The Centre for Legal Aid, Assistance and Settlement (CLAAS) has received with sadness the news that Asia Bibi has been sentenced to death for blasphemy by a session court in the province of Punjab. The Christian mother-of-two, from Ittanwali, was sentenced by the court on Sunday. The news is especially regretful as CLAAS had been providing free legal aid to Asia until her husband Ashiq Masih decided to transfer her case to local Muslim solicitors who had no experience in dealing with blasphemy cases.
We believe this decision played a crucial part in the resulting ruling against Asia. Joseph Francis, director of CLAAS Pakistan, has again offered free legal assistance to Asia but cannot proceed without the consent of her family.
Our lawyers have considerable experience in blasphemy cases and most recently won the acquittal of Rubina Bibi, who had been charged with blasphemy under section 295-C of the Pakistani penal code in Pakistan, blasphemy charges carry a death sentence.
Until now, Christians sentenced to death in Pakistan have been freed by the high court and Supreme Court and we are hoping for the same outcome for Asia.
Despite this possibility, however, even Christians who have had their death sentences overturned have had to spend years in prison and, even once found innocent, are unable to lead normal lives because of fear of attack. Many have to go into hiding for years.
The Pakistani government has made no effort to reform the discriminatory laws that put the lives of Pakistans Christians at constant risk.
It is unclear how many years Asia will have to spend in jail. Even if she appeals the sentence in the high court, it may take years before her case is even heard.
Asia was charged with blasphemy by fellow field labourers after discussing her faith with them. They pressured her to convert to Islam and she and her daughters were later attacked by local Muslims.
CLAAS is extremely concerned about the sentence as it proves that the blasphemy laws are being misused with little protection or justice for victims.
Joseph Francis, director of CLAAS Pakistan, said: CLAAS was successful in securing the release of Rubina Bibi and her son. We stand ready to protect the rights of more innocent victims. Unfortunately the sentencing of Asia Bibi is yet another sign of the great danger facing Pakistans Christians. We are working for the release of Christians facing blasphemy charges, including Ruqyia Bibi and Munir Masih, who have been sentenced to 25 years in prison. We believe God is on our side.
Please pray:
· For the immediate release of Asia Bibi and the possibility of returning to a safe life with her husband and two children
· That Ruqyia Bibi and Munir Masih will be acquitted of false blasphemy charges and released from jail
· That Rubina Bibi and her family can rebuild a normal life and be supplied with adequate shelter, food and clothing
· Legal aids involved in the cases, that they can have wisdom and strength and secure the release of innocent Christians from prison
Nasir Saeed, coordinator of CLAAS UK, said: We have voiced our concern over the blasphemy laws with the Pakistani government and at the international level and we will continue to do so until they are changed in such a way that they can no longer be misappropriated by radicals and extremists looking for a way to settle their personal scores and make life difficult for Christians. Cruel and harsh treatment is a sad fact of life for Pakistans Christians.
Pakistan Christian Post
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Falling on deaf ears apparently. At least from the recent rubbish i saw on the BBC.
Is it not lovely how the west act's holier than thou when they themselves are complicit in some of the worst human rights violations in the history of humanity.
Here is one such example:
http://www.onenewspage.co.uk/news/W...-Bay-detainees-to-be-paid-compensation-by.htm
Granted justice should be done and compassion should be exercised. I just cannot stomach the preachy attitude of some of these international commentators.
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