Pakistan Army received it's first Agusta Westland 139 Helicopter.

[Arsalan]

Sir, Two questions come in mind,

1) Were the alternates offered to Pakistan?

2) PAA has been operating this aircraft for some time don't you think they would have evaluated it by now?

The answers to both these are quite simple if you think about it.

1) Where these AW139 push down our throat? no, we opted to go for them. So where the alternates DENIED to us? Is it a case that we did looked for the better options and were not able to go for those because the supplier denied the access to that. In short, the alternates are as available and easy to get/safe to operate in future as this one would have been.

2) Yes they must have, but aren't they also operating MUCH MUCH larger numbers of other choppers as well who will fit the bill better? Also the fact that the already in operation choppers find main use in PM transport and as cabinet aviation wing and not some military operations. So the evaluation must have been more realistic for this role. The helicopters being used in military operations would have been better evaluated for military role.

We do not have the luxury of deploying dozens of such expensive helicopters for relief operations of VVIP transportation.. Can get a few more at maximum and this is a fact. If it is for military use (higher numbers), we have better options that would have been evaluated better in operations and will be available for purchase as well. This is all i have been trying to explain.

 

[Sulman Badshah]

We choose AW 139 against Sikorsky S70 helicopter ..

I think it was a better choice to opt for AW139 rather than going with S70

 

[Super Falcon]

Good and sensible choice fuel efficiency is a whole mark of these state of the art machines

 

[khanasifm]

Per Allan , Air force Monthly these http://www.aerospace-technology.com/projects/ab139/
are ordered by Air Force for SAR sqdn at the bases replacing/supplementing
Aérospatiale Alouette III

They also produce Radars ?? JF17 Blk 3 AESA ??
http://www.leonardocompany.com/en/p...onici-spaziali-airborne-space-systems-2/radar

The AW139 military version is capable of carrying up to 15 troops or six stretchers with four medical attendants. It can be fitted with gun pods, rocket launchers and air-to-air missiles attached to two removable external supports.
In February 2011, AgustaWestland launched the AW139M, a customised military variant of the AW139. The AW139M features self protection equipment such as infrared detection, armoured seats to improve crew protection and blast resistant self-sealing fuel tanks.
Specs are better than PAA Bell412

http://www.leonardocompany.com/en/-/aw139

http://www.leonardocompany.com/documents/63265270/69071306/body_AW139M.pdf

http://www.leonardocompany.com/documents/63265270/68150014/body_AW139_7ton_2_data_sheet.pdf

 

[Danish saleem]

Possibly Puma's change.

 

[khanasifm]

Per Allan , Air force Monthly these http://www.aerospace-technology.com/projects/ab139/
are ordered by Air Force for SAR sqdn at the bases replacing/supplementing
Aérospatiale Alouette III

They also produce Radars ?? JF17 Blk 3 AESA ??
http://www.leonardocompany.com/en/p...onici-spaziali-airborne-space-systems-2/radar

The AW139 military version is capable of carrying up to 15 troops or six stretchers with four medical attendants. It can be fitted with gun pods, rocket launchers and air-to-air missiles attached to two removable external supports.
In February 2011, AgustaWestland launched the AW139M, a customised military variant of the AW139. The AW139M features self protection equipment such as infrared detection, armoured seats to improve crew protection and blast resistant self-sealing fuel tanks.
Specs are better than PAA Bell412

http://www.leonardocompany.com/en/-/aw139

http://www.leonardocompany.com/documents/63265270/69071306/body_AW139M.pdf

http://www.leonardocompany.com/documents/63265270/68150014/body_AW139_7ton_2_data_sheet.pdf

Source: https://defence.pk/threads/pakistan...nd-aw139-choppers.432061/page-8#ixzz4A0asCi00

 

[muhammadali233]

Possibly Puma's change.

Puma is military troop/supplies transport aircraft these on the other hand aw 139 is not in that class more like bell 412 type thing used for light troop movement or VIP transport

 

[[--Leo--]]

Not happy they should for for ToT and build these in PAC still more imports and more the economy falls
but good for pakistani i hope curroption is not invovle

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

I think we need to get away from this "Notion" of finding crocodile tears in every deal we do

Deal is closed rejoice Military knows well what it wants they obviously have the analyst on duty to suggest an ideal platform

Depends on many factors

a) Availability
b) Familiarity of platform to Local Engineers
c) Induction into forces vs just evaluation
d) Delivery dates and conditions
e) Future deals


There may be other greater platform but they may be non cost effective or available due to political strings

I think it is worth appreciating the deal done in difficult times when there are other national issues taking forefront attention

 

[MKC]

Its just simple waste of many 100 million of Dollar by one 3rd of that Money Govt can install Helicopter plant in Pakistan. IF that money could be used for project of helicopters inside Pak any aeronautical department at LUMS or UET lahore with 500 Engineers start to produce helicopters within 3 years of time.

Although the helicopter has been described as an "ungainly, aerodynamic maverick", the modem helicopter is indeed a machine of considerable engineering sophistication and refinement (see figure below) and plays a unique role in modern aviation provided by no other aircraft. It is truly a unique form of aircraft and a mastery of modem aeronautical engineering.

The overall aerodynamic complexity of the helicopter in forward flight can be appreciated from the fig. below. The flow field in which the rotor operates is considerably more complex than that of a fixed-wing aircraft, mainly because of the individual wakes trailed from each blade.

I want this title to be available as an eBook

Do girls in Pakistan take engineering?
Well, they don't take in India much. I mean "Ladka hua to engineer & ladki hui to doctor". Oh! they don't even take non-medical science, I don't know what type of hatred they have towards non-medical science or love with medical science.

1) The issue is not every one is going to buy these. Though there could be a significant demand in the future.
2) Pakistan does not make Engines.
3) Aircraft or Helicopters are designed around the engines.

Can't Pakistan import engines for helicopters like jf17?

Is the AEROSPATIALE 316/319 ALOUETTE-III locally manufactured in Pakistan

I found few areas where it was stated this helicopter is manufactured in Pakistan since 80's ?

Wikipedia article on Aérospatiale Alouette III says Pakistan only purchased but PAF article says SA319B was locally produced, I think Aérospatiale Alouette III article is more reliable as you will have Indigenous Nuclear Submarine by 2020 as PN wikipedia page, yes wikipedia pages are reliable source if they aren't on Pakistan.
If you want to test reliability try editing any page on UK, US, France & India see next same page.

Can you give me one information
How many types of aircraft were manufactured in Pakistan( I mean with licence, ToT, indigenous designs & all except JF17 including UAV) & how many are still being produced?

The Money Pak going to give Italy, almost with same amount of money Russia are making new high speed helicopters , its better Pak use that money to build make own helicopter engines

Russia have everything they just have to change some specification & get ready a new helicopter for them but Pakistan is not Russia that you must know, I think any country can't make a new helicopter in less than 5 years if start from scratch that means not talking about EU, US, Canada, Brazil, Ukraine, JP, China, India, Korea etc.
I mean like UAE, KSA, Qatar, Oman, Bahrain, Kuwait, Egypt. All these have money but not industrial power for aerospace till now.
Sorry, if I am wrong on anything.

 

[Arsalan]

b) 50 - 250 units Transport helicopters for Troops for fast anti terror ops / rescue mission

50 to 250
lolz
Quite a HUGE range Either 50 to 5 times 50 !!!

Kuch tu khyaal kro bahi!!

By the way, as per my info as yet the number is somewhere between 1 to 9999 helicopters

Sorry Sir!!

Seriously speaking, it is 6 choppers as far as known till now. Being bought for air force SAR. I do feel however that these will see some use in VVIP transport as well, this however is a personal opinion. Delivery time is upward of one year BUT discussions and negotiations are on going in this matter.

 

[ACE OF THE AIR]

Do girls in Pakistan take engineering?

Yes. Search on google and you will find many links.

Can't Pakistan import engines for helicopters like jf17?

Yes. if Pakistan purchases helicopters.

If it designed a new helicopter in PAC then it would ask engine suppliers. Once they agree to provide then it is going to test that engine on the helicopter. It would all depend on the Contract that is signed between the engine manufacturer and PAC.

How many types of aircraft were manufactured in Pakistan( I mean with licence, ToT, indigenous designs & all except JF17 including UAV) & how many are still being produced?

You can google...You would find enough links other than wikipedia...

By the way, as per my info as yet the number is somewhere between 1 to 9999 helicopters

Nice to see you in Troll mode

 

[MKC]

Yes. Search on google and you will find many links.

I didn't say in Pakistan girls don't take engineering but I said in comparison to number of boys.
In India, in engineering number of girls is much less than boys as number of boys is much less than girls in medical sector.
Obviously, if 10% take that can come on google.
Thanks.

You can google...You would find enough links other than wikipedia...

Thanks for your advice but it would have been much better if you would have provided just 7-8 names.

 

[muhammadali233]

Do girls in Pakistan take engineering?

Boys outnumber them by 20/30%.

How many types of aircraft were manufactured in Pakistan( I mean with licence, ToT, indigenous designs & all except JF17 including UAV) & how many are still being produced?

4 Types of different aircraft are being manufactured at the moment at PAC.
1.JF-17 (light weight 4th gen fighter)
2.MFI-17 (Basic trainer) based on Swedish Saab Safari
3.PAC Super Mushshak (basic Trainer) upgraded MFI-17
4.K-8 (intermediate trainer) built with the help of china operated by 15+- countries over 500+ built to date.
Aloutte III was manufactuered under licence quite a while back
More than a dozen types of UAV are manufactured in Pakistan but notable members are
1.Satuma Jassos(Tactical reconnaissance UAV)(indigenous):

2:Falco UAV (Version of Italian drone built by PAC under licence.)
3.Burraq Armed Drone (indigenous).
More here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unmanned_aerial_vehicles#Pakistan

 

[Signalian]

Pakistan should get 2-4 of the big boy in this pic

or we should get 6 CH 47 which can lift a battery of 6 six guns in mountain region

or when Pakistan decides to send sanction prone F-16's back to USA

CH 53 can even take on a Chinook

and even lift an APC