Pakistan Air Force | News & Discussions.

[AsifIjaz]

Only way mig35 will make sense for pakistan is if
.. Russia agrees to a rd93 and probably rd93ma overhaul facility in pakistan
.. Russia agrees to integrate the klj7A or better chinese aesa on it.. Read possible local assembly or manufacture of aesa and mostly same weapons with thunder
.. Tailor some of the specs as per paf needs e.g. martin baker seats and allowing us to integrate some of the pods or ecms

A russian mig35 is not required but a tailored russian mig35 with local engine overhaul facility can sweetened the deal for 3 to max 4 squadron worth of order.

In short, if the PAF is opting for a ws13 or ws19 for thunders in the near future then this purchase makes no sense but if we are replacing rd93 with rd93ma which has fadec and/or better mtbo then why not. This way a tailored mig35 can start to replace rose mirages in about 5 years while block 3 thunders can replace non-rose mirages/pgs thus giving us a fleet of thunder, vipers and mig35s.

Mig 35 is actually on cards of Paf. Advantages attached are same engine maintenance facilities as of Jf17. It's been marketed aggressively by Russians, one e.g is sale agreement with Egypt. Full testing completed in 2017-18. Now serial production under way. Russians offering Aesa radar, infrared and all its modern fire arms. Russian Air force already ordered around 180 of these birds and upgrading present Mig 29 fleet. Production facility already of Mig 29. So production in numbers not a problem. It's endurance is 2.5 to 3 hrs with internal fuel and Ifr probe retractable. With Air to Air refuelling 6hrs of endurance. Russian offered it to Pakistan instead of Su 35 when Pakistan tested Su 35. It's comparable to blk 70 F16s as sensor suit is said to be better. Pakistan desperately looking for Rafael comparison and could only offered this economical solution. I personally think it's a viable solution.

 

[salman-1]

We are already having around 126 Rd93 on jf17s and Rd-93ma on blk 3. So facility of maintenance is there and setting overhaul unit already in pipeline. Mig 35 tailored according to Paf needs will be a potent asset and a good replacement for Mirages. But I don't think Klj7a would be installed on Mig. It has its own Aesa radar

 

[CriticalThought]

We are already having around 126 Rd93 on jf17s and Rd-93ma on blk 3. So facility of maintenance is there and setting overhaul unit already in pipeline. Mig 35 tailored according to Paf needs will be a potent asset and a good replacement for Mirages. But I don't think Klj7a would be installed on Mig. It has its own Aesa radar

Masha Allah, It's a good decision, Alhamdulillah. PAF has a history of eking out max performance from the junior version, e.g., F-16 instead of F-15. The Flanker's monster engines are also notorious for FOD problems, although Su-35 is supposed to have solved that problem. Nevertheless, extensive familiarity with RD-33 derivative isn't something that can be easily overlooked. As long as the fighter doesn't lack power to fulfill all its duties, it is still a welcome addition. Although, some part of my heart still wistfully yearns for the Flanker... I feel if PAF got its hands on Su-35, it would eventually rid the Flanker of its problems, Insha Allah.

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

Only way mig35 will make sense for pakistan is if
.. Russia agrees to a rd93 and probably rd93ma overhaul facility in pakistan
.. Russia agrees to integrate the klj7A or better chinese aesa on it.. Read possible local assembly or manufacture of aesa and mostly same weapons with thunder
.. Tailor some of the specs as per paf needs e.g. martin baker seats and allowing us to integrate some of the pods or ecms

A russian mig35 is not required but a tailored russian mig35 with local engine overhaul facility can sweetened the deal for 3 to max 4 squadron worth of order.

In short, if the PAF is opting for a ws13 or ws19 for thunders in the near future then this purchase makes no sense but if we are replacing rd93 with rd93ma which has fadec and/or better mtbo then why not. This way a tailored mig35 can start to replace rose mirages in about 5 years while block 3 thunders can replace non-rose mirages/pgs thus giving us a fleet of thunder, vipers and mig35s.

On that chain, it'd also only make sense if it ties directly into Project Azm. Interestingly, UAC was supposed to develop a FGF with UAE based on the MiG-29/35 frame, not sure what came of it...

//Russia defense heavyweight Rostec will partner with the UAE Ministry of Defence to co-develop a fifth-generation light combat fighter, company CEO Sergey Chemezov said at IDEX in Abu Dhabi Monday.

Development, which is based upon its MiG-29 twin-engine fighter aircraft, will kick off in 2018, and will take an estimated seven to eight years, Chemezov said during a media briefing with journalists. He elaborated in an exclusive one-on-one interview with Defense News.//

https://www.defensenews.com/digital...ostec-to-co-develop-5th-gen-fighter-with-uae/

 

[ZedZeeshan]

On that chain, it'd also only make sense if it ties directly into Project Azm. Interestingly, UAC was supposed to develop a FGF with UAE based on the MiG-29/35 frame, not sure what came of it...

//Russia defense heavyweight Rostec will partner with the UAE Ministry of Defence to co-develop a fifth-generation light combat fighter, company CEO Sergey Chemezov said at IDEX in Abu Dhabi Monday.

Development, which is based upon its MiG-29 twin-engine fighter aircraft, will kick off in 2018, and will take an estimated seven to eight years, Chemezov said during a media briefing with journalists. He elaborated in an exclusive one-on-one interview with Defense News.//

https://www.defensenews.com/digital...ostec-to-co-develop-5th-gen-fighter-with-uae/

1st prototype is expected in 2025.

 

[denel]

We are already having around 126 Rd93 on jf17s and Rd-93ma on blk 3. So facility of maintenance is there and setting overhaul unit already in pipeline. Mig 35 tailored according to Paf needs will be a potent asset and a good replacement for Mirages. But I don't think Klj7a would be installed on Mig. It has its own Aesa radar

Yes correct on radar but standardisation brings synergies.

 

[Kabotar]

On that chain, it'd also only make sense if it ties directly into Project Azm. Interestingly, UAC was supposed to develop a FGF with UAE based on the MiG-29/35 frame, not sure what came of it...

//Russia defense heavyweight Rostec will partner with the UAE Ministry of Defence to co-develop a fifth-generation light combat fighter, company CEO Sergey Chemezov said at IDEX in Abu Dhabi Monday.

Development, which is based upon its MiG-29 twin-engine fighter aircraft, will kick off in 2018, and will take an estimated seven to eight years, Chemezov said during a media briefing with journalists. He elaborated in an exclusive one-on-one interview with Defense News.//

https://www.defensenews.com/digital...ostec-to-co-develop-5th-gen-fighter-with-uae/

For AZM Russia's izdeliye 30 might make single engine fighter possible. They have offered this engine to India for AMCA but I doubt they will go for it China is trying to build their own, there aren't many countries who will be offered Su57s so they might be tempted to sell some 400-600 engines to PAF to spread R&D. This engine produces power(107kn/176kn) close to what is produced by F35(125kn/192kn).

 

[AsifIjaz]

Basically... Rf93ma should be sufficient for a powerful aesa with side trms, irst and any possible internal or external ecms that we may use on thunders in the future. Keeping the size of the thunder in mind there is just enough that can be put on it either internally or externally.

If azm ends up being a dual engine aircraft (which is highly likely) then 2 x rd93ma shud probably be enough for most if not any design that we may come up with or finalize but its gonna be a long shot for a single engine fgf. A reliable powerplant is gonna be an Achilles heal for either azm and dare i say the way things are looking for tfx as well. Turkey is not going anywhere with TFX without solving this issue. So if we can get an overhaul facility locally then chances of tfx and azm combining as one fgf are pretty high. Moreover if pakistan does decide to go the sino route with a j31 then even rd93ma can become its base power unit.

To conclude, an overhaul facility for rd93ma wud essentially mean a big relief for depots, increase the reliability or availability of parts for thunders, mig35s and an engine that can possibly be used in azm or azm+TFX/J31. This facility can also be used for possible overhauling engines from friendly countries operating mig29s or mig35 via rd33 or its variants. (malaysia, may be Egypt or probably uae).
So in essence the possibilities are endless with this move. We kill not 2 but 3 birds by going for a mig35 platform tied with an engine overhaul facility for rd93ma.

 

[Behram Khilji]

PAF Azm project I think will be a tailored J-31, nothing more nothing less, it will again be produced on Jf-17 production concept of gradually localising the production of parts.

Azm is or Should be a replacement of f-16, if so then 120 odd j-10 can serve us well in to the future edging the mirages out.

 

[Dazzler]

with WS-13, back in 2014-15. The same aircraft was the first to have the new ECS system for enhanced cooling. LAter, it was fitted and tested with LKF-601E AESA.

04 with WS-13, right, 06 with 93MA, left. Image from 2013

New engine options have been tested for several years on this aircraft.

 

[MIRauf]

Only way Mig-35 would be available if India doesn't select Russian Aircraft and goes for JS-39 or a US Variant, then again its highly unlikely as India will buy x$ Billion of something to please the Russians.

Either PAF goes for J-10CE or gets in bed with GCC and have them finance 64 / 32 odd EFTs ( used (64) or new (32) ) like they funded the Egyptian Rafale and other weapons deal. GCC would get better solders from Pak vs almost nothing they got from Egypt and Pak / PAF will get a very good Fighter, a win-win for all.

 

[TOPGUN]

Only way Mig-35 would be available if India doesn't select Russian Aircraft and goes for JS-39 or a US Variant, then again its highly unlikely as India will buy x$ Billion of something to please the Russians.

Either PAF goes for J-10CE or gets in bed with GCC and have them finance 64 / 32 odd EFTs ( used (64) or new (32) ) like they funded the Egyptian Rafale and other weapons deal. GCC would get better solders from Pak vs almost nothing they got from Egypt and Pak / PAF will get a very good Fighter, a win-win for all.

India will not go for Mig-35 , now how true is the story of PAF being interested or Russia even willing to sell to PAF is another story.

 

[Army research]

Mig 35 when the Indians have the s400? Wouldn't the Russians have tweaked the s400 to optimally take on the mig35 ?
Rather pour funds in kamra or buy much much more safer option of J10C , already have munitions similarity and avionics to a degree ,
Better just buy used f16 etc for now until azm matures

 

[StrikeEagle]

Assalam u Alaikum guys;

Can someone with reliable information kindly confirm if these news about Pakistan looking for Mig-35's are true?

 

[Shabi1]

People in Russian Defence ministry were quoting a SU-35 sale to Pakistan not long ago. So will take this with a pinch of salt.

PAF likes to evaluate everything so maybe they did evaluate Mig-35 as well but most likely purchases could be sub systems.