Pakistan-A real market for the Mirage 2000-9 ?

[Junaid Ashraf]

As Pakistan is privatizing many of its public firms which means money more over growing relationship with Qatar who is rich and spends money a lot on Muslim countries too. Which can sell their 12+ Mirage-2000s for free and can easily fund Egypt-UAE M-2000s for PAF.

 

[Storm Force]

In short I see these mirages being available by 2016/2017...after UAE
start to get their new mmrca.
Poo
At this point those sixty mirages are major acquisitions for both paf and India.

It Wil come down to politics and hard cash

Who Wil get these additions and what cost and timescale

 

[The SC]

In Reply to THE SC

And your statement

When you consider India paid over $3 billion to upgrade 51 Mirage2000 Upgraded TO DASH 5 and with new suite of weapons including over 550 mica BVRS

The indians would pay happliy pay double the $1.5 BILLION you indicate that PAF would pay. for over 60 used Mirage 2000-9

especiall;y if THE MMRCA rafale is cancelled.[

That is a big IF!!! don't you think so?

 

[ejaz007]

In short I see these mirages being available by 2016/2017...after UAE
start to get their new mmrca.
Poo
At this point those sixty mirages are major acquisitions for both paf and India.

It Wil come down to politics and hard cash

Who Wil get these additions and what cost and timescale

I do not think IAF feels threatened by the acquisition of Mirages by PAF. With or without Rafael deal IAF still has some options available and they are heavily committed in other projects.

Plus one strange fact you all might have ignored. IAF shall let PAF acquire these birds and then start lobbying on this very acquisition for further procurement of advanced fighters at their end. This is how things work in defense forces. First you create a threat and then start lobbying to counter the threat.

 

[kaykay]

I do not think IAF feels threatened by the acquisition of Mirages by PAF. With or without Rafael deal IAF still has some options available and they are heavily committed in other projects.

Plus one strange fact you all might have ignored. IAF shall let PAF acquire these birds and then start lobbying on this very acquisition for further procurement of advanced fighters at their end. This is how things work in defense forces. First you create a threat and then start lobbying to counter the threat.

I guess Indian and Pakistani members here are thinking a bit too much from these aircrafts. IMO none of these 2 countries are going to get these aircrafts just like Qatari mirages in past. Also many members think that it will cost very cheap but I don't think so as leave alone plane cost, French weapons and sub systems alone are among most expensive( IAF bought 490 mica missiles for 50 mirage 2ks worth 1.2 billion dollar alone in 2011).

 

[ejaz007]

I guess Indian and Pakistani members here are thinking a bit too much from these aircrafts. IMO none of these 2 countries are going to get these aircrafts just like Qatari mirages in past. Also many members think that it will cost very cheap but I don't think so as leave alone plane cost, French weapons and sub systems alone are among most expensive( IAF bought 490 mica missiles for 50 mirage 2ks worth 1.2 billion dollar alone in 2011).

Lets wait and see. Strong possibility is that one of these countries may acquire them as both have good experience of French planes.

 

[kaykay]

Lets wait and see. Strong possibility is that one of these countries may acquire them as both have good experience of French planes.

Let's see. Though recently Egyptian authorities met with UAE and French authorities for this deal.

 

[monitor]

with the emergence of fifth generation fighter it will be naive for Pakistan to go for a new Fourth generation fighter when very easily they can get MLU F-16 fighter from 4000 aircraft gong to replace in next decade and induct it with out any significant problem as Pakistan have 30 years of experience and infrastructure of operating this platform .I think Mirage 2000 real market either Egypt military ruler under UAE blessing and India who have been operating it for decade or the UAE may keep it them self if they ca't get any client . I think if Pakistan have nay spare money to spend any where the it should be upgrading JF-17 with more deadly teeth get the option to get another 18 F-16 block 52 or get long range air defence system which Pakistan lacks.

with the emergence of fifth generation fighter it will be naive for Pakistan to go for a new Fourth generation fighter when very easily they can get MLU F-16 fighter from 4000 aircraft gong to replace in next decade and induct it with out any significant problem as Pakistan have 30 years of experience and infrastructure of operating this platform .I think Mirage 2000 real market either Egypt military ruler under UAE blessing and India who have been operating it for decade or the UAE may keep it them self if they ca't get any client . I think if Pakistan have nay spare money to spend any where the it should be upgrading JF-17 with more deadly teeth get the option to get another 18 F-16 block 52 or get long range air defence system which Pakistan lacks.

 

[Storm Force]

Good post monitor sensible thinking

 

[Basel]

if PAF have money to buy M2K9s they should spent it on upgrading JF-17s specially with Vixon1000es AESA radar or better, modern avionics r urgent need as IAF is upgrading it fleet rapidly to 4.5 Gen level.

therefore backbone of PAF must be of 4.5 Gen standard n front line jet should be 4.75 Gen standard.

 

[Super Falcon]

9 Qatari mirages no justification to buy them

if PAF have money to buy M2K9s they should spent it on upgrading JF-17s specially with Vixon1000es AESA radar or better, modern avionics r urgent need as IAF is upgrading it fleet rapidly to 4.5 Gen level.

therefore backbone of PAF must be of 4.5 Gen standard n front line jet should be 4.75 Gen standard.

Agreed and not to forget RD 93 engine makes too much heat signatures for a jet so replacing it is important

 

[khanasifm]

This is how it goes

USA Current Inv, 4th GEN working on replacement i.e 5th Gen, Designing 6th Gen
Europe Current 4th, plus add few USA based 5th Gen
Russia Current 3/4th plus at least decade behind in 5th Gen ???
China Current 2/3rd, 4th Gen plus developing 5G who know but by the time in active service with substantial number another 1.5 to 2 decades

Rest of the world Majority 3G except Japan, Korea and few others

Sub continent Third World/ Still flying 3G in majority some 4G
so lets stop talking about 5Gen like the whole world has moved on to 5G

Stop comparing every freaking country to USA, its 13 trillion economy which th rest 20 countries cannot match and defense which next 10-20 or so counties cannot match

 

[Humble Analyst]

No go for PAF... JFT out smart those vintage design in every area.

Although, someone else might be very interested.

Mirage 2000-9 vintage? The ground clearance on JF17 is low and is not great on F16 either. Pakistan will be lucky to have Mirage 2000 because of the payload and the type of payload it can take off with. Who are we kidding ourselves? Only issue I see is price and spares being very expensive.

IMO, There is less chances for PAF to go for this option.There are several reasons.

1) 20 million euro price for used piece is too much.while new JFTblk1 is about 15-20 million $.
2) Used Mirages will have life time around 15 years and after that need upgrade.
3) Even If UAE sell to any country it will take several years to deliver because UAE can not deliver until new rafle are ready to deliver.Till that time PAF might be starting deliveries of JFT blk3 that would be more powerful than these planes.
4) Pakistan is going to induct 50 new advanced version of JFT blk2in few month time that are better than these mirages.
5) France has already refuse to provide heavy weapons to Pakistan due to MMRC.

How option could be considered if price is really affordable that is around 10-12 million $ a piece to replace mirag-3 fighters.

JF Block three will be equipped with what type of engines? Avionics?

 

[Mangus Ortus Novem]

if PAF have money to buy M2K9s they should spent it on upgrading JF-17s specially with Vixon1000es AESA radar or better, modern avionics r urgent need as IAF is upgrading it fleet rapidly to 4.5 Gen level.

therefore backbone of PAF must be of 4.5 Gen standard n front line jet should be 4.75 Gen standard.

Most sensible post really. Your good country should be selling JF to Qatar and others not the other way round.

Sure there is need to plug the gaps, but what is the long term strategy? Indpendence or dependence?

Finging something economic to keep the PAF afloat till your local solutions become available must be the national strategy. China is there to help. So is your brother Turkey. South Africa is there as well.

Wishing you all the best.

 

[nomi007]

GOOD for PAF
but UAE is not going to sell them to Pakistan
after
Yemen war
but news are coming that we are getting Qatar's mirages