ok...what is the average number of tests a pakistani ballistic missile goes through before it gets inducted??
how many pakistani missiles failed a launch during it's testing?
what are the key pakistani components in jf-17?
how does a country which has never ever produced so much as a satellite launch vehicle or a re-entry probe or a super-computer dream of possessing a MIRV?
what is the Pakistani input in AL-khalid?
answer these questions...if you have similar questions about our defense porducts...both failed and otherwise...by all means ask..and i will give you a figure more precise and exact than yours....
whatever you cant answer is open for speculation...
You are forcing this to become off-topic...
what happens when a country tests nukes?dont you remember our case?
Israel needs whatever little foreign sympathy it can get...and isn't Israel sufficiently public about it's programs?is there any country barring Turkey that can hold Israel in the mid-east and get a decisive victory with at least all the known programs Israel already has or has embarked on...?
for a country caught in a soup like Pakistan it is...as you always potray...when you can adopt beliefs such as that your men are martially superior and natural fighters...and that each of our soldier is worth 10 of ours...I think you do...
You need to be fairly confident to come out saying that you have something better...but more than confident you need to put forth facts and figures....for no body buys your argument if you cant.
Pakistan's case is like Britains when it kept on bluffing about having a nuclear bomb and using it against Germany when it was being bombarded with V2 rockets...(not denying that you have nukes)
you are twisting words...announcing that you are developing something is stupid unless you dont have it sitting pretty in your lap...
once you have it...you surely need to brandish it to prevent being overrun in a fatal one on one with a bigger enemy...
dont we all remember how mushrraf talked about using the nuke option during the stand-off after the parliamentary attacks??
He being the president and the COAS did not put too much hope in the conventional nature of warfare did he??
that did bring in bad vibes from all over the world...as we had an explicit no first-use policy...
so the bewildering thing is...why does pakistan choose to keep it's better and superior tech only for the chatter and does not even produce the filmsiest of backing required for it to hold ground?while it openly seeks to use the nuke option in spite ofhaving what not?
why does it also not prove that it has a better communications and C4I system in place to deter the enemy?Every body would understand if it is all indigenous...hell you'd get points for that...cus so far there is not one thing that comes to my mind that you guys have produce which does not exist anywhere else...forget the super-duper neutron bomb...
why do you scale-up to being in the same state as America??
the case of Pakistan is a lot different...do I need to tell you that?
pitted against a bigger enemy...you need non-measurable edges like in efficiency...measurable ones in quality of systems....
an sane person...military or otherwise would agree that it is the prevention of war that is more important than the actual fighting itself...a thousand things can go wrong...logistic failure has defeated more armies than any other form of opposition...that is the exact reason china tests A-SAT weapons...the exact reason...USA maintains a well-known anti-missile shield program...and embarked on the star wars mother of all projects...provides yeilds of all it's conventional bombs...the exact reason why the Germans...the brits...the ruskies do not shy away from their good weapon systems...
do you believe when the Iranians say that they are in advanced stages of getting themselves a 5th gen fighter???
alright...so now you bring in espionage....dude this is not going anywhere...I have liked your posts...I even posted that you should be made a moderator or something...but this is gonig in circles...
Is there nothing to prove that the Pakistani C4I system is better than Indias?
I wonder if I am dragging this into a off topic debate or you are..
Martial races.. where the **** did I ever mention Martial races.. or race superiority or martians..
Now..
for the answeres to your first paragraph..
its Two tests.. however..not neccecarily of the same missile..but the same engine configuration.
Ignore the Ghauri.. its the North Korean Nodong..
the Shaheen was developed using a baseline engine from the Hatf series..Chinese input from M-11 missiles.
the guidance system on it.. was designed in house by NDC.
The shaheen engine was tested back in 99 in flight.. along with the first guidance system..
Nobody expected the thing to blow the target flag out of the circle.. let alone even make it to the circle.. it did.
Next test verified a newer guidance system.. refined engine..and slight changes in stage size...
At the same time.. low rate production started...
But since I heard this by word of mouth...you wont believe it...okay.np
There is Pakistani input in the design process of the JF-17..with aerodynamics.. electronics.. systems engineers..along with pilots.
half of the Jf-17 design team in 2003 was sourced from Pakistan.
But since they arent a "component" in the strict sense of the word..
You dont have to believe me.. okay..np
could you please tell me..how super computers are absolutely necessary in MIRV design.. is it impossible without it?
In any case.. Suparco has on occasion outsourced to the Chinese academy for time on their machine...is that worth publishing....on the internet?Isnt it possible for NDC to do the same? no.. so you dont have to believe me..okay.np
the solid state auto loader system for the Al-khalid..was designed by my company.. The systems integration..was done in house and by a private company outsourced to by HIT and a University group.
But that's ok.. Its not on the internet.. you dont have to believe me.
We cant do anything on our own.. since its not on the internet.. scanned or in article form otherwise.. you dont have to believe a thing.
Now..
How do you brandish a C4I system?
Now.. lets assume.. that the pretty scans I just saw are of an operational system.. in that case.. you just gave your enemies the idea that you are pulling ahead.. they panic..they push more into their programs.. they put more money into competing with you here.. or in another weapon system..
You find out.. you feel set back.. you spend more.. the other guy.. who cannot keep up on this linear approach.. decided to upgrade his non-conventional arsenal.. do you see the pattern here..its called an arms race..we have been at it... for over...lets see.. 65 years or so??
Would you rather slow it down.. or speed it up..
Is it better to be satisfied with being better by the knowledge of having extremely high tech systems.. or by knowing all of that.. and knowing that the other guy is now more insecure because of it and is making more nukes??
To answer your second last paragraph..
Have you ever heard of Operational security?.. its not only nations that practice it.. Apple..Microsoft.. all do it in some form.
Do you know everything there is to know about the F-22.. as you say the Americans publish everything?
Do I know everything about the Akash?.. down to the underlying scan rate?.. weaknesses?
recently a very decorated USAF F-22 pilot.. was forced to retire.. after he mistakenly posted some details on the internet which..although were not classified as such.. deemed to endanger US OPSEC.. there was even a presentation which I posted earlier made just for this incident by the USAF..even though.. there is very little chance he was talking to any internet spies.or that most would not have been able to get that data..say in five years or so.
Now.. am I even comparable to that person's professional exp and reputation.. far from it..
But if I know something.. whether its within my organization.. or by indirect reference.. should I blurt it all out..maybe.. or should I exercise caution. Just in case.
And that goes not just for me..
there are other members who are privy to info.. some say it openly...its their judgment call.. they know better. If I feel comfortable sharing a certain detail.. Ill do it...if not..you are more than welcome to be a skeptic.
There are other more knowledgeable members in their respective fields who post liberally..and with considerable detail.. but Whatever they post.. is everything that is freely available as collectible information on the internet. If tomorrow I find that okay.. look...there is that new purchase I heard about talking to my colleague.. on that website.. hey..lets talk about it.
But if I am having a chat with a senior in my organization..and he mentions something but says please do not mention it to anybody yet..I feel it best not to...it may something very trivial.. no james bond stuff.. but I can exercise the right to abstain from talking about it.
Should steve jobs have revealed everything about the iphone 4 after that prototype was lost and found?.. what if the iphone was not up to the hype..what if it spurred nokia to make a better competitor after knowing what it would be facing?
Now..for the record..I dont state ANYwhere that the IAF C4I is obsolete.. useless etc...please point out the post where I did do that.
In my opinion all that data published on wikipedia is on operational systems which are in the process of having their replacement or upgrade being developed..which DRDO has possibly not even disclosed.
My contention is however.. with your countrymen.. who refuse to believe that we can keep up with you.. or at least make comparable..even if not better systems..
You of all are familiar with me from the start..
You have seen my posts at the beginning and their tone..
and now..
Wonder what caused the change..?