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PAF vs. IAF Analysis- Air Combat Over the Subcontinent

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Dont make personel attacks and answer my questions!! And first learn to spell "Idiot"(RAJA):rofl: correctly!!
 
... u are such a Thick Head...

... First and foremost I am tired of u guys who always bring china into the foray as if chinese doesn't have their own agenda or may u don't have enough to talk about Pakistan...

... When it comes to those thinks...BS..they have nothing to prove expect a possible improvement in Indian Arsenal to improve it...

... Scared of Pakistan army...U must be either high of BS or might be under influence of drugs coz U out number u in every walk of life let alone army...

... and India is a responsible citizen of the world and u are a Terrorist State and with Nuclear Weapons hence we need to think twice

... And U Beg for money throughout the world where as Indian economy is far fledged

... So Take A Walk Ediot

MOD we have already had enuf this guys BS on this forum, kindly send someone to change his nappy, it stinks beyond our imagination now.:pakistan:
 
... u are such a Thick Head...
... First and foremost I am tired of u guys who always bring china into the foray as if chinese doesn't have their own agenda or may u don't have enough to talk about Pakistan...
... When it comes to those thinks...BS..they have nothing to prove expect a possible improvement in Indian Arsenal to improve it...
... Scared of Pakistan army...U must be either high of BS or might be under influence of drugs coz U out number u in every walk of life let alone army...
... and India is a responsible citizen of the world and u are a Terrorist State and with Nuclear Weapons hence we need to think twice
... And U Beg for money throughout the world where as Indian economy is far fledged
... So Take A Walk Ediot
All those "indigenous" weapons and research programmes, but India is still too scared of little "terrorist state" Pakistan armed only with Chinese "junk".

I feel sorry for you kids, it must burn you up pretty bad that even though you outnumber "terrorist state" Pakistan 3:1 you can't do anything except cry on the internet.

Oh well. Maybe one day your "superpower" country will be brave enough to go to war with the weak little "terrorist state" Pakistan.

Until then, all you can do is go back to BR and cry some more with your kindergarten friends over there. When you decide to grow up, you can come back here. Bye.
 
All those "indigenous" weapons and research programmes, but India is still too scared of little "terrorist state" Pakistan armed only with Chinese "junk".

I feel sorry for you kids, it must burn you up pretty bad that even though you outnumber "terrorist state" Pakistan 3:1 you can't do anything except cry on the internet.

Oh well. Maybe one day your "superpower" country will be brave enough to go to war with the weak little "terrorist state" Pakistan.

Until then, all you can do is go back to BR and cry some more with your kindergarten friends over there. When you decide to grow up, you can come back here. Bye.

DONT FEED THE TROLL :hitwall:
 
DONT FEED THE TROLL :hitwall:

I was about to tell him to improve his English because he sounds like a moron, but you're totally correct, my fellow Pakistanis, please do take zombie's wise advice and do not feed the troll.
 
sir some of the points needs to be verified:
1-j10 by 2009 for paf ,how many would that be ,what is the technical details and turnover number for that aircraft.?

2-the paf will catch up with the iaf in 2012 in the current confirguration as stated by the article that is 3 -4 more years what makes the paf think that iaf will be doing nothing in terms of modernasation in these 3 years.

3-russian and soviet technology is less reliable and less effective and that the chinse technology is much better,ok fine on which western technology are the chinse planes designed, what kind of engines,airframe, ammunition does the chinese use and whats the origin ? i think its mostly russian technology.

4-the great red flag exercises what to say i think if the us were not so wary of the flanker they would not have invited the iaf for participation with that particular plane.how do you expect the americans to even acknowledge that someone else other than them can also build a plane.?dosent pakistan already know of the american backstabbing and double standards.

5-paf has better pilots and technical staff thats true it is accepted worldwide

6-pakistan having western aircrafts ok as the things are going in the next 5 years iaf will have majorly israeli and us technology that will be much higher than what the paf will posses.ust think paf is upgrading its f-16 to bloc 52 what if the iaf decides to buy the f-16IN for mrca which f-16 will be a better plane<still i think pakistan will have an advantage because of its experience in handling and iaf will be new to it>still its a matter that paf should bear in mind.

7- incase of a conflict does pakistani leadership have the diplomatic will to deal with india just imagine what happened in kargil, pakistan was woefull in diplomatic conduct in regards to india, what role did paf play there nothing.
so in case of a war its also important how you conduct it.

8- iaf wont conduct airstrikes from its forward bases just consider the range of its flankers and mirages.

9-- in noways do you compare the mirage roses with mirage 2000-09 they belong to complete different generation of fighters.you cannot change the fighter generation by just upgrading it.


now just look as some of IAF shortcomings which the writer missed:-

1--iaf best fighter su30mki are still new and iaf does not have experience in flying sukhois because they always chose mig fighters.
its takes 10-15 years to master such technically advanced jets in that case paf has superiority.

2--
its difficult for iaf to get complete air dominance because of not the paf fighters but better radar techs and g2a sams that would hurt iaf more than paf fighters.

3--the arrival of awacs by pakistan would make iaf vulnerable so they need to target and destroy them first which would be highly improbable.



a very important point that the writer failed to mention is the use of dedicated satellited in future conflict while india is party to the russian GLONASS which can highly help in accurate targetting and better conduction of air strikes.paf still has to catch upto iaf in this regard. the indian space program is highly advancing and if they incorporate someof the elements from their space program into military use it can be really deadly. the indians have the help of both russian and american help in their space program so paf needs to work on that front also quickly.:agree:

thanx

Excellent observation. Had to agree with most of the points:cheers:
 
RajParadise

You have got me confused with all these "facts" of yours that I don't even know where to begin. But I think in doing so you have confused YOURself even more than me.

First of all I would like to say, on what bases are you comparing PAF and IAF?. If its on numbers, then yes IAF is way ahead, it was way ahead in 1965, 1971 etc etc. But I don't think the numbers mattered in either of those wars, and thus the results in Pakistans favour.

Here I will answer your major questions that have been bothering you for a while...

Can India project war, yes it can do that to any country... including Pakistan, but it will have consequences.

Will India acheive air supermacy with current configeration, yes it will... but only on an airforce such Afghanistans.

How and why, well first of all the PAF doctrine is defensive. So that means the PAF will rarely venture out to India for a BBQ. So why do you keep on giving us all the usuall bull $hit. The only thing that you might have stated that was true (compared to the rest of the BS) were the numbers of and different aircrafts in the IAF, and again like I mentioned they don't matter one bit... why? Because they will be neutralized by the SAM, Awacs and defensive tactics.

The first thing that you are doing wrong is thinking that there is going to be a war in the near future. This is not a game of Army men played by 3rd grade kids.

Secondly

Can Pakistan wage war, ofcoarse. But again with dire consequences.

Can Pakistan achieve air superiority over India no, firstly because their doctrine is defensive, and secondly ofcoarse IAF is a good deterent.

Thirdly

Does Pakistan have the capability to thewart any Indian aggression on their soil, yes they do. Does Pakistan possess the capability to achieve air superiority over their own territory, again yes they do. So there goes the talk about who is better and whos not. Arguments like that are useless, and only give answers to, again kids in 3rd grade. IAF is good for its peacefull needs and so is PAF. At the moment IAF doesn't have the capability to wage a successfull war against a professional adversary such as PAF. And the same goes for PAF

When Indians claim that LCA was amazing and 4.5 gen, while clearly its not... makes me trust your claims less and less. When Pakistanis claim that JF-17 is in the same league as F-16 A/B, I can bet you thats an understatment.

On what basis are you telling me that Phalcons will walk all over Erieye, oh right I forgot because they are gonna be dog fighting and ofcoarse Phalcons are the dominant ones with their super power load of Brahmos... RIGHT!! puf

Your posts started from very entertaining (comparable to watching Rambo!) to extremely rude when you started insulting other members. Just shows me how imature you are!

Conclusion

Stop it, your posts reak of bull $hit, give them a wash down. And go do your homework on history, oh right you don't have any because you are still in Grade 3.
 
I did not realize what I wrote was worth 20 pages of discussion, bipartisanship and a running battle of insults. We actually decided to take out the comment function because of all the insults (over 100 comments worth). My bottom line, no-brainer conclusion was simply that the IAF cannot achieve air-superiority over Pakistan, is that so hard to believe?
 
Sgt Automatic:

Its quiet imperative that u either lost u r mind o just trying to troll. So, let me help you in understanding the underlying abstract idea of my perception towards the thread which was put for debate.

1) Firstly, I don't speculate anything because I rely on concrete substance with impeccable backing of facts, so

... I appreciate the fact that u opined about Indian air superiority atleast in terms of numbers and I never rebutted the notion of Pakistan's deterrence capabilities as its war doctrine is defensive. I was merely emphasizing the probabilities in an eventuality. To make u understand as a 3rd grade student,

... Currently Pakistan lacks advanced BVR fighter planes where as Mig 21-Bis and Su30-MKI are quiet capable BVR capable fighters.

... Please check the forum regarding the thread on the competency of Phalcons and please don't compare them to Saab erieye.

... Untested JF-17, J10 with F-16 in your fleet with Su30MKI, Mirage and 126 Rafale/Mig 35's (and I am not even counting the entire MIG fleet, Jaguars and probably LCA Block -II) will be hard to be contained as long as we can deplete Pakistan's SAM capabilities.

P.S: Please don't raise the nuclear bombs concept because India has many more nuclear weapons than Pakistan which would substantiate my emphasis of Capabilities of Indian Airforce.

... kiddo
 
Sgt Automatic:

Its quiet imperative that u either lost u r mind o just trying to troll. So, let me help you in understanding the underlying abstract idea of my perception towards the thread which was put for debate.

1) Firstly, I don't speculate anything because I rely on concrete substance with impeccable backing of facts, so

... I appreciate the fact that u opined about Indian air superiority atleast in terms of numbers and I never rebutted the notion of Pakistan's deterrence capabilities as its war doctrine is defensive. I was merely emphasizing the probabilities in an eventuality. To make u understand as a 3rd grade student,

... Currently Pakistan lacks advanced BVR fighter planes where as Mig 21-Bis and Su30-MKI are quiet capable BVR capable fighters.

... Please check the forum regarding the thread on the competency of Phalcons and please don't compare them to Saab erieye.

... Untested JF-17, J10 with F-16 in your fleet with Su30MKI, Mirage and 126 Rafale/Mig 35's (and I am not even counting the entire MIG fleet, Jaguars and probably LCA Block -II) will be hard to be contained as long as we can deplete Pakistan's SAM capabilities.

P.S: Please don't raise the nuclear bombs concept because India has many more nuclear weapons than Pakistan which would substantiate my emphasis of Capabilities of Indian Airforce.

... kiddo

I am sorry that I lost my cool over this, its just that they way you write things and state them, that I got really enoyed. Especially how you were rude to other members.

So lets start this again as a professional discussion!

You see Mr Raj, you seem to have double standards. (one of the reasons for my unneeded hostile post written earlier)

Untested JF-17, J10 with F-16 in your fleet with Su30MKI, Mirage and 126 Rafale/Mig 35's (and I am not even counting the entire MIG fleet, Jaguars and probably LCA Block -II) will be hard to be contained as long as we can deplete Pakistan's SAM capabilities.

At first you say that JF-17, J10 is "Untested" and than you state that PAF wouldn't be able to handel the Rafales and Mig 35s?? Clearly they are also not battle tested. But just as general knowledge I know that Russian planes are of good quality and a force to be reckon with! But the same goes for the Chinese products, they don't just make cheap copies..., clearly they drive the tech from tested platforms and make them even better, platforms such as, SU27, F-16, Lavi!!. And ofcoarse you are not going to mention LCA Block -II because its still in testing phase!!

Please check the forum regarding the thread on the competency of Phalcons and please don't compare them to Saab erieye.

Oh come on now, are you mocking me?? How can you say that, that I was comparing the two, when I was clearly pointing out to YOU that comparing them is useless because you decided to say in an earlier post that Phalcon was superior to Erieye. You see you don't have to spend alot of money on brand name stuff if you can work it out just as good with no name stuff!! Thats why comparing them is waste of time.

Anyhow you are correct about how India surpasses Pakistan in BVR tech AT THE MOMENT. If there was a fight between the two, India will have the advantage, but India has always had an advantage.

You do realize that by the time India gets MRCA jets, Pakistan will have acquired F-16 MLU - this is clearly on the same league as SU30MKI and its definately better in BVR because of its missiles which are superior to those used by an SU30MKI. Pakistan will have even more JF-17s, these are also BVR capabable. And ofcoarse the FC-20, which again are on the same level as the SU30MKI.

And ofcoarse the talk comes to the numbers game. Well the numbers are only really going to matter if india launches a huge air campaign against Pakistan like they did in 1965 and 1971. But we all know these days thats gonna be a foolish decision because, India needs to keep a huge arsnel of planes on the other borders especially the chinese!

If India really wants to have a decisive victory in air over pakistan, they need to acquire atleast twice as many more jets in the league of 4.5gen, only than can I say that they will have respective victories over Pakistan!

Now to the Pakistani members, I gotta say that you guys are not giving credit to the IAF where its due. Especially the Mig 21 Bisons deserve alot of respect since they are BVR capabale, although PAF is capabale of countring them they still deserve credit because at the moment I don't think the F7-PG are confirmed BVR capable.

This is purly my opinion. I believe that atleast a few squadrons of F7-PG are BVR capabale.
 
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