PAF employs air-to-air refuelling skill

[Siddiqui A]

How many of the Il-78 refuellers does the PAF currently have?

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

How many of the Il-78 refuellers does the PAF currently have?

One........

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

One........

But we are expected to get 4-5 more wasn't it ?

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

But we are expected to get 4-5 more wasn't it ?

3 more dear sir.

PAF to Complete Induction of 4 Ilyushin Il-78MP Aircraft by 2010: Air Marshal​

ONLINE - International News Network

 

[Siddiqui A]

do you have any idea on their expected delievery dates...ooops sorrydidnt see the link to the news...thanks

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

the remaining 3 tankers will be delivered sometime in June of this year

 

[TexasJohn]

the remaining 3 tankers will be delivered sometime in June of this year

Here goes: I'm trying to envision where and when these tankers could be used best in the case of Pakistan. In the case of the USAF luckily, every combat zone we were in, we had complete air superiority. Even if it was not 100% it was enough.

Pakistan has a very narrow airspace.

Let's say there is a combat situation with Pakistan and "you know who", what are the possible scenarios where these tankers can be effective force multipliers?

I don't know that answer, maybe we can rope in a few PAF veterans. Our very own Murad may very well have some ideas. It's OK to wargame this. No OPSEC violated here.

For starters, educate me on the deep strike planes you have. I know of the Mirages, F-7s and maybe a few F-16s. Are there others? remember as it stands here and today, we can count out the 16s/ IL mix.

The tankers would have to stay out of range against air-superiority fighters, or you have to provide an escort. The Phalcon AWACs the Indians aquired can see deep into Pakistani airspace so they would always know where the tankers are.

Neither of the Air Forces have absolute superiority. You see where I am going with this.

I'm unclear about a lot and need some sensible input.

 

[fatman17]

ASIA PACIFIC
Date Posted: 25-Mar-2010


Jane's Defence Weekly


Pakistan tests air-to-air refuelling capability

Farhan Bokhari JDW Correspondent - Islamabad

The Pakistan Air Force (PAF) on 21 March formally demonstrated its newly acquired mid-air refuelling capability for the first time, using one of its four Ilyushin Il-76 strategic transport aircraft purchased from Ukraine.

The event was part of the PAF's exercise 'High Mark 2010', which focuses on the service's ability to function in co-ordination with the army.

According to senior Pakistani defence ministry officials, the first Il-76 has been inducted in the PAF while another three are likely to be inducted by the end of this year.

PAF officials said that two fighter aircraft flew alongside the Il-76 and were successfully refuelled. Although PAF officials did not name the aircraft that were refuelled nor the exact location of the event, Western defence officials in Islamabad said they were likely to either be US-supplied F-16s or JF-17 'Thunder' combat aircraft, which Pakistan has built with China.

"The refuelling went ahead smoothly. This exercise demonstrates that the refuelling capacity is well integrated," a PAF official told Jane's .

In the past 18 months, the PAF has assumed an increasingly central role in Pakistan's anti-militant operations, focused in areas along the Afghan border. PAF officials say that their ability to strike targets with precision has helped to significantly reduce troop casualties in battles that have raged between Taliban militants and Pakistani forces.

 

[DANGER-ZONE]

Here goes: I'm trying to envision where and when these tankers could be used best in the case of Pakistan. In the case of the USAF luckily, every combat zone we were in, we had complete air superiority. Even if it was not 100% it was enough.

Pakistan has a very narrow airspace.

Let's say there is a combat situation with Pakistan and "you know who", what are the possible scenarios where these tankers can be effective force multipliers?

I don't know that answer, maybe we can rope in a few PAF veterans. Our very own Murad may very well have some ideas. It's OK to wargame this. No OPSEC violated here.

For starters, educate me on the deep strike planes you have. I know of the Mirages, F-7s and maybe a few F-16s. Are there others? remember as it stands here and today, we can count out the 16s/ IL mix.

The tankers would have to stay out of range against air-superiority fighters, or you have to provide an escort. The Phalcon AWACs the Indians aquired can see deep into Pakistani airspace so they would always know where the tankers are.

Neither of the Air Forces have absolute superiority. You see where I am going with this.

I'm unclear about a lot and need some sensible input.

and our fighters can go deeper in India and PHALCON is nothing for them.

 

[mean_bird]

Strange it did not occur to Janes and those western defense analysts they are quoting that it could very well have been the Mirages what were fitted with refueling pods?

or am I missing something?

 

[TexasJohn]

Yanked the words right out of my mouth..

 

[qsaark]

Strange it did not occur to Janes and those western defense analysts they are quoting that it could very well have been the Mirages what were fitted with refueling pods?

or am I missing something?

I think part of the credit of this 'half baked story' goes to the Islamabad based Mr. Farhan Bokhari JDW Correspondent, and half to the JDW editorial board who let his story published without proper investigation/revision.

First of all, the PAF purchased IL-78MP, indeed a derivative of IL-76 but not IL-76 by itlsef. Secondly F-16 is not refueled by probe-n-drogue system unless of course PAF has purchased some specialized kits for her F-16s. Not much can be said about the JF-17, maybe yes, maybe no, as so far we have not seen any photo of a JF-17 equipped with a probe. The Mirages were the most obvious candidates but were not even mentioned in that piece of news.

Sometimes I really get puzzled; what is so special about this refueling thing? Its not 'Project Manhattan'; Several Air Forces around the world have this capability and if we have finally got it, why trying to hide it behind the veil of illogical secrecy? Instead of letting folks like Mr. Farhan Bokhari (or even myself for that matter) coming up with speculative stories, why the PAF does not go ahead and tell clearly about this capability and releases couple of official snapshots? end of the story!

 

[kashith]

and our fighters can go deeper in India and PHALCON is nothing for them.

Truly speaking ,with such a small airspace Pak does not needs a tanker.I mean if the fighters would have to refuel ,they will have to get back in Pak airspace anyway.The only advantage is they can reduce the turnaround time for refuelling and stuff.This will not provide too great improvement in range of PAF fighters.
a more likely scenario where these tankers are of advantage would be if PAF fighters take off with a really heavy load to strike decreasing the fuel they carry to increase the strike power.
And anyways with 400 KM range of Falcons,India can see the tanker and bring it down using air superiority fighters or even SAM like s-300.

 

[Mani2020]

could be, on this subject i am not 100% sure

in mid 1980s the PIA transferred 2-3 of them which were converted. By now, these aircrafts are quite old; but maybe they still have some service life left in them

before the transfer of airbus 310 from PIA to PAF one of these boeing 707 carried out the role of taking Presidentsand Prime minister to visiting countries but now they all are used for heavy lift

 

[TexasJohn]

So they are still in service then? That would be about right. I see KC-135s flying here all the time. That is one ageless plane like the B-52..