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Our Hero Is Raja Dahir Not Muhammad Bin Qasim, Haji Adeel- ANP

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Qoumi Quideen key Khilaf bed-kalami Qabl e muzamat hey

please go to
;youtube.com/tv786#p/u/14/ZVO4J812krY
we hate Haji adeel , Hasan Nisar & all other spreading similar non-seance.:blah::blah::blah::devil:
 
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And not to forget Krishna Raja ("Hyder Ali" - Father of Tipu Sultan defeated him) is considered Villain in Pakistan and Hero in India :rofl:

Now what do you say about Krishna Raja? whom Hyder Ali defated?

and when was i wrong before? :rofl::rofl::rofl:

Well i assume you are not the best historian otherwise. History is/was one of my favourite subject and i have read about Hyder Ali in very detail.

those (in india) who knows about both personalities in depth does not like Hyder Ali. Like someone said there is a large population of India who does not like Hyder Ali and other parts of india does.

Let me tell you a brief story:

If Hyder Ali was born in today's Pakistan and done exactly same what he did in his era he may have been considered a military dictator :lol: That is because he overthrown the government of Hindu Raja and established his own Kingdom.

The story is very long but at one stage that Hindu raja that i believe is named as Krishna Raja had ordered to arrest Hyder Ali and one of his Spy (who used to roam around the city disguised as a "FAKEER" a begger man) had already told him about this. He had learnt all ways to exit the city has already been blocked and soon there will be a raid in his house to arrest him. He disguised into other clothes and had to flee the city through the river. Its a long story how he reached other city (i forgot now) and invaded his own raja by through the military power. Its a very long story and i read the whole book on it. But all i can say is those who knows all the facts do consider him a villain in india and Hero to another Hindu raja.

Happens Sir everybody can have their own opinions

The fact that history was your favourite subject does not mean you were any good at it. You have been going on about Krishna Raja whose story seems to be known only to you. I live in Bangalore which was part of the Mysore state which Hyder Ali & Tipu Sultan ruled and while there were many Krishna Raja Wodeyar's who preceded and later succeeded Tipu Sultan, I have never heard of this hero Krishna Raja who Hyder Ali is supposed to have defeated. Both Hyder Ali & Tipu sultan are considered Indian heroes for fighting the British.

Since you are a keen student of history you may find the following interesting:

Hyder Ali and Tipu Sultan

During this period, Hyder Ali, who joined the army as a foot soldier, came to prominence. By many accounts, he enjoyed the confidence of Maharaja Krishnaraja Wodeyar II, and hence essayed a meteoric rise in the affairs of the Kingdom. During the minority of Maharaja Nanjaraja Wodeyar, Hyder Ali rose to become the de facto ruler of the state, retaining the Wodeyars as nominal rulers. His son Tipu Sultan dispensed with this charade and assumed full royal powers. Tipu Sultan prosecuted a brilliant military career; his rule contributed a golden chapter to the history of India. Both Hyder and Tipu brought in many technological innovations, modernizing the Mysorean army and expanding Mysore's foreign trade. They also aligned themselves by and large with the French, whose French East India Company was politically very active in southern India at the time. By the end of the eighteenth century, the Mysore Kingdom found itself in a series of four wars with the British East India Company, which was then expanding its control in India. In 1799 Tipu Sultan was finally defeated by the British in the fourth Mysore War, led by Arthur Wellesley, the future 1st Duke of Wellington. The British, who purported to wage that war in support of the legitimate dynasty, reinstated the Wodeyars on the throne in the person of the 5-year-old Krishnaraja Wodeyar III.

http://www.spiritus-temporis.com/kingdom-of-mysore/hyder-ali-and-tipu-sultan.html
 
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I dont see any difference between American and allied forced occupying Islamic countries and Islamic Invaders occupying Iran, Iraq (bahai faith), pakistan afghanistan (hinduism & Buddhism).

The only conclusion I reach is that "everything comes back in full circle"

And the only similarity I sense is "Invasion".
 
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u have ur own story so i would not respond. i just commented about ANP... And if Raja dahar was so great ruler than y his own people left his side and embraced islam.?? and a man who married his own sister just for kingdom and rule... tells the story about how great hero he was.

History is both cruel and complex.There are no straight forward answers or nothing happened overnight.Those who've become heroes now might not be so when they were around ,but then history is always written by victors.

Here is an well researched and very balanced article written by Khurram Ali Shafique on Raja dahar and Muhammad Bin Qasim.Lets read what he wrote about Muhammad Bin Qasim.

Muhammad bin Qasim


Muhammad bin Qasim was among the finest colonialists in the Arab history, and a worthy soldier. Unfortunately, our modern writers have tried to paint him as a saint, and in the process they have lost all those features that made this Arab general an interesting human being. It is high time we restore his true picture from authentic sources of history written by the earliest Muslim historians.

Muhammad bin Qasim was born around 694 AD (if we are to believe the tradition that he was seventeen when he attacked Sindh in 711 AD). He belonged to the Saqqafi tribe that had originated from Taif in Arabia, and he was also a close relative of Hajjaj bin Yousuf (possibly a second cousin, but not a nephew as narrated in the popular tradition). Much because of the influence of Hajjaj, the young Muhammad bin Qasim was appointed the governor of Persia while in his teens, and it is said that he did a good job at crushing the rebellion in that region. Sometime around the same period he got married to a girl in the Tamim tribe. There is also a popular tradition that presents him as the son-in-law of Hajjaj bin Yousuf, but some scholars discredit this tradition since an authentic pedigree of Hajjaj doesn’t mention any daughter. It is more likely that the young hero was married to a woman of Banu Tamim, and although the name of his wife does not appear in recorded history it is certain that she gave him two sons who later became famous for their own exploits.

When Muhammad bin Qasim invaded Sindh, Hajjaj arranged for special messengers between Basra and Sindh, and told the general never to take any step without his advice. This order was followed to the letter during the campaign. “When you advance in the battle, see that you have the sun behind your backs,” Hajjaj wrote to his cousin just before the famous storming of Debal. “If the sun is at your back then its glare will not prevent you from having a full view of the enemy. Engage in fight immediately, and ask for the help of God. If anyone of the people of Sindh ask for mercy and protection, do give it to them but not to the citizens of Debal, who must all be put to the sword.”


Debal was the first important town in Sindh captured by the Arabs under Muhammad bin Qasim. It is also said that just before the final attack, a Brahmin came out to inform the invaders that the flag on the temple is a talisman and if they strike it down the city will hold no longer. “When the army of Islam scaled the walls of the fort, the Debalese opened the gates and asked for mercy,” says the writer of Chachnameh, the primary source on Muhammad bin Qasim written on the orders of his descendants. “Muhammad bin Qasim replied that he had no orders to spare anyone in the town, and that his soldiers had to do the slaughtering for three days… 700 beautiful females, who were under the protection of the temple, were all captured along with their valuable ornaments and clothes adorned with jewels.” The women and children thus captured from Debal were included in the spoils of the war. Some of them were distributed among the soldiers, while one-fifth was sent to the Caliph through Hajjaj bin Yousuf in accordance to the Islamic law that proclaimed that one-fifth of the spoils of the war belonged to the Caliph for rightful use. These spoils included two daughters of the deceased ruler of Debal, who were handpicked for the Caliph’s harem.


The fate of Debal sent shockwaves across Sindh. People consulted their astrologers, and soon the word was out: fate has ordained the country to fall to the Arabs. It is more likely than not that the Arab invaders sponsored the rumour after seeing at Debal how local superstition could be exploited as a war strategy. The Buddhist population of Sindh was the first to make secret alliances with the Arabs, since they had little stake in the rule of the Brahmin dynasty. Hajjaj Bin Yousuf carefully dictated the Arab terms of mercy to Muhammad bin Qasim all the way from Basra. “Whoever submits to you, let him retain his power and wealth and family,” Hajjaj ordered his cousin. “And whoever does not submit, treat him brutally and torture him till he submits."


This strategy was carried out with great success. Nothing weakens the spirit of a human being more than existing on a borderline of hope and fear. All colonialists have known this fact of human psychology, and exploited it to make traitors of their enemy. The colonialisation of Sindh by the Arabs is a superb example of this policy, and the Arab historians proudly narrate many instances. One such case is the story of Kaka Kotak, a Buddhist of some influence in Siwistan (Sehwan). Kaka made a secret alliance with the Arabs and then went to the Brahmin ruler of the town, telling him that it was written in the ancient books of India that the country of Sindh would fall to the Arabs at a certain time, and that time had now arrived. “Our religion forbids us to shed blood,” the cunning Buddhist told the governor. “We are afraid that when the Arab horde storms the city, they will take us for your followers and deprive us of our life and domestics. We have come to know that Lord Hajjaj, under the orders of the Caliph, has ordered this army to grant pardon to those who ask for it, and the Arabs are said to be faithful to their word.” He then asked for the governor’s permission to make an alliance with the Arabs. When permission was refused, Kaka continued to serve as a spy to the Arabs, and never failed to remind his governor that the fall of Sindh was foretold in books written hundreds of years ago. The governor soon lost hope, and fled to his cousin Raja Dahar while the Arab army marched on and occupied the city. True to their word, they spared the family of Kaka and his friends while the rest of the population was sold into slavery or distributed among the soldiers. Kaka was then raised to the rank of a local chief, something he might not have dreamt of under the Brahmin rulers. “When Kaka put on this dress of honor, all the noblemen in the surrounding places were inspired to accept his influence,” writes the author of Chachnameh. “Kaka secured immunity from the Arab army for those who submitted while he led the Arabs to those who refused to submit, so that the stubborn could be punished.”


Muhammad bin Qasim’s advance towards Dahar was very careful. The Arab ensured that his supply line was safe, moving ahead only after each city on the way was secured in possession and its population either annihilated or won over with generosity. To Hajjaj, who was sitting several thousand miles away, it might have seemed that his cousin was wasting time. “Now give up other towns and march against Dahar,” Hajjaj wrote in a rather frustrated mood. There is a subtle, almost vague indication that Muhammad bin Qasim wanted Raja Dahar to submit to him and rule over Sindh as the Caliph’s viceroy. Hajjaj saw this as a waste of time. “I am shocked at the weakness of your policy,” Hajjaj wrote to him. “People will think that you are trying to bring about peace! You should inspire fear."


“O Men of Arabia,” Muhammad bin Qasim charged his armies to the final contest with Dahar. “These crowds of infidels have come prepared to fight with us. You must use all your strength, for they will put up a furious resistance for the sake of their wealth and families. Ride against them… With the help of God, we hope to make them all food for our sharp swords, take away their wealth and their families, and obtain large booty. Do not show weakness, and remember that God makes the end of the pious happy.”

Dahar was killed at the Battle of Rawar. “It is related that when the fort of Rawar was taken, all the treasures and arms that were in it were secured, except what had been taken away by Dahir’s son Jaisingh,” narrates the author of Chachnameh. “All this booty was brought to Muhammad bin Qasim. The slaves were counted, and their number came to 60,000. Out of these, 30 were young ladies of royal blood including Raja Dahar’s niece whose name was Husna (Sundri). Muhammad bin Qasim sent all these to Hajjaj, together with Dahar’s head, and one-fifth of the booty, as the royal share… When the head of Dahar and women and the treasure were brought to Hajjaj, he placed his forehead on the ground and offered prayers of thanks-giving, saying: Now I have got all the treasures of the world. I rule the world.” It is said that one of Dahar’s wives, Ladi, married Muhammad bin Qasim, but there is another tradition according to which Ladi killed herself by jumping down the rampart when she saw the Arabs.


The conquest of Sindh was completed with occupation of the remaining major cities, especially Brahmanabad and Multan. This brought more serious responsibilities. So far, Sindh was treated as an enemy country, and in his earlier conquests Muhammad bin Qasim had torn down temples, replacing them with mosques. “Now that the people of this land have placed their heads in the yoke of submission,” Hajjaj instructed his general. “I do not see what further rights we have over them beyond the usual tax. Therefore, permit them to build the temples of those they worship. No one is prohibited from, or punished for, following his own religion, and let no one prohibit it, so that these people may live happily in their homes.” This edict of Hajjaj bin Yousuf had a lasting influence in the history of Muslim India. By giving the Buddhists and Hindus the status of “zimmis,” and imposing “protection tax” (or “jizya”) on them, the Arabs had accepted them as “People of the Book,” hence acknowledging both Buddhism and Hinduism as divinely revealed religions. However, the Muslim psychology could never come to terms with the practice of idol-worship by the Hindus. Hence a paradoxical situation existed throughout the Muslim rule in India where Hinduism was accepted as a divinely revealed religion for the purpose of tax collection but was seen as the creed of the infidels in all other matters. It is difficult to conclude from the edict of Hajjaj what he or other Muslims of his age actually thought about Hinduism, but it is obvious that the Arabs as colonialists had to make pragmatic compromises.


Muhammad bin Qasim completed the annexation of Sindh in three years, enlisting a large cohort of loyal followers from the native population. He then prepared plans to annex other states of India, beginning with Qannauj, which lied just across the Rajasthan desert. Of course, these states had given no provocation, and since the Hindus had just been accepted as “People of the Book,” there was no justification of a religious war against them either. But clearly, Muhammad bin Qasim was serving the interests of the Arab Empire as a worldly-wise general.
It was about this time that he lost both of his sponsors at the court. His cousin Hajjaj was the first to die, soon followed by the master himself, Caliph Walid. The successor on throne, Caliph Sulieman bin Abdul Malik, was a generous monarch who owed his throne to the opponents of the late Hajjaj bin Yousuf. Most of these were relatives of people killed or tortured by Hajjaj (some 20,000 women and 50,000 men were found unjustly imprisoned when Hajjaj died). They demanded revenge, and there was no way, nor enough reason, for Sulieman to stop them. Muhamamd bin Qasim was high on the hit list due to his close association with Hajjaj.

It is said that the young general was about to invade an Indian state when the Caliph’s messengers arrived to take him back in chains. True to the soldier’s honor, like always, Muhammad bin Qasim obliged. His followers wept bitterly, warning him that he was going back to a certain death. We don’t know what he said in reply, if he said anything. We do know, however, that shortly afterwards, just before he died of torture in the prison of Wasit, he recited an Arabic couplet to the effect: “They wasted me at the prime of my youth, and what a youth they wasted: the one who was a defender of their borders.”


Muhammad bin Qasim
 
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I dont see any difference between American and allied forced occupying Islamic countries and Islamic Invaders occupying Iran, Iraq (bahai faith), pakistan afghanistan (hinduism & Buddhism).

The only conclusion I reach is that "everything comes back in full circle"

And the only similarity I sense is "Invasion".

Whosoever has POWER and WIll - he will do that. This is law of Jungle and That is true even in 21 Century.

BTW - India is not that powerful that it can invade Pakistan so be mindful while dreaming this.................:no:
 
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That is why MQM is ant ANP and ANP is anti-MQM, ANP is die hard enemy of MQM.

CHeck this out !



He is insulting oeople who migrated from india, which included Liaquat Ali Khan and many more true pakistanis, who fought for pakistan!
 
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Who told Raja Dehar to capture the passing ship of Muslims and abduct Muslim mens, womens and the Muslim childrens? That was key reason of his invasion to Sindh. One of the Muslim women somehow managed to write a letter to the general i think "Hajjaj bin Yousuf" and later on one group was formed to invade Sindh and to release peoples of that caravan.

It was all Raja's fault. Muhammad bin Qasim was probably 16 years old or something like that and there is a long story why he was chosen to lead.....................

Close this stupid thread please

It was not Raja Dahir himself who ordered his army to capture the ships rather there were thugs in the coastal areas of Deebal who looted the ships and Raja Dahir showed inability to control them, calling them non state actors.

Muhammad Bin Qasim's age is also disputed. He was the commander of an army of about 6000 Iraqi and Syrian soldiers that was dispatched to Sindh. Do you really believe that Caliph will trust a 16 year old youngster to lead that big army? In the history books, his age was reduced to glorify his achievements but his actual age is believed to be around 34 when he invaded Sindh.
 
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First of all, Islam is more important to us, Muslim first, then Pakistani!

Secondly, the four Orthodox Caliphs were the Sahaba of the Prophet (pbuh) so we must respect them.

As for us Pakistanis accepting "everything Arab" is a complete joke, though i do agree that there are some Pakistanis that will do anything to make the Arabs happy due to their ignorant thinking that Arabs are a holy and noble race.

I love Islam, but that doesn't mean i want to be Arab! When i look at the state these Arabs have brought themselves into i would never want to be an Arab!

In fact i want my countrymen to get this sort of thinking out of their head that Arabs are our brothers, they back stabbed and the entire Muslim Ummah by betraying the Ottoman Caliphate. Arabs make fun of us, they call us Abeed (meaning slave in Arabic), and they treat us like we're a pile of ****.

The only reason why there is so much religious extremist in Pakistan is because of these Arabs and their strict version of Islam. Burning schools, beating women to death, throwing acid on girls faces, banning education for girls, no rights for women's, and the infamous of them all suicide bombings!

Islam wasn't just for the Arabs, it was for the whole humanity!

Long live Pakistan

:pakistan::pakistan::pakistan:

i agree with you on every thing except the highlighted part..
Arabs are stupid ppl, they have money, oil and they are sleeping.. Lazy Cowards.

But
My friend come to Saudia Arabia i dont think there is any such thing as "Burning schools, beating women to death, throwing acid on girls faces, banning education for girls, no rights for women's, and the infamous of them all suicide bombings"

Now if you call not allowing a women to go out without a veil as no rights for women.. then my friend this is Islam, our religion prohibits this.. moreover women living here prefer to be covered in veil.. i am living here so i know it ...hell she can even take divorce from her husban within a week, her statement against her husband is enough... its just an example.

the rest is western propaganda i agree Arabs being stupids but they are not cruel.

Here we are at more peace than in Pakistan.. it is Pakistani extremist mulla's that have brought these injustices to Islam...it was a Pakistani mentality that created Talibans. Remember if Osama bin Ladin was saudi, the rest of Talibans are not from Arabs, we have Afghani Taliban we have Pakistani Taliban.. there is no concept of Arab taliban.. except a bad fish aka bin ladin.
 
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i dont know why every indian in this thread is basing his argument over G M Syed... who is he to indians?? he is a single man.. or what?
G M Syed said this, G M syed said that...
cm on indians being our adversary u need to do better than that
quoting G M Syed in every argument is ignorance its rubbish, foolish and hypocracy..
 
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Raja Dahir was born in the lands of current Pakistan. He was of Sindhi heritage. Why do you consider him as an enemy of Pakistan? He fought against an attacking force which every ruler will do once attacked. So what’s wrong in that...

The story goes like this, A local hero fought against an invader and was defeated and now the invader has became the hero and the local hero enemy.

He wasn`t an invader.

Raja Dahir was a tyrant, and Sindhis are disgusted by this man, and know he was a tyrant!

The Muslims of Sindh were persecuted, tortured, and abused by this tyrant, and the Caliphate took note of this and retaliated against his heinous actions!

Your Hindutva histortions of history only make you lose credibility, as there are loads of evidence that prove that this tyrant was an extreme violator of human rights!

Muhammad Bin Qasim was an honourable man and fought for honour, mercy, freedom, and Islam! He is well revered as a man of great character and honour!

The early Muslims were the best Muslims and lived with Islam!

Islam is a way of life, and the Muslim is the brother of a Muslim regardless of where he is from!
 
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It was not Raja Dahir himself who ordered his army to capture the ships rather there were thugs in the coastal areas of Deebal who looted the ships and Raja Dahir showed inability to control them, calling them non state actors.

Agree with that - Sorry had forgotten about this part :lol:

Muhammad Bin Qasim's age is also disputed. He was the commander of an army of about 6000 Iraqi and Syrian soldiers that was dispatched to Sindh. Do you really believe that Caliph will trust a 16 year old youngster to lead that big army? In the history books, his age was reduced to glorify his achievements but his actual age is believed to be around 34 when he invaded Sindh.

Wrong - he was 16 and you probably not aware of his Fight against somebody (i think Caliph's son if i am not wrong).

Muhammad bin Qasim had requested the caliph to send him to release those womens and childrens from Raja Dahr or areas of Deebal and Caliph refused and later on it was an agreement among them that if Qasim defeated Caliph's son or somebody who was very famous as a warrior and was a lot elder than him then he can not only participate in the war but also will be a commander of this army and somehow Muhammad bin Qasim managed to defeat him and became the leader of this army.

Thats what i read/heard in the chapters of History

and Allah knows best
 
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You moronic Hindutva fascist!

G.M. Syed is a radical Shia extremist, who hates Sunnis!

Learn your sources before posting nonsensical BS!

Ofcourse he is going to demonize the holy figures of the Sunnis, you shameless distorter of the truth!

Do you want me to start with the dirty secrets of Shiva, and the worship of Shiva Lingam (His penis) by you Hindu extremists who drink cow-piss and worships the penis's of Shiva idols!

Shiva was a tyrant and wanted Hindus to worship his penis!

And I am not making this up, Hindus worship Shiva Lingam (his penis), and drink cow-piss because they also worship cows:

YouTube- Cow Urine Soda | ZapRoot


answer the post with arguement..............no need to abuse someones religious feelings.
 
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answer the post with arguement..............no need to abuse someones religious feelings.

We don't need to. We don't want to debate here about our beliefs with you or any body like this G M Syed.

:disagree:
 
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