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Our Hero Is Raja Dahir Not Muhammad Bin Qasim, Haji Adeel- ANP

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I've heard otherwise...

Anyway, by any counts, Dahir can't be counted as a Hero, simply because he was an evil man. His power was usurped, upon conquest of Aror and Lower Sindh - he ruled over a Buddhist majority imposing rituals of Hinduism.

Mohammad Bin Qasim was just better, had a more organized and better equipped force to defeat Dahir's huge army and of course since the locals were disgruntled, he even had local help.

Mohammad Bin Qasim, by standards of those days showed too much leniency to the point where his methods of leniency were often questioned by his superiors. Especially for his declaration for sparing those who put down their arms (back then you even had to pledge to fight in the way of your conqueror, not just surrender).

It was a different time. Some might say his tales were heroic. He did what others failed before him (someone mentioned 14 times?) and as far as I remember I think his expedition was deemed just as hopeless as Arabs were losing their heart to fight in South Asia. Who knows, if he would've lost, Shahabuddin Ghauri might not have dared to go into battle with Prithvi Raj.

Prithvi Raj's Tales I'm told are almost demigod like.

None of these people are heroes in the modern day Superman sense. They just had an effect on history that brought a positive change from the Pakistani perspective.

I dont count Dahar as a hero, ANP does. I was just trying to examine the reasons for choosing a foreign invader as a hero over your own ruler, apart from religious preferences of course.

And you are right, Prithvi Raj is sort of a hero in Indian history. Again not the religious angle but more like the invader v/s native defender angle. A la Alexander v/s Porus.
 
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Who told Raja Dehar to capture the passing ship of Muslims and abduct Muslim mens, womens and the Muslim childrens? That was key reason of his invasion to Sindh. One of the Muslim women somehow managed to write a letter to the general i think "Hajjaj bin Yousuf" and later on one group was formed to invade Sindh and to release peoples of that caravan.

It was all Raja's fault. Muhammad bin Qasim was probably 16 years old or something like that and there is a long story why he was chosen to lead.....................

Close this stupid thread please

There several versions to this theory that he captured Muslim mens, womens and the Muslim children .I've given two writers who clearly dispute this accusations before .I'm giving one more writer who too disputes this aspect .Keep it mind that these are all good Muslims of Pakistan.


Pakistan News Service - PakTribune

No Tombstone for the Hero?
Monday February 22, 2010 (1455 PST)
Anwaar Hussain


The text books that are taught to Pakistani children recount exploits of numerous past Muslim heroes in them. Standing tall amongst these heroes is one Arab by the name of Muhammad bin Qasim, born on 31 December 695 in the city of Taif in modern day Saudi Arabia.

Following are just some of the tokens of Pakistanis’ veneration for their hero.

He is sometimes called “the first Pakistani”. Port Qasim, Pakistan’s second major port is named in his honor. PNS Qasim is the name of a Pakistani Naval ship. Pakistan Army Aviation’s home base is called Qasim Base. Qasim is a fairly common first name for Pakistani male children. The day of Yom-e-Babul Islam is observed each year in Pakistan in memory of Muhammad bin Qasim.

Now let us see what we are told about this hero and what we are not.

We are told that Muhammad bin Qasim was an Umayyad general who conquered the Sindh and Punjab regions, now a part of Pakistan, along the Indus River. That at the tender age of just seventeen, he was sent by Caliph Al-Walid-I to lead an army towards South Asia to release Muslim women and children who were kidnapped by the Hindu Raja of the time. That it was due to his conquest of Sindh and Punjab that the era of Islamic rule in South Asia was first launched in real earnest. This much we are told. This much Pakistani children are supposed to memorize and be examined in.

What we are not told is that the kidnapping event of women and children, though a historical happening by itself, may have been only a part of the legend. That the Umayyad interest in the region may have stemmed more from their desire to control the trade route down the Indus River valley to the seaports of Sindh, an important link in the ancient Silk Road, than any thing else. That on certain earlier occasions too, they had unsuccessfully sought to gain control of the route, via the Khyber Pass, from the Turki-Shahis of Gandhara. That by taking Sindh, Gandhara’s southern neighbor, they were ultimately able to open a second front against the Gandhara.


We are also not told some of the other possible reasons for this campaign. That the locals of the region had targeted Sassanid shipping in the past, from the mouth of the Tigris to the Sri Lankan coast, from their bases at Kutch, Debal and Kathiawar. That the real reason of the campaign may have been purely economic in which the kidnapping of women and children was but one fateful act of these semi-nomadic tribes whose activities disturbed much of the Empire’s shipping trade in the Western Indian Ocean. That the kidnapping incident only provided a ‘just’ reason to the rising power of the Umayyad Caliphate to gain a foothold in the Makran, Baluchistan and Sindh regions–an area that the Empire builders had been eyeing for a rather long time by then. That one other possible reason for the campaign could be the policy of the local tribes of providing refuge to Sassanid and Arab rebels who fled the Arab advance and the accompanied Umayyad persecution in a quest to consolidate their rule. This we are not told.


We are told that he treated most kindly his new subjects when he became their governor. What we are not told is that where resistance was strong, long-drawn-out and rigorous, Muhammad bin Qasim’s response was rather ruthless. By credible accounts, he inflicted 6,000 deaths at Rawar, between 6,000 and 26,000 at Brahmanabad, 4,000 at Iskalandah and 6,000 at Multan. And that he built many mosques upon the sites of razed Hindu temples.


We are told that his nemesis Raja Dahir was a cruel and unjust ruler and was involved in piracy. That he was the one that kidnapped and tortured the women and children and refused to recant. That he was an immoral man who married his own sister.

What we are not told is that Raja Dahir is also admired by many present day Sindhi Sunni and Shia Muslims. That he had given shelter in Sindh to a well-known follower of Imam Hussian, Muhammad Bin Allafi–a man much sought by the Umayyad in their deadly hunt for eliminating the last of the Ahl-e-Bait (Prophet Muhammad’s immediate family). That, according to some very believable sources, Dahir had even offered asylum to Hussain ibn Ali, the grandson of Prophet Mohammed, who was being persecuted at home. That as a result of this offer, Hussain was on his way to Sindh when he was seized at Karbala in Iraq and killed most viciously. That according to G.M. Syed, the grand old man of Sindh, “the Sindhis weep for Hussain ibn Ali and they weep for Raja Dahir Sen.” This we are not told.

But above all what we are not told is the manner of this hero’s death and the events leading up to the occasion.

Chachnama is an authentic document that recounts the history of Sindh in great details. It tells of an intriguing yet widely believed tale of Muhammad bin Qasim’s death.

According to this account, when Raja Dahir was killed in the battlefield, his daughters were captured as war booty in the Islamic tradition. The Governor, Muhammad bin Qasim, then sent them as ‘presents’ to the Caliph of the time Khalifa Sulayman ibn Abd al-Malik, to become a part of his vast harem. According to the narration, the women tricked the Khalifa into believing that Muhammad bin Qasim had violated them before sending them on. The Khalifa got so incensed for having been sent ‘tainted’ gifts that he ordered Muhammad bin Qasim to be wrapped in oxen hides and returned to Syria, his exploits not withstanding. The journey resulted in his death from suffocation. This version attributes the women’s motive for the ploy to exacting vengeance for their father’s death. It also states that upon discovering the trick after the death of Muhammad bin Qasim, the Khalifa deeply repented his action and ordered the sisters buried alive in a wall as a punishment.

The Persian historian Baladhuri, however, states that the Khalifa Abd al-Malik was a political enemy of Umayyad governor Al-Hajjaj ibn Yusuf, Muhammad bin Qasim’s paternal uncle. He persecuted all those who were considered close to Hajjaj after his death. Muhammad bin Qasim was therefore recalled in the midst of a campaign of capturing more territory up north. An honorable man, he reported to his Caliph despite his loyal friends dissuading him from it. Upon arrival, he was promptly imprisoned in Mosul, Iraq. Intensely cruel torture on him started immediately afterwards. So severe was this torture that Muhammad bin Qasim breathed his last during the most extreme of sessions one hot July afternoon.

Whichever account is true, we are told none of these.

Two facts, however, remain undisputed. He was 22 years old when he was killed by his own Caliph. None have read the tombstone marking his grave for none know where he lies.

No Tombstone for the Hero? | Truth Spring
 
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from your discussion i can sense anybody who was born in India is considered Hero in Indian history and any foreign invader (no matter if he was right or wrong) is considered Villain :rofl::rofl::rofl:

Absolutely. Don't find anything wrong with that.

The reason for that is not hard to understand, if you try. Historical events are seldom seen with a neutral eye. Hence Its best to support your own against an invader, however good intentioned he might be. :azn:
 
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Muhammad Bin Qasim got a violent death is that true?
i heard that daughters of Raja Dahir done revenge i don know the full story.
 
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Your post

The keywords in this post i notice are,

May, possible =============== and the myth continues :lol:

Some peoples just want publicity.............. As we say in urdu "Jitnay log utni batain". The view i shared in my earlier posts is the most common view in history. Majority of the peoples believes Raja Darh kidnapped the whole Muslim caravan and that laid the foundations of the invasion on Sindh. As last time i read "The majority rules" :smokin:
 
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Who told Raja Dehar to capture the passing ship of Muslims and abduct Muslim mens, womens and the Muslim childrens?

That is all a made up story. Lots of Sindhis does not agree with this story...
 
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Muhammad Bin Qasim got a violent death is that true?
i heard that daughters of Raja Dahir done revenge i don know the full story.

i don't know if they were daughters of the raja dehr or somebody else. They were 2 in total and accused Muhammad Bin Qasim for raping her or trying to rape her something like that and the Muslim ruler ordered to hang him (covered him in something i can't remember) so he was dead. Later on one of the girl felt bad and accepted that she lied before and Muhammad bin Qasim was a good and innocent man. There was no such incident took place among them so the ruler killed both girls also.

Muhammad bin Qasim was very young when he died probably not even reached in his 20s if i am not wrong.

Its a long story One of the official ran to the place where he was to be killed to save him but when he reached he saw the corpse of qasim. If he had reached a while before it was possible he may have survived........... Very emotional story if you read in depth - i just touched the ending part of that story very briefly
 
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Muhammad Bin Qasim got a violent death is that true?
i heard that daughters of Raja Dahir done revenge i don know the full story.

totally wrong... Muhammad bin Qasim died in Iraq not in sind so no chance of Dahar's daughters revenge story..
 
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Muhammad Bin Qasim got a violent death is that true?
i heard that daughters of Raja Dahir done revenge i don know the full story.

I think he died an old man. Or was that Khalid-bin Walid?
 
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when i read the title of this thread i knew some indian member would have created this nonsense/idiotic thread

Muhammad bin Qasim was a great leader of Islam who (in his teenage) defeated Cruel Raja Dehr. Chapter Closed

Defending his own country from the offender is called cruelty? Sindh was rich and peaceful at that time. :pop:

i don't know if they were daughters of the raja dehr or somebody else. They were 2 in total and accused Muhammad Bin Qasim for raping her or trying to rape her something like that and the Muslim ruler ordered to hang him (covered him in something i can't remember) so he was dead. Later on one of the girl felt bad and accepted that she lied before and Muhammad bin Qasim was a good and innocent man. There was no such incident took place among them so the ruler killed both girls also.

Muhammad bin Qasim was very young when he died probably not even reached in his 20s if i am not wrong.

Its a long story One of the official ran to the place where he was to be killed to save him but when he reached he saw the corpse of qasim. If he had reached a while before it was possible he may have survived........... Very emotional story if you read in depth - i just touched the ending part of that story very briefly

Rite. He was only 20 at the time of his death.
 
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Too lame an argument for a senior member. :smokin:

oh i thought Majority rules :lol: is it not the case in India? Sorry i was mistaken :confused:

That is all a made up story. Lots of Sindhis does not agree with this story...

Which sindhi are you talking about....... ever met with a sindhi?
 
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Muhammad Bin Qasim got a violent death is that true?
i heard that daughters of Raja Dahir done revenge i don know the full story.

There are two counts as put by Anwaar Hussain in the above article.

According to this account, when Raja Dahir was killed in the battlefield, his daughters were captured as war booty in the Islamic tradition. The Governor, Muhammad bin Qasim, then sent them as ‘presents’ to the Caliph of the time Khalifa Sulayman ibn Abd al-Malik, to become a part of his vast harem. According to the narration, the women tricked the Khalifa into believing that Muhammad bin Qasim had violated them before sending them on. The Khalifa got so incensed for having been sent ‘tainted’ gifts that he ordered Muhammad bin Qasim to be wrapped in oxen hides and returned to Syria, his exploits not withstanding. The journey resulted in his death from suffocation. This version attributes the women’s motive for the ploy to exacting vengeance for their father’s death. It also states that upon discovering the trick after the death of Muhammad bin Qasim, the Khalifa deeply repented his action and ordered the sisters buried alive in a wall as a punishment.

The Persian historian Baladhuri, however, states that the Khalifa Abd al-Malik was a political enemy of Umayyad governor Al-Hajjaj ibn Yusuf, Muhammad bin Qasim’s paternal uncle. He persecuted all those who were considered close to Hajjaj after his death. Muhammad bin Qasim was therefore recalled in the midst of a campaign of capturing more territory up north. An honorable man, he reported to his Caliph despite his loyal friends dissuading him from it. Upon arrival, he was promptly imprisoned in Mosul, Iraq. Intensely cruel torture on him started immediately afterwards. So severe was this torture that Muhammad bin Qasim breathed his last during the most extreme of sessions one hot July afternoon.
 
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I think he died an old man. Or was that Khalid-bin Walid?

The funny thing is that i am debating with those peoples who does not know anything about Qasim or Raja dahr :rofl:

Yes that was Khalid bin Walid and not Muhammad bin Qasim
 
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