Nomination of DG ISI is my authority: PM Imran Khan says in cabinet meeting today

[Norwegian]

This whole DG ISI reports to the PM nonsense should also (constitutionally) end. It makes for an incredible confusing structure.

Agreed. This is crux of the problem. Bhutto setup a whole political division in ISI. This should be abolished. ISI should completely come under and stay within military control. This civil-military hybrid structure of ISI should be changed permanently to military only.

 

[TigerOfMysore]

I'm really enjoying engaging with you. I think we both know what we're talking about and the matter of contention is more to do with opinion than anything substantive.

I totally agree about your "read in" points --- I think I mentioned that from my very first comment, and echoed it in my own.

I am actually against the micromanagement of 2-star DGs by the 3-star DG and the 1-star DDGs by the 2-star DGs, etc. The top man should focus on strategy, the 2-stars on entrusting and building their teams to conceive and execute ops to fulfill that strategy and the others on tactical details that can enable such ops (which can enable the policy). The issue is that higher ups have tactical temptations!

Absolutely agree with generals and (especially) 1-stars being kept onboard even when not formally re-employed. Many (for being too outspoken) are unfortunately discarded and not properly valued but (thankfully, as you've mentioned) others are kept for 'consulting.'

Spot on - "The issue is that higher ups have tactical temptations!"

 

[VCheng]

Strange. You don't see a problem with the current setup? Is it constitutional? If army generals want to run Pakistan, they should obtain legal constitutional cover for that. Things will go much smoothly this way. By having a façade of democracy, civilian-military relations would always remain in an a limbo, regardless of how good boot polish civilians are selected by the military regime.

It takes a certain level of understanding to see the wisdom of the present system, and that eludes many here, as it did me for many years. Take a good look at the just how good it is for those who benefit from the system, and one understands it clearly. Why change anything at all, least of all for any considerations about constitutionality?

We never had to see these lacunas before because no PM actually asserted their authority on the process.

Incorrect. No PM has survived any attempt to assert constitutional authority of the office.

 

[ziaulislam]

Bro I firmly believe that the sole brain cell left functioning in your thick skull has officially died
It is precisely because of people like you that we shouldn't be allowed to vote.... not for the next 20 years atleast

I fully agree with you
But jamhoriat is biggest revenge
Nawaz sharif aik nashay ka naam hey

I am still going to vote to my beloved maryum nawaz

 

[VCheng]

I think it did matter. All army coups started with boot polish judges taking unconstitutional oaths under the illegal dictator. Then a rigged election took place giving the usurper democratic cover for his illegal actions. Then a rigged parliament passed laws legalizing the illegal coup, backed by the illegal judges. A few years later; rinse, repeat.

Where are all the sycophants who argue that "this time it is different"?

 

[Norwegian]

It takes a certain level of understanding to see the wisdom of the present system

There is no wisdom here. Pakistan is suffering because of it collectively as a nation for decades. I am not against army directly running the civilian affairs, but it must happen within some form of constitutional legal or lawful cover. Because such a meddling is still illegal under the law and constitution; powerful serving and retired generals twist the arms of all institutions only to achieve their dominance on the system. And who suffers from it? Everyone, all the military and non military institutions.
Without legal cover, there is no regulation and without regulation, there are no limits to how much arm twisting that can be done by the mighty generals to meet their desired goals. In short you get a lawless society, might is right law of the jungle as evident in Pakistan today. Current setup has to change if Pakistan wishes to survive complete breakup and collapse of its society.

 

[VCheng]

There is no wisdom here. Pakistan is suffering because of it collectively as a nation for decades. I am not against army directly running the civilian affairs, but it must happen within some form of constitutional legal or lawful cover. Because such a meddling is still illegal under the law and constitution; powerful serving and retired generals twist the arms of all institutions only to achieve their dominance on the system. And who suffers from it? Everyone, all the military and non military institutions.
Without legal cover, there is no regulation and without regulation, there are no limits to how much arm twisting that can be done by the mighty generals to meet their desired goals. In short you get a lawless society, might is right law of the jungle as evident in Pakistan today. This has to stop if Pakistan wishes to survive complete breakup and collapse of its society.

You really should read my article here on PDF from many years ago, if it still exists and has not been purged.

 

[bafxet]

You need to take off Nawaz / Zardari tainted glasses to see the progress

Who selected General Bajwa?

It is not we it you who must take off the tainted ik glass and see what has he done.

Actually you are sitting in Europe's rich country there you are enjoy all the comforts which life has to offer. From there you are preaching that NS, AZ were the curse and IK is the angle of mercy. Well, why don't you move here and taste the luxury a common Pakistani is experiencing. Those scoundrels were far better than this Mr Clean.

But than there is nothing to loss in making comments.

 

[Norwegian]

You really should read my article here on PDF from nay years ago, if it still exists and has not been purged.

Send me the link when found.

 

[VCheng]

Send me the link when found.

It will take a determined moderator to find it in the archives. My wings are clipped here.

 

[ziaulislam]

You are reading too much into this. Pakistani leadership like I said is very petty from the start. The language they use is Me, I and only I and Me. No respect for institutions.

Every military coup or dismissal by the civil govts is based on personal likes and dislikes. From Ghulam Muhammad and Iskander Mirza to Nawaz Sharif same story. Judges and other qawals like the bureaucracy become tools. These fights are not at all based on ideologies or principles just these personal clashes.

Long story short, this is the reason why we lost srinagar, east pakistan, other princely states and cannot even raise 50 billion dollars to run the country and might go for the 24th time to IMF. People get angry but if you read history, it is obvious.

What do you?
Under my great leader electd by our most educated urban people pakistan became asain tiger in 1998 due to hard work of nawaz sharuf from 1985-1998
We had better percapital income under nawaz sharif in 1985 then china and india

Similarly in 2018 we had become asian leopards with magnificent increase in exports from 25b$ to 21000 million..thats a good 900x increase mashallah

https://twitter.com/x/status/1444362413495701504

 

[Norwegian]

Those scoundrels were far better than this Mr Clean.

Only because they gave temporary relief in inflation by permanently destroying purchasing power of the rupee, do not make them national heroes and messiahs. They were and still are international plunderers. Inflation problem must be fixed permanently by doing structural reforms in the economy. You can't do financial gimmicks to achieve economic prosperity. Learn from Bangladesh or Vietnam how to build a functioning self-sustaining economy with permanently low inflation instead of waiting for re election of past looters and their gimmicks.

Similarly in 2018 we had become asian leopards with magnificent increase in exports from 25b$ to 21000 million..thats a good 900x increase mashallah

 

[313ghazi]

It takes a certain level of understanding to see the wisdom of the present system, and that eludes many here, as it did me for many years. Take a good look at the just how good it is for those who benefit from the system, and one understands it clearly. Why change anything at all, least of all for any considerations about constitutionality?


Incorrect. No PM has survived any attempt to assert constitutional authority of the office.

Because it does not benefit anyone other than the elite.

 

[VCheng]

Because it does not benefit anyone other than the elite.

That reason is simply not potent enough. The commonfolk are expendable, that is the blunt truth.

 

[313ghazi]

It is not we it you who must take off the tainted ik glass and see what has he done.

Actually you are sitting in Europe's rich country there you are enjoy all the comforts which life has to offer. From there you are preaching that NS, AZ were the curse and IK is the angle of mercy. Well, why don't you move here and taste the luxury a common Pakistani is experiencing. Those scoundrels were far better than this Mr Clean.

But than there is nothing to loss in making comments.

I wish I could afford to sponsor people like you to come to Europe for a year or two. When you saw how things work here you'd finally realise all the mistakes made at home every day.

I don't mean that in a disrespectful way. I just mean our country and expectations are so warped that its impossible for many in Pakistan to see it.

Surely you must think why so many overseas support PTI.