No doubt China has confidence in its HQ-9s

[j20blackdragon]

Okay kiddos. You guys keep living in that parallel reality where Chinese military harware is anywhere near as good as Russian hardware.

Four companies competed for the Turkish contract. Russia came in dead last. That says it all right there.

Good luck on the new contract though. It sounds like you really need it.

The only country that needs to export military equipment is Russia with their second-rate economy. With the collapse of the Soviet Union and Russia's tiny GDP, the only thing keeping Russia's crappy defense industry alive is exports. Now they won't even have that because China is taking their market share.

On the other hand, China exports over $2 trillion worth of goods every year.

https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/rankorder/2078rank.html

China has the world's largest trade surplus.

https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/rankorder/2187rank.html

China has the world's largest forex reserves.

https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/rankorder/2188rank.html

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

That is what a lot of people like to not think about.

They are making it look like others like the US and Russia never had any problems making perfect turbofan engines and only China is having issues with the WS-10A.

The fact is that without the supply of Russian engines, then all J-10s would now be powered by WS-10A. It would not be perfect but would be no worse than the early 1980s powered F-16s that the US fielded. China chooses to not field WS-10A on the J-10A for various reasons and not because the WS-10A is not capable of powering it.

You are absolutely right that now China is mass-producing the WS-10A, the WS-15 should be much easier to field.

Without the Russian engines, China can still fly all J-10B with the WS-10A engines, but China now values the life of its pilots more than anything else, she wants all her pilots to fly an engine with 100% maturization.

Back in the 1990s, AL-31F was an pre-mature engine, a lot of PLAAF pilots died because of the engine failure, despite the unreliable record, we still used AL-31F because we had no backup engine at all. Then AL-31F has became fully mature until 2007.

PLAAF now takes more safety measure at first, the AL-31F now is a mature backup engine, for WS-10A never had a record of testing on a single engine aircraft and being a naval aircraft engine. China will first test with AL-31F, then later switch to WS-10A.

Now the J-10B #1035 keeps accumulating the flight hours up to 1000 or more, and the J-15 with WS-10H will spend a lot of training time on CV-16.

After then, i will say the maturization of the WS-10 series will become complete and it will be ready to perform any kind of operational task.

 

[UKBengali]

Without the Russian engines, China can still fly all J-10B with the WS-10A engines, but China now values the life of its pilots more than anything else, she wants all her pilots to fly an engine with 100% maturization.

Back in the 1990s, AL-31F was an pre-mature engine, a lot of PLAAF pilots died because of the engine failure, despite the unreliable record, we still used AL-31F because we had no backup engine at all. Then AL-31F has became fully mature until 2007.

PLAAF now takes more safety measure at first, the AL-31F now is a mature backup engine, for WS-10A never had a record of testing on a single engine aircraft and being a naval aircraft engine. China will first test with AL-31F, then later switch to WS-10A.

Now the J-10B #1035 keeps accumulating the flight hours up to 1000 or more, and the J-15 with WS-10H will spend a lot of training time on CV-16.

After then, i will say the maturization of the WS-10 series will become complete and it will be ready to perform any kind of operational task.

That is why J-11Bs are flying with WS-10A as it is safer to use on twin-engined aircraft than on a single-engined plane.

The J-15 will use WS-10H as two engines would give a margin of safety there.

No problem if early production J-10B's use AL-31F as the life of a pilot is worth much more than national pride.

J-20 will definitely use WS-15 as no country will supply China with a 5th generation engine to power it.

I wonder if the Russians write so much crap about China as they are still sore that China turned down their offer to jointly develop the 5th generation fighter

 

[j20blackdragon]

I wonder if the Russians write so much crap about China as they are still sore that China turned down their offer to jointly develop the 5th generation fighter

Russia doesn't have a real 5th generation fighter. They have a wannabe 5th generation fighter.

A real 5th generation fighter looks like this.

A real 5th generation fighter looks like this.

A real 5th generation fighter looks like this.

A real 5th generation fighter does not look like this.

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

That is why J-11Bs are flying with WS-10A as it is safer to use on twin-engined aircraft than on a single-engined plane.

The J-15 will use WS-10H as two engines would give a margin of safety there.

No problem if early production J-10B's use AL-31F as the life of a pilot is worth much more than national pride.

J-20 will definitely use WS-15 as no country will supply China with a 5th generation engine to power it.

I wonder if the Russians write so much crap about China as they are still sore that China turned down their offer to jointly develop the 5th generation fighter

Yeah, as for the real production version of J-20, China will have no backup engine, the performance of WS-15 will be crucial.

But with the previous experience with the WS-10 series, we will eventually reach the full maturization for WS-15, but hopefully during this process, all pilots will be safe and no casaulty will ever happen.

The maturization of an engine is often built through the blood and tear of the pilots, and people who make fun of that have no fcking clue at all.

I have the gut to admit that the current AL-31F is safer and more mature to fly J-10B and J-15 on an aircraft carrier.

However, the WS-10 series are on the process of maturization and on the right track, and i have the right to defend its against those anti-China trolls.

Even we did use WS-10A for all J-10B and J-15 without the pre-test measures as we are doing right now, the safety record still wouldn't get worse than the AL-31F of the 1990s.

 

[zzzz]

We don't want the engine either, since WS-15 is 5th gen, while 117S is only 4.5th gen, it is technologically not compatible.

Sorry to disappoint you with reality check

Chinese Ministry of Defense acquired 140 AL-31F engines through intermediary of Rosoboronexport in early 2012, Lenta.ru reports with reference to Vedomosti.

According to the source, close to the Russian export state company, the amount of the contract is about $700 million. Moscow-based FSUE “Gas-turbine engineering research and production center “Salut” will be delivering the engines to the Chinese customer.

During the last two and a half years China has acquired Russian engines to the amount of $4 billion; thanks to these contracts Salut has workload until 2015. It is expected that China will order more AL-31F engines in future (this refers to the high-powered modifications). At that the 140 ordered engines will have the increased thrust.

China acquired 150 AL-31F engines in 2011 for Su-27 fighters delivered earlier to this country and the Chinese copies of Su-27 – J-11 aircraft. The Chinese party has also purchased 123 AL-31FN engines for J-10 jets. In addition, the contract on delivery of 186 D-30KP-2 engines to China intended for Il-76 transport aircraft, H-6 bombers (a copy of Tu-16) and new Y-20 transport aircraft was signed in autumn 2011.

CEO of Salut, Vladislav Masalov, said last October that the total number of engines delivered to China has already exceeded 1000 ones. At that it is getting harder to perform contracts for Salut with the increase of orders. "We have some bottlenecks connected with suppliers of metal and some components", - Masalov noted.

China is one of the largest purchasers of Russian engines. The current technological level of this country does not allow manufacturing its own engines suitable for long-term operation. The country manufactures WS-10 engines and some other models for J-10 and J-11 aircraft, however, their reliability, thrust and time between overhaul are inferior to the indicators of Russian AL-31 engines.

http://www.ruaviation.com/news/2012/5/31/1037/

Looks like Chinese technology is not advanced enough to even make 4.0 generation engine on the level of 30 years old AL-31F.

 

[zzzz]

Russia doesn't have a real 5th generation fighter. They have a wannabe 5th generation fighter.

There are only two 5th generation fighters on your pics: one from US and one from Russia. Real 5th generation fighter can look like either of them. China is currently preparing to boost its airforce with 4.5 generation SU-35.

 

[j20blackdragon]

There are only two 5th generation fighters on your pics: one from US and one from Russia. Real 5th generation fighter can look like either of them.

The PAK FA is a Flanker with planform alignment and a shaped nose. It takes more than that to be a stealth aircraft.

 

[zzzz]

The PAK FA is a Flanker with planform alignment and a shaped nose. It takes more than that to be a stealth aircraft.

Yep it takes more than that. You should also know that developing 5th gen jet takes more than just copy Mig 1.44 airframe. Especially when airframe itself is not compatible with 5th gen requirements. Too bad Chinese engineers were not informed in time

 

[ptldM3]

Four companies competed for the Turkish contract. Russia came in dead last. That says it all right there.

This is sad Chinese pounding their chests because their cheap skate missile system was chosen. Do some research before running your mouth.


Turkey right in awarding China missile defense system tender, analysts say - Today's Zaman, your gateway to Turkish daily news

Raytheon and Lockheed Martin of the US got third place with its Patriot missile system in the tender, while Russia's Rosoboronexport with its S-300 system was eliminated due to the very high price.


The Chinese offer is comparatively much better in terms of price and transfer of technology, affirmed Bayar.

The Chinese system was chosen because it was the cheapest system (you get what you pay for) and the Chinese were willing to agree to technology transfer. But of course our delusional Chinese friends are hyping each other up on how the Chinese beat out foreign systems as if it was merely based on technology.

This is like a police department choosing Ford crown Victorias over BMWs. Just because the Ford is cheaper and has a better warranty does not make it a better vehicle. : lol:

 

[ptldM3]

The PAK FA is a Flanker with planform alignment and a shaped nose. It takes more than that to be a stealth aircraft.

And different wing geometry, intake geometry, forward fuselage, even the engines placement and width is different. By your notion the J-20 is just a j-10 with planform alignment and a shaped nose.

In any case, you would be shunned for such grossly negligent nonsense by anyone in the aviation community, but Chinese that are as clueless and gullible as you just eat this stuff up.

 

[Therealtruth]

Finally, some people who actually speak sense. Enough with the fanboy nonsense.

 

[ChinaToday]

This is sad Chinese pounding their chests because their cheap skate missile system was chosen. Do some research before running your mouth.


Turkey right in awarding China missile defense system tender, analysts say - Today's Zaman, your gateway to Turkish daily news







The Chinese system was chosen because it was the cheapest system (you get what you pay for) and the Chinese were willing to agree to technology transfer. But of course our delusional Chinese friends are hyping each other up on how the Chinese beat out foreign systems as if it was merely based on technology.

This is like a police department choosing Ford crown Victorias over BMWs. Just because the Ford is cheaper and has a better warranty does not make it a better vehicle. : lol:

buddy get real ya Russia is not what it used to be , technology is all about money your economy is at least 6 x smaller than our think about it

 

[ptldM3]

buddy get real ya Russia is not what it used to be , technology is all about money your economy is at least 6 x smaller than our think about it

What does an economy have anything to due with technology? Israel and just about every major European country can produce technology that is on par and superior to Chinese equivilants even though Israel and European economies are smaller.

In my link it clearly stated that the Chinese system was chosen because it was the cheapest, would be available the earliest and had technology transfer. It doesn't say anything about the Chinese system being superior.

 

[copasi]

Im not sure what you are getting at. This is a pretty well known fact that has been reported by the Chinese governments own news station. Im sure there are more top secret projects that Russia might be helping China with and im sure that doesnt get published or leaked but these are public contracts. Nothing secret about purchasing fighter jets and submarines between two superpowers. Its part of their public defense budget.

Do you think a Chinese as me do not know if it is a state media? Of course the link you show is not. Moreover, almost all media in are owned by government, more than 10000, they can speak everything as they can, who cares. You surely do not know which is the authorative one.
A foreingner teach a Chinese how to understand Chinese culture, so unbelievable.