New pics of INS Vikramditya

[UKBengali]

its about miniaturization of AESA ...India also has developed land based and airborne AESA ... indian AWACS will be using that ... thr's no
AESA based fighter that china has right now.. and its India who will b getting one earlier ////

and about engines ... yes the engines are under powered for a sea based flanker.. thr's no such thing as WS-10G in production... it might be thr in testing phase and generally no matter how advance a country is a testing life cycle of an engine generally takes more than a decade ..

Indian nave also has an another tender.. Naval-MMRCA .. check out for that also

The WS-10G is not a completely brand new engine. It is an upgrade of the WS-10 that ran at 125KN, The WS-10A is an upgrade of the WS-10A and that produces 132KN, and this is the engine that powers all Chinese J-11Bs. The WS-10G(155KN) is a more radical enhancement of the original WS-10 and there is no way that it would take 10 years from now to be ready. You can tell how ready it is by the fact that there is much speculation that it is powering the prototype J-20 in testing. You do not use an engine that you are not confident on in a brand new airframe. The fact that it/or something similar is powering J-20 prototypes means that they are quite close to operational clearance for this engine.

The WS-15(rumoured to be ready for fitting onto the J-20 early next year) is the next generation of Chinese fighter engine and that will take longer to be ready as it is a completely brand new design. Expected to deliver around 170KN and that should allow it to supercruise at speeds at least as fast as F-22.

Lastly you somewhat spoiled an otherwise good post by making tall claims of India AESAs. These are in testing, not operational.

 

[ptldM3]

Low end Avionics? - J-15 will have an AESA radar which will be superior to whatever the MIG-29K has.

Source, post it.

China is more experienced in AESA technolgy than Russia as they have already produced AESA radars on Type-052C destroyers and KJ-2000 AWACS.

Really, and Russia has never built land based AESA or air based AESA? Building large AESA platform is not difficult, even Israeli has done this years ago with their EL/M-2075. The problem is in miniaturizing the solid-state transmitter/receiver modules, and this is something Russia has done, and although China is surly capable of building an AESA radar small enough to be housed in a fighter, all we hear regarding Chinese AESA is words such as 'rumored', 'said', 'believed'; all is speculation.

All the while Russia has build a number of REAL AESA platforms, more important the Zhuk-AE can be installed on the Mig-29K and it is a small package, the antenna is only 600-688mm depending on model.





We also already have the general specification of many Russian radars, we know resolutions, ranges, targets tracked, engaged, side-lobes, ect ect. And to give you an idea of just how capable the Zhuk is an improved version which has the ability to track 60 targets is under development.

Underpowered? The J-11B already has the 132KN WS-10A installed - higher than the 123KN on the Indian Su-30MKI. China is testing a new engine on the J-20, which is rumoured to be the WS-10G rated at 155KN. Do not worry that the engines on the J-15 will be "underpowered" when the Varyag goes into operational service in the 2013-2014 timeframe.

If I told you it is rumored that Elvis is alive would you believe me?

 

[UKBengali]

Source, post it.




Really, and Russia has never built land based AESA or air based AESA? Building large AESA platform is not difficult, even Israeli has done this years ago with their EL/M-2075. The problem is in miniaturizing the solid-state transmitter/receiver modules, and this is something Russia has done, and although China is surly capable of building an AESA radar small enough to be housed in a fighter, all we hear regarding Chinese AESA is words such as 'rumored', 'said', 'believed'; all is speculation.

All the while Russia has build a number of REAL AESA platforms, more important the Zhuk-AE can be installed on the Mig-29K and it is a small package, the antenna is only 600-688mm depending on model.





We also already have the general specification of many Russian radars, we know resolutions, ranges, targets tracked, engaged, side-lobes, ect ect. And to give you an idea of just how capable the Zhuk is an improved version which has the ability to track 60 targets is under development.






If I told you it is rumored that Elvis is alive would you believe me?

Well, there is something called logical deductions that you can make. Russia has gone straight into AESA development with fighter radars. It has never made anything else with AESA at all before to my knowledge. China has experience with 2 AESA platforms(Type-052C radar and KJ-2000 AWACS) and has also recently made KJ-7 and KJ-10 radars for the Jf-17 and J-10 fighters. Seems pretty likely that China has more experience there doesn't it and people are always going on about experience aren't they? And there was a photo of a J-10B nose cone open with what looked suspiciously like an AESA antenna posted recently on this forum.

As for the engine on the WS-15, it must be a WS-1X series as the most powerful Russian engine that China has(AL-31F) can only reach 125KN in thrust, while WS-10A installed on the J-11B can produce 132KN of thrust. Most people who have looked at the nozzle of the engine on J-20 do not think it is a WS-10A type and hence the deduction that it must be a more powerful, newer engine.

I am sure that Russia can still produce good radars but it will surely fall behind China as the course of this decade progresses. I wish I had the link to that interview with a Chinese radar designer who said that currently China is ahead of everyone else in radar technology apart from the US, and then only a few years at that. Now I am not saying that is true but it does not seem completely fantastical as China has so much experience with radars(both mechanical and AESA) in the last decade and the fact that it has a virtually limitless supply of money and brains to throw at any problem.

Russia is no longer a target for the Chinese to aim at, the US is the real goal.

 

[ptldM3]

Well, there is something called logical deductions that you can make. Russia has gone straight into AESA development with fighter radars. It has never made anything else with AESA at all before to my knowledge.

Wrong, i take it you are not familiar with the 1L119 Nebo SVU AESA. Lets also assume that your logic was true, that Russia did go straight into the development of fighter AESA platforms, it is more difficult to construct solid-state transmitter/receiver modules small enough to fit into a radar with a 600mm dimiter than to build large AESA platforms that can be as large as a vehicle or larger.

China has experience with 2 AESA platforms(Type-052C radar and KJ-2000 AWACS)

And Russia has experience with at least 3 AESA radars that i can think of, what is your point?

and has also recently made KJ-7 and KJ-10 radars for the Jf-17 and J-10 fighters.

And i bet you were not aware that Russian firms asisted in the development of those radars, take a look:


http://www..com/articles/-Avionics/KLJ-710-Fire-Control-Radar-FCR-China.html

both Phazotron NIIR and rival radar house NIIP have worked closely in the past with Chinese radar design bureaux and provided technical assistance as well as operational models of Russia-made radar sets that were used as benchmarks in the process of Chinese firms developing their own designs

KLJ-7 Radar - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The KLJ-7 uses a mechanically-steered slotted array antenna and bears similarities with the various Russian radars imported in the 1990s. Russian radar design houses Phazotron and NIIP had worked closely in the past with the Chinese radar design bureaus and provided technical assistance as well as operational models of Russian-made radar sets that were used as benchmarks in the process of these Chinese firms developing their own design. Up to 20 units of the Phazotron Zhemchoug ('Pearl) radar were imported in the mid-1990s for evaluation along with 2 units of Phazotron (NIIR) RP-35, which is the upgraded version of the Zhemchoug

Seems pretty likely that China has more experience there doesn't it and people are always going on about experience aren't they?

No it doesn't, Russia has constructed dozens of different aircraft with different radars that later got upgraded and replaced with new radars, not to mention all the land based, sea based and mobile radars that have been constructed over the past 6 decades.

I am sure that Russia can still produce good radars but it will surely fall behind China as the course of this decade progresses. I wish I had the link to that interview with a Chinese radar designer who said that currently China is ahead of everyone else in radar technology apart from the US, and then only a few years at that. Now I am not saying that is true but it does not seem completely fantastical as China has so much experience with radars(both mechanical and AESA) in the last decade and the fact that it has a virtually limitless supply of money and brains to throw at any problem.

This designer is a liar, did he get to personally evaluate the IRBIS which is found in the SU-35? Or the Zhuk-AE of the Mig-35, or the NIIP of the pak-fa? How about the Rafale's RBE2 radar or the Typhoons ECR-90?

Russia is no longer a target for the Chinese to aim at, the US is the real goal.

Whatever floats your boat, but if that was true than China would not have tried to purchase the SU-35 radar would they? After all there is no point in trying to purchase an inferior Russia radar when the goal is to match the US.

 

[DacterSaab]

Simple logic will dictate that a larger fighter will carry missiles with longer range and more powerful warhead. That means they will be more potent.

simple logic also dictates that larger fighters carrying more fuel and heavier payload will require longer take-off and landing distance from the limited deck of the carrier.
also they will take up more space in the limited hanger space of the carrier.
will be more troublesome to operationalize.

and lastly such aircraft would be detected and targeted much easily by the larger AESA radars of the CBG ships.

INS Vikramaditya wont be facing any chinese carrier anywhere where it is not supported by land-based air field.
and no aircraft carrier no matter how large, carring whichever and whatever no. of jets will be able to battle a aircraft carrier that is supported by land based air fields.

eg. (plz forget about MKI, aerial tankers and land based AEWACS for a moment) just 2 tu-160 operating from Andaman and Nicobar with the Vikramaditya CBG in Bay of Bengal will be sufficient to make any chinese carrier piss in it's pants before it even thinks of entering the strait of malacca?

 

[nomi007]

i think we are changing topic

 

[Black Widow]

Wrong, i take it you are not familiar with the 1L119 Nebo SVU AESA. Lets also assume that your logic was true, that Russia did go straight into the development of fighter AESA platforms, it is more difficult to construct solid-state transmitter/receiver modules small enough to fit into a radar with a 600mm dimiter than to build large AESA platforms that can be as large as a vehicle or larger.

I want to ask you a off topic question: I went thru Su33 specs, It looks awesome. I find it as potent as any other naval fighter (operational from deck), Can you tell me why Russia closed this project?? Even India was interested in Su33.

I browse a lot on net to find a suitable answer, but couldn't find it...

Secondly, How can you rank MiG29K infront of Su33?? you along with Jagjit and gambit are some of the members who I think can answer it.. Please answer it...

@others: if you know some reason behind refusal of Su33, please enlighten me...

 

[blackops]

This bangladeshi chinese fan boy has derailed this whole damn thread from indian ac we went to chinese ac from mig 29k to su 33 and now on aesa radar good work troll

 

[DacterSaab]

will the aircraft complement be fixed or it can be changed as required?

 

[Zabaniyah]

How has this become a MIG-29K vs. J-15 thread? The topic is about an aircraft carrier

This bangladeshi chinese fan boy has derailed this whole damn thread from indian ac we went to chinese ac from mig 29k to su 33 and now on aesa radar good work troll

Not all of us do But yeah, that guy is clearly trolling. Mods?

 

[Zabaniyah]

But anyways, congrats on the aircraft carrier

 

[brational]

i accept that indian navy is 4th big navy by siza
but i feel that they choose wrong carrier INS Vikramditya.
the reason is that Soviet aircraft carrier Admiral Gorshkov which is now so called INS Vikramditya had been laid down in December 1978 & launch in April 17, 1982
Aircraft carried: 12 Yak-38M fighter aircraft
20 Kamov Ka-25 or Kamov Ka-27 helicopters
which show that the design is soo old which cannot meet the indian requirements
let take a look on INS Vikramditya

indian imagine image is

I agree with u partially.. Vikramaditya was looked upon just as a repalcement of aging Viraat. Back in 2000s India had no other option. Thats why India went ahead with IAC project. The IAC 1 will be comissioned hopefully at the same time Vikramaditya gets in.

But, Vikramaditya suits indian requirement of not operating a Large AC at the moment. The smaller ACs will be enough to secure our waters..

 

[tvsram1992]

I want to ask you a off topic question: I went thru Su33 specs, It looks awesome. I find it as potent as any other naval fighter (operational from deck), Can you tell me why Russia closed this project?? Even India was interested in Su33.

I browse a lot on net to find a suitable answer, but couldn't find it...

No Su33 project was closed because Indians(as final hope) had no interest in it. More over Chinese ordered handful of Su33's and after evaluating them they decreased the order to 7. Russia told we cant reopen production line for such small order. And chinese evaluated reverse engineered it and they are going to make Shenyang J-15 for their carriers. So production was stopped.
Definetly Su33 is more potent than Mig29k.

Secondly, How can you rank MiG29K infront of Su33?? you along with Jagjit and gambit are some of the members who I think can answer it.. Please answer it...

@others: if you know some reason behind refusal of Su33, please enlighten me...

Su33>>Mig29k
Su33 has more payload, longer range and areal refuelling that enables to extend its range. It has good radar range and engine power. Mig29k has limited range and its difficult for areal refuelling though it can be done. It has good electronic counter measures and has reduced RCS design.
But our carriers are small are are Medium Fighters friendly. Su33 is a heavy class fighter so its difficult to operate from small ACC's . Hence even after rejection of India, Russia is also making Mig29k as primary naval fleet fighter. Both can carry Russian missiles that we operate but , Mig29k was preferred as its medium weight class. And Su33 has advantages of sukhoi class planes but its too huge aircraft (not in size) for IN to operate from ACC.
Also the same reason why we are going for MRCA instead of more Su30mki/Su35BM.
The same reason why US preferred F-35 to F-22 .
Heavy aircrafts are difficult to maintain and train. It takes much time to prepare for an attack during war in case of Heavy aircraft atleast when compared to Medium class aircrafts.

 

[brational]

Any Latest photo of Vicky (Vikramaditya)?

 

[Nishant]

Are those fishing rods?