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i found a gud thread where i think im goin to troll :bunny::P

http://www.defence.pk/forums/members-club/239007-my-english-learning-thread.html

i am always good :D how are you ?

im also gud ty,wazzup
smileys-ice-cream-139548.gif
 
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This place still doesn't have the old awesomeness of Naswar corner :confused:

Vote smart, vote Bhutto
 
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@Armstrong Why didn't you join army ??

The Parents & Others in my family & friends including the Ex-Army guys dissuaded me into even trying out for the Army; in retrospect I think I made a mistake listening to them.
 
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We're moving into Phase 3 here, with the absolute propagation of our vision and the absolute destruction of the lies spread against us taking place.

Vote Smart, Vote Bhutto
 
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About Kargil, about the bases & about the cooperation with the Americans & so much more; I think we'd get to know the facts only a few decades later when the files on them are declassified for right now we're all talking on the basis of mere conjecture which maybe right or it maybe wrong ! On my part I've never really understood the raison detre of the Kargil Conflict & the explanations given till now (by both sides) don't really add up for me. Similarly I think the whole War On Terror & the cooperation has more to it than that which meets the eye & the logic that some of us prescribe to that as if it was a 'caving in' or due to some 'personal incentives' isn't something I can wholly palate ! On the face of it either decision looks less than optimum but I'd rather defer the finality of my decision till more facts come to light.

On the Kashmir issue - If what is said to have been proposed (the entire framework/formula) is indeed true, then I would think it to be a brilliant thing for that helps us exponentially more than it ever could help India. The People-to-People connection favors us because the exchanges, the ensuing trade, the intermarriages etc. would be with us as was always the case historically - why do you think there are so many of us Kashmiris in Punjab & the sort ? And so in the long run had we been able to consolidate our narrative better we would have won ! So if it were true...I'd consider it a commendable plan !

The Kargil issue and its reason is pretty well explained in India (our version). Strategically, it would have dealt us a fait accompli, the tactical reasoning being that it would be near impossible for any force to evict the invaders from the formidable peaks- such a situation would have forced us to be far more conciliatory as far as the Siachen dispute is concerned. Personally I've never cared about the "morality" of the conflict, the interests of our nations (at that moment and today as well) are completely antithetical in nature so our side should have been vigilant. In India the verdict was clear- the MI had clearly indicated to the cabinet committee that there were a large no. of "lashkars" being trained and provided with acclimatization training in the Gilgit/Baltistan region- the cabinet ignored these warnings and only initiated any effort days after the invaders were engaged by the forward patrols rather than the main force of the IA. I can see the sense in the Siachen argument- Musharaff has a history with Siachen and the unsuccessful SSG raids on the peaks there. Obviously this is the Indian side of the story and that too the brief and simple version.

But surely there are no buyers of his explanation that he did it to "internationalize" the Kashmir conflict? It got internationalized but in India's favor. The stalled fencing of the LOC went through. Nawaz's entreaty to Bill Clinton was seen as diplomatic capitulation. Although I guess it was all or nothing- if you guys had won our position in Siachen would have been truly compromised.

The incident had one overwhelming negative long-term impact though. India's stand has progressively hardened from there on onward. Despite all our verbal "signals" I think you know well that we have stonewalled all such bilateral solutions by putting up veritable non starters- our maximalist position. Regrettably this trend will continue- with a few momentary contradictions- in the next decade you will only see our stand harden even more coupled with an ever increasing capability to support that maximalist stand. Just my opinion though- but one based on my observations.

Can't really comment on who it would have benefited more- the alleged "solution"- all I know is that there was some traction on our side- a more favorable view regarding that specific proposal compared to all previous attempts and formulae. Although, certain people informed me that even then the best case scenario was that we would have dragged it out to milk the maximum benefit out of it. Such is geopolitics. Dunno what the future will bring? :)
 
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@ZYXW : Wassup kid ? How are the Political Science classes coming along ? So have you had the chance to read Plato's Republic as part of your Political Sciences curriculum ? :what:
 
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