What's new

Muslims must save Islam from Islamists

Believe me, I can screw the Mullahs up in most, if not all, cases simply by using the Quran, the same holy book they claim to follow. They can't say I'm not 'believing hard enough', because if they do, their own hypocrisy will be exposed...."Produce your proof if ye are truthful."
I can also screw up U.N. diplomats by demonstrating that Israeli actions are legal, that a slew of U.N. anti-Israel resolutions exceed the bounds of the Council, that anti-Israel ICC "rulings" are misused, and so on. And it makes no difference. Because fanatics don't listen to reason or acknowledge uncomfortable facts and neither will their hirelings - not if they want to keep their jobs.
 
.
Could you stop pushing an Israeli agenda everywhere you go? Bringing it up everywhere doesn't make your arguments seem any better, and all it does is feed the narrative that says Israelis want to push their agenda everywhere. It's counterproductive for your own cause.
I can also screw up U.N. diplomats by demonstrating that Israeli actions are legal
Come on, be honest - you can't, in any way, demonstrate that all Israeli actions are legal. Some of them may be, but then that's a logical fallacy. Some actions being legal doesn't make them all legal, and especially not the clearly illegal ones.
Your logical fallacy is composition/division
that a slew of U.N. anti-Israel resolutions exceed the bounds of the Council, that anti-Israel ICC "rulings" are misused, and so on
It's not like Israel ever follows any of the resolutions anyways - so why worry about them?

Anyways - let's get to the (correct) point you made here:
fanatics don't listen to reason or acknowledge uncomfortable facts and neither will their hirelings
I never expected the fanatics to listen to reason - what I did intend to do is stop people from becoming fanatics in the first place. If people are exposed to arguments against fanaticism before they are brainwashed, they will be a lot less likely to fall into that trap.

That's why destroying Mullahs is important. The UN diplomats won't create an army of brainwashed murderers if left alone for a while - they'd probably kill themselves with paper cuts before they can reach that position.
 
.
Could you stop pushing an Israeli agenda everywhere you go? Bringing it up everywhere doesn't make your arguments seem any better, and all it does is feed the narrative that says Israelis want to push their agenda everywhere. It's counterproductive for your own cause.
I'm not an Israeli. I realize pushing this causes you stress. But it's hard to argue that if Israel was accepted that wouldn't be a huge blow to terrorism everywhere, yes?

Come on, be honest - you can't, in any way, demonstrate that all Israeli actions are legal. Some of them may be, but then that's a logical fallacy. Some actions being legal doesn't make them all legal, and especially not the clearly illegal ones.
My comment was indeterminate so your objection is a red herring.

I never expected the fanatics to listen to reason - what I did intend to do is stop people from becoming fanatics in the first place. If people are exposed to arguments against fanaticism before they are brainwashed, they will be a lot less likely to fall into that trap.
Important, yet you can't always count on people learning the right stuff the first time. You have to concentrate on changing minds, teaching the importance of unlearning and relearning. Doing so will open minds and of itself help reduce fanaticism.

Of course, doing so requires decreasing or eliminating the hubris inculcated into Muslims for generations - that Muslms have rights/are right because they are Muslim, not because of what they do/didn't do, facts, etc. It's this factor that's much more difficult to deal with than anything else. Charlie Henbo, the Twin Towers, the success of Jews free of Muslim domination, these are all blows to some Muslims' pride and that's what drives them to kill and others to condone/apologize for their acts.

The UN diplomats won't create an army of brainwashed murderers if left alone for a while - they'd probably kill themselves with paper cuts before they can reach that position.
On the contrary, UNRWA has followed a terror-building agenda for generations; it's just that men like yourself will yourselves not to acknowledge this. You don't get that by legitimizing injustice against a minority you've legitimized it at home, too, since anybody can be cut out from the crowd and labelled a minority. Why bother traveling to Israel and serving a terror group there when you can establish your own at home and seek to lord over "enemies" you really hate because you see they have wronged you?
 
.
.
The law of physics are universal those are nature's laws scientifically proven, not just my belief... ignorance kills

Physics is a science. Islam is a religion. I hope you are aware of what this difference means.
 
.
Physics is a science. Islam is a religion. I hope you are aware of what this difference means.
I hope you are, and that is the point, Islam integrates with science at its highest levels of understanding, no other religious book talks so comprehensively about science and the endeavor to learn it, called explicitly "Ijtihad" I hope you get it this time.
 
.
I hope you are, and that is the point, Islam integrates with science at its highest levels of understanding, no other religious book talks so comprehensively about science and the endeavor to learn it.

No Sir. Religions are sets of beliefs, including Islam, and have no relationship to any science, which are a matter of logic. Your confusion is leading you, and many like you, astray.
 
.
No Sir. Religions are sets of beliefs, including Islam, and have no relationship to any science, which are a matter of logic. Your confusion is leading you, and many like you, astray.
You do seem confused, I do not blame you if you do not understand the meanings of my first post, majority of humans do not. And that is what causing all these conflicts. You should educate yourself about Muslim achievements in all fields of sciences and find out about the role of Islam as a religion (a way of life) in it.
 
.
You do seem confused, I do not blame you if you do not understand the meanings of my first post, majority of humans do not. And that is what causing all these conflicts. You should educate yourself about Muslim achievements in all fields of sciences and find out about the role of Islam as a religion (a way of life) in it.

Sir, it is you who are confusing religion with science. One simply cannot be judged by the standards of the other.
 
.
Sir, it is you who are confusing religion with science. One simply cannot be judged by the standards of the other.
There are facts about the relationship of Islam in particular with science which makes it unique among all the other religion. As a Muslim, if you are one! you must be aware of it.
 
.
There are facts about the relationship of Islam in particular with science which makes it unique among all the other religion. As a Muslim, if you are one! you must be aware of it.

Yes, Islam is unique as a religion, but it is a religion nonetheless, and therefore a set of beliefs. It is not a science.
 
. . .
Science is never a matter of belief. Islam is a set of beliefs, and therefore it can never be science.
Islam is not science, just derived from science and emphasize it a lot, it includes social sciences if that can help you to understand! Which are the rules of conducts for humans that you find in every society. In Islam they are beliefs if one wants to label them as such, and they are derived from human experience of hundreds of thousands of years. Most of western societies conducts after the European dark ages were derived from the Muslim civilization, some of them were rejected wholesale along with other religions, by the libertines who are suffering or at least their societies are suffering from so many social ills including Muslim societies who follow the libertine way of life. Call it secular or else, the bottom line is libertarianism, where sexual, drugs and alcohol freedom prime above everything else and disguised in more acceptable words (freedom of speech) like freedom of "expression".
 
.
I have always been of the opinion that majority of the Muslim scholars are living in the past. Trying to impose interpretations by the scholars written about a thousand years ago and following it as universal truth till the end of time can only lead one into the abyss.

I don’t have sufficient grasp on the English language to translate the following article originally authored by Allama Javed Ahmed Ghamdi whom I greatly admire.

Saleem Safi- jirga- dini madaris- asal masla aur hal - Jang Columns

It basically says that syllabus of the Pakistani madrasahs is extremely myopic and is based upon blind following “Taqlid” of the Islamic scholars of 3rd & 4th century A.H. The students are brainwashed into believing that only the ideology of Islam taught in their madrasah is correct and all others are heretics.

In my humble opinion this is the root cause of the birth of radical movements and their barbaric actions because they are applying methods prevalent in the 12th & 13th Century (era of the crusades) to the 21st Century world.

I am not advocating that one should ignore the word of Allah as revealed in the form of Quran or go against the Hadith. I am against the blind obedience of the interpretation by the Imams living during the first couple of centuries after the Hijra as if these are universal truths.

As matter of fact early Muslims were far more progressive than the Deobandis, Wahhabis & Salafis of today. Perish the thought that I am criticizing the great Imams. I am of the view that despite being great scholars; Imams were also human and their world view corresponded to the period they were living. When there can be differences of the fiqah among Imams themselves; albeit small; how can we accept their interpretations as absolute truth a thousand years later?

Allama Ghamdi titled his article “ Pas cheh bayad kard” meaning then what must one do? I would say that re-introduce ‘Ijethad’.
 
Last edited:
.
Back
Top Bottom