MCA to AMCA: Journey of Cutting edge Next Gen Fighter

[prototype]

1. Interesting PoV; a couple of corrections, though.

India is already a service (agriculture? ) based economy without building a significant heavy and/or hi tech manufacturing industry base.

But, contrary to outside (e.g. chinese) perception, there is a solid thrust towards creating heavy and hi tech manufacturing base in India. Fueled by future growth sectors like aviation, infrastructure, agro processing, power we are laying the building blocks of the industrial capacity which will sustain future indian military might.


Also, do not harbor similar prejudices towards indian industrial capacity like the Americans used to have towards Chinese capacity to spawn "original" technology. The automobile and pharma sectors are enough to demonstrate the point.




2. Most of these "failed" projects as you term them have turned the corner and have been inducted in the forces.

As you must have seen; LCA and Arjun are not working as flame baits anymore.

Though, many people here on PDF deny the reality and are living in the past.
It kinda reminds me of the attitude Americans have on the GIJoe forums like f16 forums; trashing everything Non American as inferior technology and unreliable.

The fact is no matter how many times these people chant that "LCA and Arjun are faliures!"; these projects are steaming ahead and reaching their potential as we speak. Just like AShBM and J20 inspite of the similar chants by american ostriches!

Also, I need not remind you of the colossal failures Chinese had (Leaky Nuke Subs etc.) before earning bragging rights with projects like J-20. We will earn ours in due course!

U introduced some nice point's,especially about the pharmaceutical industry,being associated with this industry I myself know the progress of this industry and how it is emerging as the flag holder of Indian manufacturing sector.

automobile boom had already forced many companies to leave importing and assembling and instead manufacture here,in future I hope many more will turn.

One other misconception I had witnessed with Chinese people is that they consider manufacturing and export as the benchmark of an emerging economy(we all know why),I hope they just look inside G-20.

While many people were ridiculing Indian indigenous programe,Indian works r more of now turning into reality.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Why cant pvt sector take the initiative themselves, why waiting for govt ? at least come up with a decent uav.

Indian private sector lacks the capability to build any hitech weapons. Their minor contribution to many defence projects also lead to delay. For example there is no private company in India that can make a modern MBT to meet the requirements of Indian Army, a modern fighter to meet the requirements of IAF etc.

Kiinetic the Indian private industry must chip in with smaller inputs first.

Like materials research. Chemical research. Participating with the academia etc.

They need to start funding research projects in universities. That's the starting point.

1. Interesting PoV; a couple of corrections, though.

India is already a service (agriculture? ) based economy without building a significant heavy and/or hi tech manufacturing industry base.

But, contrary to outside (e.g. chinese) perception, there is a solid thrust towards creating heavy and hi tech manufacturing base in India. Fueled by future growth sectors like aviation, infrastructure, agro processing, power we are laying the building blocks of the industrial capacity which will sustain future indian military might.


Also, do not harbor similar prejudices towards indian industrial capacity like the Americans used to have towards Chinese capacity to spawn "original" technology. The automobile and pharma sectors are enough to demonstrate the point.




2. Most of these "failed" projects as you term them have turned the corner and have been inducted in the forces.

As you must have seen; LCA and Arjun are not working as flame baits anymore.

Though, many people here on PDF deny the reality and are living in the past.
It kinda reminds me of the attitude Americans have on the GIJoe forums like f16 forums; trashing everything Non American as inferior technology and unreliable.

The fact is no matter how many times these people chant that "LCA and Arjun are faliures!"; these projects are steaming ahead and reaching their potential as we speak. Just like AShBM and J20 inspite of the similar chants by american ostriches!

Also, I need not remind you of the colossal failures Chinese had (Leaky Nuke Subs etc.) before earning bragging rights with projects like J-20. We will earn ours in due course!

As it happens, reports of the latest Arjuna tests by the IA, as well as reports coming in from early bird visitors at Aero India about the state of flying readiness of the LCA, makes it clear that these canards are not flying any more, except in the vivid imaginations of India-baiting trolls.

 

[StormShadow]

YOU ARE an brainwashed patriotic , the missile and products are nowhere close to the quality promised by funding and brain work indian possess.

How? What do you mean by products are no where close to the quality? Are you referring to CEP of the missiles? Or are you doubting about the avionics or EW suite developed by DRDO??

sitting in your living room wont say much about it .most of the drdo people own the drdo- they take more than 200 days of holidays.

Yes..they get holidays more than what is required. But that dosent mean they are lazy buggers. There are scientists working till 1AM and coming back to offices again by 8 in the morning.

the product that are designed are outsourced and made by their own family member's factory-so delay and quality is taken care of.

yeah some what..but generalising DRDO is equally dumb.

i dont give two hoot about your - patriotic gibberish - people are paying lot of tax and it should be productive.

Yeah yeah...you dont need to give a $h!t about "patriotic gibberish" as you can easily enjoy your day in an AC room blaming DRDO and why not..you can earn thanks from Indians, Pakistanis and Indo-Pakistanis!

 

[rcrmj]

1. Interesting PoV; a couple of corrections, though.

India is already a service (agriculture? ) based economy

But, contrary to outside (e.g. chinese) perception, there is a solid thrust towards creating heavy and hi tech manufacturing base in India. Fueled by future growth sectors like aviation, infrastructure, agro processing, power we are laying the building blocks of the industrial capacity which will sustain future indian military might.


Also, do not harbor similar prejudices towards indian industrial capacity like the Americans used to have towards Chinese capacity to spawn "original" technology. The automobile and pharma sectors are enough to demonstrate the point.




2. Most of these "failed" projects as you term them have turned the corner and have been inducted in the forces.

As you must have seen; LCA and Arjun are not working as flame baits anymore.

Though, many people here on PDF deny the reality and are living in the past.
It kinda reminds me of the attitude Americans have on the GIJoe forums like f16 forums; trashing everything Non American as inferior technology and unreliable.

The fact is no matter how many times these people chant that "LCA and Arjun are faliures!"; these projects are steaming ahead and reaching their potential as we speak. Just like AShBM and J20 inspite of the similar chants by american ostriches!

Also, I need not remind you of the colossal failures Chinese had (Leaky Nuke Subs etc.) before earning bragging rights with projects like J-20. We will earn ours in due course!

when did India become 'service' industry? even China dont claim itself as 'service' oriented industry! you souldnt have that 'india is shining' philosophy in ur mindset. u hv to dig up the real figures. in 2010 Chinese service industry output is $2504.84 billion, whereas the Iindian service industry output in 2010 was $790.1billion, which was lease than 30% of the Chinese service industry!!

and you also claim that there is a solid development in heavy and hi tec in india. listen dude i heard that from indian friends and medias constantly for like 10 years. were there any prograsses? if you brag once people might beleive in you, if you brag twice people would start having doubts, when you always brag people just walk away from you (which is indian's case, coz they always brag this nd that like india is shining, india is the brain, india is becoming this and that```etc)

when it came to LCA and arjun facts speak for themselves. they were both failed projects! in the begining they wanted it to be 100%indian, but they failed so had to seek foreign helps. when the foreign helps came, they failed again due to the inacapability of india manufacturing industry to put all foreign parts and kits together successfully! when they finally successfully put them together there is another problem, even with foreign TOT transfer to india who does not have the capability to produce good quality spare parts due to its antique manufacturing industries so again they have to buy materials and parts from foreign countries again. in the end the LCA and Arjun projects did not contribute anything to boost indian's manufacturing capabilities.!

in the case of the Chinese, u think the apperance of J-8, JH-7, J-10, J-11B, and J-20 are mere coincidence?? no, thats because Chinese had a very clear vision. We started producing bikes, moto bikes, small electronic parts, TVs, first then move to mobile phones, computers, cars and then commercial jets, meg ton cargo ships and hi tech machinaries. by doing so only by doing so we up grated our industry capability. Chinese would rather spend 10 years to figure out how to master a single technology rather than spending 28 years to lern how to put foreign products together (which is LCA's case)!!

So please enlighten me, how India is going to develop if it does not focus on the reality to utilize its real extremely reliable resources which is the manpower (second largest labour force!)?? call centers and software packaging warehouse wouldnt lead a country anywhere rather than an outsource option!

you people really have to face up the reality!

 

[ganimi kawa]

Wow! That is a looooong post with so little substance, almost a record!

I'll just reply to sensible part in the post and forget the rest (LCA is integrated and else....)


when did India become 'service' industry? even China dont claim itself as 'service' oriented industry! you souldnt have that 'india is shining' philosophy in ur mindset. u hv to dig up the real figures. in 2010 Chinese service industry output is $2504.84 billion, whereas the Iindian service industry output in 2010 was $790.1billion, which was lease than 30% of the Chinese service industry!!

Did I talk about the chinese industry? Do you classify the Chinese economy by looking at the US economy?

Just check out the contribution of "service" sector in the annual growth of Indian economy and you will realise what I am talking about.

Also, If you had read my post carefully,

India is already a service (agriculture? ) based economy

Hope it becomes clear to you!

and you also claim that there is a solid development in heavy and hi tec in india. listen dude i heard that from indian friends and medias constantly for like 10 years. were there any prograsses? if you brag once people might beleive in you, if you brag twice people would start having doubts, when you always brag people just walk away from you (which is indian's case, coz they always brag this nd that like india is shining, india is the brain, india is becoming this and that```etc)

If your "friends" were saying this 10 years ago, then they were bufoons, imaginary (that is my guess) or super visionaries!

The "thrust" that I am speaking about is a five year old thing at the maximum. Anyways, here is the latest picture.....

India has emerged as one of the world's top ten countries in industrial production as per UNIDO's new report titled 'Yearbook of Industrial Statistics 2010'. India surpassed Canada, Brazil and Mexico in 2009 to reach the 9th position from the 12th position it held in 2008.

The Index of Industrial Production (IIP) quick estimates data for October 2010 shows a growth of 11.3 per cent in the manufacturing sector as compared to October 2009. The cumulative growth during April-October 2009-10 over the corresponding period of 2008-09 is 11 per cent, according to data by the Ministry of Statistics and Programme Implementation.

India is ranked second in terms of manufacturing competence, according to report '2010 Global Manufacturing Competitiveness Index', by Deloitte Touche Tohmatsu and the US Council on Competitiveness.

Led by the manufacturing sector once again, the Index of Industrial Production (IIP) has shown a growth of 16.7 per cent in Jan 2010.

Now, about tejas and arjun, I will only entertain specific objections and not blanket statements like the ones you have made.


Also, can you explain why the J 20 is the first original looking design from the chinese, given your enormous industry?


P.S. Focus on the current thread. We can discuss all else in economy section!

 

[rcrmj]

Wow! That is a looooong post with so little substance, almost a record!

maybe u can not comprehen what was writen on my previous post. maybe u just act like usual denying reality i stated.
it is laughable anyone could actually beleive that indian industry capacity actually surpass Chinese. dude its almost 8 times of indian's! you are like a typical deluded person doesnt know the difference between reality and sky flying reports from 'big' organizations..lol did C.I.A world factbook or world bank or any other creditable organizations actually using those 'companies' empty statistics? dude just use ur brain, or maybe a bit of travel to see the real world!

 

[rcrmj]

u still havent enlighten me how india is going to develop it into a developed country without taking time to pull up its mess manufactorying and infrastructure industries?? :O

 

[angeldemon_007]

Stick to the topic guys. To all Chinese friends, Please share the features of J-20 with us.

 

[ajtr]

MCA to AMCA: Journey of Cutting edge Next Gen Fighter

Sure its a cutting edge journey of changing names but nothing concrete.

 

[angeldemon_007]

Common guys share some technical stuff....

 

[CardSharp]

Also, can you explain why the J 20 is the first original looking design from the chinese, given your enormous industry?

You too? and just after admonishing the American stereotypes of China?

 

[ganimi kawa]

You too? and just after admonishing the American stereotypes of China?

Sorry, mate! Sometimes, the trolls break one's composure. You know my views on the china better than many others. And you also know that facing same half baked arguments again and again can be frustrating. You have made such harsh statements against India,too.

What I find irritating is that most of the LCA hater's club are actually interested in "cussing" than "discussing".

This thread was about India's efforts towards building a fifth gen fighter, why the need to compare Chinese and Indian industrial base? It's not necessary for India to have the industrial capacity of China to be able to develop AMCA.

On topic, I still feel that the kaveri is going to be the achilles heel for this program. Also, the air force requirement of VLO is going to create a huge challenge.

 

[jha]

 

[SR 71 Blackbird]

Hey, buddy why did U include in Ur thread same images multiple times?

 

[tanlixiang28776]

Sorry, mate! Sometimes, the trolls break one's composure. You know my views on the china better than many others. And you also know that facing same half baked arguments again and again can be frustrating. You have made such harsh statements against India,too.

What I find irritating is that most of the LCA hater's club are actually interested in "cussing" than "discussing".

This thread was about India's efforts towards building a fifth gen fighter, why the need to compare Chinese and Indian industrial base? It's not necessary for India to have the industrial capacity of China to be able to develop AMCA.

On topic, I still feel that the kaveri is going to be the achilles heel for this program. Also, the air force requirement of VLO is going to create a huge challenge.

Industrial capability is an extremely important part of building a fifth Gen. fighters. Indigenous fifth gen. projects require industrial capability across a wide range of spectrums. You need mastery in designing reliable engines, Avionics, Advanced composites, RAM, BVR missiles, Airframe, AESA, and countless other things. It also effects if you can build the Plane within budget. Even a very advanced country like Japan cannot build its own indigenous aircraft in budget with the F2 costing 100 million dollars each