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Exactly! If monopoly is such a good thing then all Iranians must be mighty proud of Iran khodro and saipa. I think they produce the best weapons in Iran, as they have more kills on their hardware then any other Iranian organization, whether private or state owned.

Which manufacturer is better Khodro or Saipa? I mean if you have the cash to buy either what would you buy? What is the name of the best medium size car that is produced by either one of them (i.e. the equivalent of Toyota Camry from both reliability and size perspective)?
 
Which manufacturer is better Khodro or Saipa?

Both are crap. Historically saipa has been the crapiest. I don't know the status today.

I mean if you have the cash to buy either what would you buy?

Only between those two i would still choose soren from ikco.

Problem with these two manufacturers is that they've got Iran by the nuts. There are a lot people employed by them so they have all of Iran as hostage, e.g. if the government doesn't let them have monopoly then a lot of people will be out of job. Also the governments during the past 25 years is also to blame since it was a rather simple solution to force them to employ more and more people. The trouble is that they have absolutely no incentive to drive for efficiency. Therefore many engineers who are "working" there, are just wasting time, both their own and the companies'.
 
Competition?!
I was wondering what excuses you will bring for this SHAMEFUL deal (even operators aren't Iranian).
First of all, competition is when there is a tender, not some confidential deal between two parties, this will only lead to corruption, as it has happened in the past,
and soon this deal will become another scandal too.

Secondly, compete with what? a third grade company whose only history is building 3200MW powerplants! forget the Mapna, even smaller Iranian companies can compete with this Turkish company.

Exactly! If monopoly is such a good thing then all Iranians must be mighty proud of Iran khodro and saipa. I think they produce the best weapons in Iran, as they have more kills on their hardware then any other Iranian organization, whether private or state owned.
While you are making this imaginary competition for MAPNA (one of the world's most successful and bright companies), IKCO and SAIPA keep dominating their monopoly market by assembling foreign junks which is the results of some other confidential (corrupted) deals.

Problem of our car industry isn't lack of competition, it's corruption and enslaved minds who think we can't. having a competitor wont make them any better, it just will make them bankrupt.

If MAPNA had some consumer products, I would use them proudly without being worry about their quality, what proud people like Koreans, Germans and Japanese do.
 
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While you are making this imaginary competition for MAPNA (one of the world's most successful and bright companies),

MAPNA has had competition from day one. That is why they are one of the best companies in Iran. SA Iran is another example of competition from the start. Both companies are reasons for pride for Iranians.

Also under the IPC foreign contractors MUST BUY from domestic manufacturers IF they are producing state of the art products. MAPNA IS producing state of the art products so they will continue to thrive.

IKCO and SAIPA keep dominating their monopoly market by assembling foreign junks which is the results of some other confidential (corrupted) deals.

Yes corruption is yet another factor amongst many in the past 25 years.

Problem of our car industry isn't lack of competition,

Yes it is.

it's corruption and enslaved minds who think we can't.

Corruption yes. Enslaved minds sounds like a political comment. I personally know a lot of engineers working for these companies. In no way are their minds enslaved. To suggest otherwise is a big disrespect to them. I know about many products that have been stranded because of the management not having any incentive to go through with them. Why should they? If the people still buy the off the shelf products then there is no reason for them to do better.

having a competitor wont make them any better, it just will make them bankrupt.

That's what you think. I disagree.

If MAPNA had some consumer products, I would use them proudly without being worry about their quality,

MAPNA is B2B company today and their management is perfect for this market. Maybe they become successful for B2C as well but there is no guarantee.

what proud people like Koreans, Germans and Japanese do.

All those you mentioned have healthy competition.
 
MAPNA has had competition from day one. That is why they are one of the best companies in Iran. SA Iran is another example of competition from the start. Both companies are reasons for pride for Iranians.
MAPNA, IEI, SHAHED, ... are the result of a will for self sufficiency, not competition.
being competitor today is the result of their endless thirst for advancement.

Also under the IPC foreign contractors MUST BUY from domestic manufacturers IF they are producing state of the art products. MAPNA IS producing state of the art products so they will continue to thrive.
we will see about that, Peugeot was supposed to do the same too, but each time they rejected Iranian parts with different excuses while they were even better than the original ones. this is how we remained a junk assembler till 2022!
in the last deal, TOTAL has the monopoly right for repair and maintenance! you can forget whatever lies you have heard from Zanganeh and his fellows.
there is a reason that they don't dare to publish the deal's document for Iranian (not even for MPs)

Corruption yes. Enslaved minds sounds like a political comment.
That's a common opinion among ordinary Iranian that we can't even produce Aftabe!
what you call political comment is the actual management method among our current officials, do you know any more humiliating comment:
ترکان: قدرت رقابت در هیچ صنعتی جز قرمه‌سبزی و آبگوشت بزباش را نداریم
though I refer to them as traitors with political goals.


All those you mentioned have healthy competition.
in Korean school, if a child would bring foreign products (bag, pen,...) with himself to school, they would write his name on the blackboard as a traitor!

It's a monopoly market enforced by people themselves, even smuggling couldn't infiltrate in this market.
 
MAPNA, IEI, SHAHED, ... are the result of a will for self sufficiency, not competition.
being competitor today is the result of their endless thirst for advancement.

Of course it was a drive for self sufficiency. I am not against that. But MAPNA has been in a competitive market from day ONE. So has SA Iran. Those products have had ZERO import tariff. Look at them now.

we will see about that, Peugeot was supposed to do the same too, but each time they rejected Iranian parts with different excuses while they were even better than the original ones. this is how we remained a junk assembler till 2022!

I am not familiar with that deal. If you have the deal document then please post so we can review them.

The reason for why we are junk assemblers is not because of Peugeot. I hate when people want to blame the foreign companies for the inefficiencies that some of our companies have. We are junk assemblers because our companies make BILLIONS BILLIONS on SELLING JUNK. That is why!

in the last deal, TOTAL has the monopoly right for repair and maintenance! you can forget whatever lies you have heard from Zanganeh and his fellows.
there is a reason that they don't dare to publish the deal's document for Iranian (not even for MPs)

The IPC is not a closed document. I have read parts of it.

That's a common opinion among ordinary Iranian that we can't even produce Aftabe!

lol I dont know who you socialise with but the Iranians that I have talked to both inside and outside Iran are VERY VERY ambitious. Under the right circumstances they can do wonders. However, unfortunately our car industry does not have the right circumstances.

n Korean school, if a child would bring foreign products (bag, pen,...) with himself to school, they would write his name on the blackboard as a traitor!

It's a monopoly market enforced by people themselves, even smuggling couldn't infiltrate in this market.

I'm sorry but I don't base my understanding on anecdotes. Fact of the matter is that Korea is not a closed market. North Korea and USSR where however. I don't think that you see them as role models.
 
Well when you say TOGA for me the first thing that come into mind isTransoral gastroplasty
Or TOGA procedure
Are you in Med school?

@Sina-1

%100 import tax on cars is way too outrageous. I really love cars and while that doesn't affect me here in KSA, this exorbitant %100 import tax pisses me off while I am hundreds of miles away. I know it was supposed to let local car manufacturers grow their business, but it still shouldn't be %100.
 
%100 import tax on cars is way too outrageous. I really love cars and while that doesn't affect me here in KSA, this exorbitant %100 import tax pisses me off while I am hundreds of miles away. I know it was supposed to let local car manufacturers grow their business, but it still shouldn't be %100.

Actually I am all for closing the market for specific consumer product. But ONLY for a specific and finite time period. If it is open from the start then the local manufacturers will never be able to come on stream. But when all the fundamentals are in place, as it has been for Iran car manufacturing for the past 15 years, then it is vital to lift all import tariffs and open the market up.

Open market means:
Knife to throat
Do or die
Develop or perish

If you look at all successful branches in Iran be it IRGC, MAPNA, SA Iran etc they've been under immense pressure and that is why they are able to do so great. As the saying goes -> necessity is the mother of all inventions.
 
Sadly no
I'm practicing it for last 12 years.
Thanks. You are older than what I thought then. That's why you probably have a calm temper. Do you know the reason behind Shiraz popularity for eye treatment among some of KSA's Tazis back in the early 1970s? For eye treatment, Shiraz for KSA's tazis was like Turkey today for hair transplant.
 

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