Manmohan Singh blames US NGOs for anti-nuclear demonstrations

[trinity]

My point is that the government has acted thereby allowing the NGO's to take legal recourse if they so wish. Do you actually think that the PM of a country will be busy proving his statements to everyNGO. Since the government has acted legally ( which btw is the way all governments act the world over), the NGO's have a chance to refute it.



While it is off topic, you make a very simple argument. Ban it because so many western countries ban it. What's the alternative? More expensive & less cost effective pesticides? Just because something is done in the west does not mean that it has to be blindly copied. Farmers in the west & India are not comparable. Here, failed yields will mean more suicides. There is no simple answer to these complicated scenarios.

Dude there are cost effective options. Our shitty govt was not doing its part in research and funding. We had a wonderful agricultural revolution in the 60's but instead keeping pace with developments, the gov;t practically destroyed it. Once, something gets aloft and moving, the gov;t has to keep the momentum moving by giving direction. Yes, I am aware of the farmers plight as my grandparents were farmers. I think more needs to be done. Certain aspects like agricultural should fall under national security because of it importance and role in society. The only way to overcome the points you made is sufficient gov;t help.

 

[trinity]

It was here in Sikkim actually and not Mizoram.

You need to really stop being paranoid of nuclear energy when entire world uses it 10 times more than we do. France has been using it since half a century and 70% of their total power. They are bordering oceans too... nothing happened to them. Why are we worrying?

The simple reason why Japanese always end up facing disasters is because of their unfortunate location which sits right on 5 tectonic plates of the earth---the most hostile position on earth anyone could imagine. India OTOH is not in such a situation.

I don't understand your opposition to nukes. There are thousands of safeguards that one follows. Japan being an island country and the disastrous location of that nuke plant in Fukushima is what caused that disaster to happen.

We have a lot of landmass deep inside TN or any other state.

Seriously man, relax.

Nobody ever predicted a Tsunami to hit TN but it did unexpectedly. The site of this particular reactor is right by the coast subject to cyclones every once in a while. Just look at google map for the location. In the US and Russia, any nuclear reactor problems were related to malfunctions and maintenance, not natural calamities. France is different like you state. it has many things going for it like location. not really known for earthquakes, Tsunamis, etc.

No country will release any documents or details that show their reactors in a negative light. In the US, some info has come to light but after much haggling...

 

[trinity]

Off topic: Did anyone get a glimpse of the fencing that is built on the Pakistan border? This is a perfect example of the gov;t is not doing its job properly. its in today's paper, sued to show the brave jawans who died in the avalanche. But the pic showed a the fence, not th one affected by the snow Avalanche. This is pathetic. No wonder we have infiltration problems. This is a border fence!!! i have a better fence around my house....this is why I distrust our govt.....they promise the world and sya this and that but the reality is quite different....if you guys take the time to look at the fence you would see what I mean. plz dont give rubnish excuses defending such practices. There is no excuse for poor fencing, it's the basics of any military, old or new.

 

[Bang Galore]

Off topic: Did anyone get a glimpse of the fencing that is built on the Pakistan border? This is a perfect example of the gov;t is not doing its job properly. its in today's paper, sued to show the brave jawans who died in the avalanche. But the pic showed a the fence, not th one affected by the snow Avalanche. This is pathetic. No wonder we have infiltration problems. This is a border fence!!! i have a better fence around my house....this is why I distrust our govt.....they promise the world and sya this and that but the reality is quite different....if you guys take the time to look at the fence you would see what I mean. plz dont give rubnish excuses defending such practices. There is no excuse for poor fencing, it's the basics of any military, old or new.

Don't know what fence you have around your house but I bet it cant be seen from space like the Indian fence on the Pakistani border.

 

[trinity]

Interesting :

Safety Of Nuclear Power Plants - Nuclear Power Corporation of India Limited





I cant find it now...the fence was shown with some soldier besides it on TOI and now it cannot accessed. Shame, coz you would see sorry state of affairs....nothing to boast of.....I google the fence and the images seem good but im sure those are pics were selected on purpose. Anyhow, if I find it, you will be blown away by how crappy it is .

I saw the pic...its from the dailymail. I have seen it before thats why I was amazed when the TOI puc showed a completely different picture.

 

[shiv]

trinity : For once, stop posting 'alternative energy sources' in the replies. Just come to the point. What's the exact problem with Kudankulam ?

#If kudankulam is wrong so is kalpakkam at the gates of Chennai. I cant comprehend why those dumbfuck NGOs are not closing it down.

 

[Tshering22]

Interesting :

Safety Of Nuclear Power Plants - Nuclear Power Corporation of India Limited





I cant find it now...the fence was shown with some soldier besides it on TOI and now it cannot accessed. Shame, coz you would see sorry state of affairs....nothing to boast of.....I google the fence and the images seem good but im sure those are pics were selected on purpose. Anyhow, if I find it, you will be blown away by how crappy it is .

I saw the pic...its from the dailymail. I have seen it before thats why I was amazed when the TOI puc showed a completely different picture.

There's a reason why the "alternates" you say are not being implemented. Here's the hint; the costs are too high and our people are not in a position to pay for it especially when people from developed countries itself cannot pay. That's why nuke is sought.

So till that time what do we do? sit and sweat it out in power cuts? That's more applicable to you guys who live in the intense heat of south India than me.

How can industries catch upto China if there are power cuts like this and load shedding goes on? If we have to stay competitive we need power.

China has been using nuke energy for so long. Look how bright their cities are! Like a disco. Everyone has been using them including us in existing nuclear plants and nothing has happened.

I don't understand why are you so worked up about Kudankulam just because foreign-funded loonies (who ironically themselves use nuclear plants) are telling.

---------- Post added at 12:00 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:58 AM ----------

Nobody ever predicted a Tsunami to hit TN but it did unexpectedly. The site of this particular reactor is right by the coast subject to cyclones every once in a while. Just look at google map for the location. In the US and Russia, any nuclear reactor problems were related to malfunctions and maintenance, not natural calamities. France is different like you state. it has many things going for it like location. not really known for earthquakes, Tsunamis, etc.

No country will release any documents or details that show their reactors in a negative light. In the US, some info has come to light but after much haggling...

Safeguards have to be taken. Nothing else can be done. Either you live in stone age or you progress. Your call.

Or you can do the honors of making 'alternate' sources cheaper; because currently they are so expensive that countries having more than $ 50,000 per capita income are not able to handle its costs.

India's location is one of the calmest in the world in terms of disaster prone zones. I think we should capitalize on it and not let any foreign motivated NGO trash our attempt. Trust me, these shytbags are always ruining our progress. If I were the state CM, I would put a ban on such funded (even sometimes religio-politically motivated) agencies.

 

[Sashan]

#If kudankulam is wrong so is kalpakkam at the gates of Chennai. I cant comprehend why those dumbfuck NGOs are not closing it down.

Well said.

---------- Post added at 01:36 AM ---------- Previous post was at 01:34 AM ----------

[/COLOR]

Safeguards have to be taken. Nothing else can be done. Either you live in stone age or you progress. .

Again well said. I second it.

 

[sss112]

There is an urgent need for better practices. Nobody is saying get off Nuclear energy immediately only till we have found a suitble replacement. India needs another agricultural revolution. Farmers have been farming for 1000's yrs without electricity right but I understand the need. I think the key is better practices and wherever possible wind tunnels/solar should and can be used. Even proper techniques of water irrigation will use less amounts of water bu get better results, thus less demand for el electricity to water the crops...There is a way but we have blind politics not pushing forth such ideas...


We are quick to dismiss NGO's but certain ones that don;t interfere with politics disseminate a lot of useful information especially farmers.

Dude you are coming back with the same stuff. And you logic of - we used to farming for so and so years before we could manage it now without electricity is pure crap. Never was a situation in history where every farmer had such small amount of land and a huge family to feed at the same time meeting other needs like education and welfare of his family with that as well which requires money.
And regarding irrigation, first you have pump out or transport water to your fields then the whole stuff of using "modern and efficient - read costly" ways of irrigation comes. I'm in farming so don't just use big words like those greenies on TV who have no idea of working for a living let alone working in a farm. Give me a practical solution and I'll accept it. Otherwise admit it that the so called alternative tech they pass BS around in magazines and newspapers is not upto the mark when it comes to meeting the daily needs of energy of an individual let alone making it to work out a whole sector of society.

I admit we can use Alternative Tech to ease out the load on the conventional form of energy, but thats all it can do right now.

 

[Tshering22]

Dude you are coming back with the same stuff. And you logic of - we used to farming for so and so years before we could manage it now without electricity is pure crap. Never was a situation in history where every farmer had such small amount of land and a huge family to feed at the same time meeting other needs like education and welfare of his family with that as well which requires money.
And regarding irrigation, first you have pump out or transport water to your fields then the whole stuff of using "modern and efficient - read costly" ways of irrigation comes. I'm in farming so don't just use big words like those greenies on TV who have no idea of working for a living let alone working in a farm. Give me a practical solution and I'll accept it. Otherwise admit it that the so called alternative tech they pass BS around in magazines and newspapers is not upto the mark when it comes to meeting the daily needs of energy of an individual let alone making it to work out a whole sector of society.

I admit we can use Alternative Tech to ease out the load on the conventional form of energy, but thats all it can do right now.

Don't bother... some people have this habit of living in the 15th century without realizing the contemporary challenges our nation faces.

The funny thing is, not even developed countries have been able to manage low-cost alternate energy. We've barely began using nuclear power.

Don't understand his paranoia of something that happened on an island nation.

 

[sss112]

Don't bother... some people have this habit of living in the 15th century without realizing the contemporary challenges our nation faces.

The funny thing is, not even developed countries have been able to manage low-cost alternate energy. We've barely began using nuclear power.

Don't understand his paranoia of something that happened on an island nation.

The problem is that the Green brigade usually underestimates the issues faced in real life by real people and overestimate the capabilities of the alternative technologies. They try to oversimplify everything.

When the person facing the problems is not consulted in this, he stops giving any crap about what the idiots are saying. Then they say, "People are not aware".

They just can't digest the fact that they are wrong. In their whole comfortable and provided for lives no one ever said that they were wrong, so facing reality and real people with real issues is new to these pampered, wise a$$ idiots.

 

[shiv]

I will try for the last time :

The fukushima plant was 1970 era design with ZERO passive cooling measures. Kudankulam has upto 3-4 passive cooling measures not withstanding the tremendous progress which have been made in both active cooling and passive cooling measures over four decades.

The fukushima plant gave in only after a massive earthquake followed by a tsunami had struck. What are the chances that such things happen in Tamil Nadu. FYI, TN is one of the least geologically active land plates in Indian sub continent. A google search will reveal when was the last time an earthquake( >6.5 richter scale ) occurred in TN.

Also the fukushima plant ( with 1970s design ) withstood about 40 years of high seismic activity throughout everyday. Then finally gave in only on the face of a combination of nature's two large destructive powers.

And finally, Does any one ever talk of another 1970 era Nuclear plant ( ~50kms away ) which was functioning all throughout this fukushima saga ? That 1970 design is still intact. During that fukushima meltdown, aftershocks etc, scores of localites took shelter in the GYM of that nuclear power plant as all their houses were destroyed and they thought the best place to protect them was to go in that nuclear plant.

So, yes theoretically chances that kudankulam nuclear plant will melt can never be zero. But in all likelihood, the probability of it's meltdown will be far lesser than the probability that you meet with a car accident on a highway. ie in all practicality the chances are zero.

I want trinity to refute the arguments purely on a technical basis rather than 'Oh let's use solar/tidal energy' crap.

 

[janon]

^^
There is a point after which you have to stop replying to broken records that keep repeating the same line over and over again. I had already explained the safety features of the new plants to him, and the fact that green energy can't produce a thousandth of what we need.

He keeps coming back with the same two points, and even ridicules the news sources (which happened to be the hindu) when given the statements of authorities in this regard. How many more pages should be devoted to willfully blind people?"

 

[lynx]

They just can't digest the fact that they are wrong. In their whole comfortable and provided for lives no one ever said that they were wrong, so facing reality and real people with real issues is new to these pampered, wise a$$ idiots.

Thank you for effectively describing the Green Troll brigade. If I had my way I would cut the water and power connection to the Green Troll's houses.Let them fend for themselves using alternative sources.

I am not against Green Energy, but it should not be at the sake of the progress of the nation.

 

[lynx]

I will try for the last time :

The fukushima plant was 1970 era design with ZERO passive cooling measures. Kudankulam has upto 3-4 passive cooling measures not withstanding the tremendous progress which have been made in both active cooling and passive cooling measures over four decades.

The fukushima plant gave in only after a massive earthquake followed by a tsunami had struck. What are the chances that such things happen in Tamil Nadu. FYI, TN is one of the least geologically active land plates in Indian sub continent. A google search will reveal when was the last time an earthquake( >6.5 richter scale ) occurred in TN.

Also the fukushima plant ( with 1970s design ) withstood about 40 years of high seismic activity throughout everyday. Then finally gave in only on the face of a combination of nature's two large destructive powers.

And finally, Does any one ever talk of another 1970 era Nuclear plant ( ~50kms away ) which was functioning all throughout this fukushima saga ? That 1970 design is still intact. During that fukushima meltdown, aftershocks etc, scores of localites took shelter in the GYM of that nuclear power plant as all their houses were destroyed and they thought the best place to protect them was to go in that nuclear plant.

So, yes theoretically chances that kudankulam nuclear plant will melt can never be zero. But in all likelihood, the probability of it's meltdown will be far lesser than the probability that you meet with a car accident on a highway. ie in all practicality the chances are zero.

I want trinity to refute the arguments purely on a technical basis rather than 'Oh let's use solar/tidal energy' crap.

This points have been explained over and over again in the media and at Govt level but the people protesting against the plant just chose not to listen and is forever chanting the Fukoshima mantra.