JF-17B Updates, News & Discussion

[echo 1]

Not every A/C is F16 and not every A/C is made by L.H Martin...do u think JF-17 will be able to do an effective dogfight with CFTs fitted to it...CFTs may have benefits but they hv limitations as well e.g g-load limitations and air drag and PAC even installed removable IFR probe just to reduce airdrag then why on Earth install CFTs..JF17 doesnt has a P&W engine like an F16..a lot of thrust diff b/w the two..and there are lot of other reasons like this...and why would it even need CFTs any major advantage?
PEACE!

chill, I dont think you know how CFTs really work. If they were not useful then why would majority of country with new F-16 Block 50/52+ have CFTs. If thy were not useful then why on earth would the Top fighters in the world be employing them. Eurofighere, F-18, F-15, F-CK-1 and even Rafale are all going to be using them in the future look it up. J-10 was under testing a little while back. So if most of the major powers of world are considering CFTs then it would be logical to assume that Pakistan will eventually deploy them as well. And you comment about load limitations, they are not used in every type of mission. They are primarily used when space is at a premium and there is an extended or long mission planned. Yes for air to air missions drop tanks are a logical option. What I have learned is that CFTs are also used during air to ground mission as well, you can tell as some of these fighters are employing CFTs and air to ground munitions. Please look up information before you post.

Eurofighter

Rafale

F-18 (in testing)

F-15

 

[MastanKhan]

Noob chill, I dont think you know how CFTs really work. If they were not useful then why would majority of country with new F-16 Block 50/52+ have CFTs. If thy were not useful then why on earth would the Top fighters in the world be employing them. Eurofighere, F-18, F-15, F-CK-1 and even Rafale are all going to be using them in the future look it up. J-10 was under testing a little while back. So if most of the major powers of world are considering CFTs then it would be logical to assume that Pakistan will eventually deploy them as well. And you comment about load limitations, they are not used in every type of mission. They are primarily used when space is at a premium and there is an extended or long mission planned. Yes for air to air missions drop tanks are a logical option. What I have learned is that CFTs are also used during air to ground mission as well, you can tell as some of these fighters are employing CFTs and air to ground munitions. Please look up information before you post.

Eurofighter
View attachment 394703
Rafale
View attachment 394704
F-18 (in testing)

F-15
View attachment 394705

Hi,

Seems like the young man has not studied physics in school.

The design is different in case of both---the drop off tanks are hanging down farther on the wing---they will create a massive centrifugal force in a sharp turn---they are also creating a lots of drag---.

OTOH---the conformal fuel tanks are attached to the body---right on the fuselage---they are aerodynamic in shape and are not creating any exessive centrifugal force.

 

[echo 1]

Hi,

Seems like the young man has not studied physics in school.

The design is different in case of both---the drop off tanks are hanging down farther on the wing---they will create a massive centrifugal force in a sharp turn---they are also creating a lots of drag---.

OTOH---the conformal fuel tanks are attached to the body---right on the fuselage---they are aerodynamic in shape and are not creating any exessive centrifugal force.

Thank you for driving the point home.

 

[MastanKhan]

Hi,

If the Paf is playing its cards right---then the JF17 B could basically be the test bed for all the EW suite and weapons testing for the BLK3---.

That may mean a fastrak induction of the JF17 BLK3 into the sqdrn's---as the years 2019 and 2020 are very critical for the Paf due to retiring aircraft.

@Bilal Khan (Quwa) @Bilal Khan 777

 

[khanasifm]

Air Platforms
Twin-seat JF-17B/FC-1B fighter makes first flight
Richard D Fisher Jr, Washington DC - IHS Jane's Defence Weekly
28 April 2017

The twin-seat FC-1B/JF-17B fighter recently conducted its maiden flight, according to images posted on Chinese online forums on 27 April. Source: Via FYJS web page


The twin-seat Pakistan Aeronautical Complex/Chengdu Aircraft Industry Corporation (PAC/CAC) JF-17B Thunder/FC-1B Xiaolong combat aircraft has made its maiden flight, according to images posted on Chinese online forums on 27 April.

The new variant of the JF-17/FC-1 fighter is believed to have completed its first flight from the CAC's airfield in Chengdu, where just a few days before it had been photographed conducting taxiing tests since at least 24 April.

The recently posted images confirm that the fighter has a larger swept-back vertical stabiliser as seen in a model of the aircraft shown at Airshow China in November 2016. They also confirm that the variant has a deeper dorsal spine, which adds fuel capacity to compensate for the additional weight.

Specifications provided by the Aviation Industry Corporation of China (AVIC) state the 'FC-1 Tandem Seat Trainer' has a larger wing span (9.465 m) than that of the single-seat variant (8.5 m) as well as a slightly modified nose section.

An AVIC official told Jane's at the 2017 IDEX show in Abu Dhabi that a new fly-by-wire system has helped reduce the weight of the new variant.

According to Jane's All the World's Aircraft: Development & Production , a Chinese display card emerged a few years ago quoting dimensions of the new variant that differed slightly from those of the single-seater, including height (4.6 m instead of 4.7 for the single seater) and length (14.5 m instead of 14.2 m).

A model of a tandem-seat FC-1 was first exhibited at the Paris Air Show in June 2013 by the China National Aero-Technology Import & Export Corporation (CATIC).

Chinese reports indicate the first prototype of the twin-seater was completed by late 2016.

View attachment 394073


View attachment 394074

Need to design mirage 3/5 style back seater ladder next

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AI.12.13



I don't think future block of JF-17s will have hybrid FBW system, read somewhere the that JF-17B is using full FBW .... BTW I wont be surprise if Blk-II is also using full FBW technology specially from 229 & onward....

 

[Windjammer]

Guys, check this out, the intake on JF-17B appears square compared to the single seat.
@Oscar @MastanKhan @HRK @khanasifm @Dazzler

 

[HRK]

Guys, check this out, the intake on JF-17B appears square compared to the single seat.
@Oscar @MastanKhan @HRK @khanasifm @Dazzler

View attachment 395679

View attachment 395681

need more clear picture this might be an illusion due to lighting effect & angle of the JF-17 flight appear in this pic

 

[Dazzler]

need more clear picture this might be an illusion due to lighting effect & angle of the JF-17 flight appear in this pic

Few more clearer shots would help.

 

[YeBeWarned]

As for me, Im an ordinary 30 year old trying to make somewhat of an honest living. Nothing special, beyond me getting my private pilot license which is great.

:O i thought you were some 50-60 year old ... but still don't leave man your posts are more than valuable than many on PDF thinks ..

 

[Thorough Pro]

Just the shadow/light effect. there are only 4 major changes in physical shape of "B".

• larger hump on spine
• Angular tail fin
• larger wings
• larger nose cone

Guys, check this out, the intake on JF-17B appears square compared to the single seat.
@Oscar @MastanKhan @HRK @khanasifm @Dazzler

View attachment 395679

View attachment 395681

 

[Talon]

chill, I dont think you know how CFTs really work. If they were not useful then why would majority of country with new F-16 Block 50/52+ have CFTs. If thy were not useful then why on earth would the Top fighters in the world be employing them. Eurofighere, F-18, F-15, F-CK-1 and even Rafale are all going to be using them in the future look it up. J-10 was under testing a little while back. So if most of the major powers of world are considering CFTs then it would be logical to assume that Pakistan will eventually deploy them as well. And you comment about load limitations, they are not used in every type of mission. They are primarily used when space is at a premium and there is an extended or long mission planned. Yes for air to air missions drop tanks are a logical option. What I have learned is that CFTs are also used during air to ground mission as well, you can tell as some of these fighters are employing CFTs and air to ground munitions. Please look up information before you post.

Eurofighter
View attachment 394703
Rafale
View attachment 394704
F-18 (in testing)

F-15
View attachment 394705

And u missed the point that all these aircrafts except F-16 are dual engine aircrafts and have better engines then JF-17.Moreover u urself said TOP FIGHTERS IN THE WORLD and sorry to say JF-17 is not a top fighter and even CFTs on these A/Cs are under testing phase...
PEACE!

Hi,

Seems like the young man has not studied physics in school.

The design is different in case of both---the drop off tanks are hanging down farther on the wing---they will create a massive centrifugal force in a sharp turn---they are also creating a lots of drag---.

OTOH---the conformal fuel tanks are attached to the body---right on the fuselage---they are aerodynamic in shape and are not creating any exessive centrifugal force.

Seems like u forgot CFTs aren't empty they have fuel in them...they do increase load on the A/C and they still increase drag..

 

[khanasifm]

Cft go to lm website for details also there is a clip on YouTube about block 3 where am masood akhtar rtd did mention there is a possibility of Cft on block 3 to enhance range bottom line cft drag is far far far less compared to drops so benefits out weigh the impact the very reason most Morden fighter have it an option you do have a choice to not install them if not needed based on requirement at the time

 

[MastanKhan]

Cft go to lm website for details also there is a clip on YouTube about block 3 where am masood akhtar rtd did mention there is a possibility of Cft on block 3 to enhance range bottom line cft drag is far far far less compared to drops so benefits out weigh the impact the very reason most Morden fighter have it an option you do have a choice to not install them if not needed based on requirement at the time

Hi,

The CFT would be proportional to the size of the aircraft---smaller aircraft will have a smaller CFT.

If you would have done some reading on the subject matter---that would have helped.

“The CFTs have very little adverse effect on the F-16’s renowned performance. A set of CFTs carries 50 percent more fuel than the centerline external fuel tank, but has only 12 percent of the drag. The aircraft retains its full 9-g capability and flight envelope with the CFTs installed. The drag impact is very small, less than one percent in combat configuration at cruise conditions.”

“The flying qualities of the F-16 with CFTs are essentially unchanged when compared to a non-CFT equipped airplane. For most combat flight conditions, it’s as if the CFTs are not even there. The surest way for me to tell if CFTs are installed is to look over my shoulder.”


http://foxtrotalpha.jalopnik.com/why-dont-new-u-s-air-force-f-16s-use-these-futuristic-1712746714

A loaded up F15 without barely makes 5 - 7 G's.

The only issue here would be the stress on the structure.

 

[ziaulislam]

Hi,

The CFT would be proportional to the size of the aircraft---smaller aircraft will have a smaller CFT.

If you would have done some reading on the subject matter---that would have helped.

“The CFTs have very little adverse effect on the F-16’s renowned performance. A set of CFTs carries 50 percent more fuel than the centerline external fuel tank, but has only 12 percent of the drag. The aircraft retains its full 9-g capability and flight envelope with the CFTs installed. The drag impact is very small, less than one percent in combat configuration at cruise conditions.”

“The flying qualities of the F-16 with CFTs are essentially unchanged when compared to a non-CFT equipped airplane. For most combat flight conditions, it’s as if the CFTs are not even there. The surest way for me to tell if CFTs are installed is to look over my shoulder.”


http://foxtrotalpha.jalopnik.com/why-dont-new-u-s-air-force-f-16s-use-these-futuristic-1712746714

A loaded up F15 without barely makes 5 - 7 G's.

The only issue here would be the stress on the structure.

And the engine . we will need a 20% increase in thrust.

 

[khanasifm]

We ??? You may need 20% thrust