JF-17B - EW 'Growler'

[Basel]

@GriffinsRule This is a logical conclusion of developing AESA blueprint for airforce.

What is your view about requirement of a PAF version of Growler??

Do we need one?
If yes, then what should and could do?
Which platform will be good to fill that role and available??

 

[Windjammer]

there is no such project under going at CAC, EW fighter is very expensive, there is no such thing called "cheaper" EW fighter, as EW's sole role is to sucessfully jam enemy's electronic signal, while ensuring it's own side enjoys asymmetirc battle awareness`````

I believe this is a EW package from Indra on trial as far back as 2016.

 

[Basel]

Are you not reading my Text ? and just quoting me for the sake of it
This Area Denial Weapon and Indian army will use it , hell any one would use it i have already said No weapon how accurate they can work 100 % Exactly many things do come into Play Terrain , distance of target Obviously they wont go against Targets which are 400 KMs away as Missile will lose Power in the End and enemy will be able to evade that But you do have to understand that
Lets Say is Inside 100 KM inside Indian Territory , they can still 250 to 300 KM cover inside Pakistan as Most Artillery and MRLS in Pakistan dont have range about 100 KM so in that sense they are safe Yes Babur is another version of tom hawk with terrain hugging but Modern Sams can detect and fight against Cruise missiles as well
it will depend on the capability that Missile in the end and best bet for Pakistan will be to use Swarm just as other we discussed with other poster
and
Please do tell me Which platform in Pakistani inventory has Jamming capabilities which can counter s300 or s400 Mirage , F7 , Thunder , F16 ? Unless you use AWACS


Thats how Actual Drone Swarms will Attack

What about C-802/803 and C-602G?? And H Series of standoff munitions along with A-100Es? All are above 100km weapons.

JH-7E
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If its that good then why J-15/16 based solution is developed??

we should develop jf-17b into this configuration and i think it would prove a better platform than jh-7E

The better solution may be CH-7 stealth drone/UCAV, which will have better chances of survival and can be deployed over enemy territory when needed with not putting any human in harms way.

EW configuration had been tested on a blk 2 single seat jf-17 quite extensively. The option is there and will be used when felt necessary.

How capable this system is?

yes. we both agree; jh-7 is the most ideal aircraft for deep strike and many SOW platform; many members dont see the point yet .

Its not about the members here, its about the military they have rejected it comprehensively as obsolete bird, and China have pitched other options which are not disclosed till now.

there is no such project under going at CAC, EW fighter is very expensive, there is no such thing called "cheaper" EW fighter, as EW's sole role is to sucessfully jam enemy's electronic signal, while ensuring it's own side enjoys asymmetirc battle awareness`````

AVIC is working on may EW based solutions and it include Stealth UCAVs too.

 

[LKJ86]

If its that good then why J-15/16 based solution is developed??

I didn't say it is good or not. I just provided the related informations that I knew. That is all.

 

[rcrmj]

Well kiddo the modified jf-17 for EW role will not be a cheap like f-15 strike eagle developed from original f15.

there is no EW JF-17 in development at CAC, they are working on block III`````period

and here is more info for newbie like you, JF-17 block II was designed with open interface, therefore it can carry out multi-role tasks, air-to-air, air-to-ground, air-to-sea, and some EW task```` so it is not specially "modified" for carrying an EW pod, because it is what designed to do````

but a dedicated EW fighter is well another story, that costs more than a stealth fighter````and CAC is not working on that```

I believe this is a EW package from Indra on trial as far back as 2016.

it is an EW pod and the plane is still a JF-17 block II````this pod was based on the original one used by JH-7, J-11B, J-16 and J-10`` there is no JF-17 version EW fighter under development````an EW fighter and an EW pod is two totally different thing`````

 

[Dazzler]

there is no EW JF-17 in development at CAC, they are working on block III`````period

and here is more info for newbie like you, JF-17 block II was designed with open interface, therefore it can carry out multi-role tasks, air-to-air, air-to-ground, air-to-sea, and some EW task```` so it is not specially "modified" for carrying an EW pod, because it is what designed to do````

but a dedicated EW fighter is well another story, that costs more than a stealth fighter````and CAC is not working on that```

it is an EW pod and the plane is still a JF-17 block II````this pod was based on the original one used by JH-7, J-11B, J-16 and J-10`` there is no JF-17 version EW fighter under development````an EW fighter and an EW pod is two totally different thing`````

Come to KAMRA and see what they've been doing with this plane for the last five years. The aircraft in picture is clearly equipped with two pods, a hint that a Wild Wiesel or even aggressive jamming configuration was being tested. In other words, it is not appropriate to speak on things without knowledge. Unless you know for sure that there will be EW configuration in jf-17, it is too early to go into the naivety mode.

I have had seen a few things hence my claim that a lot is going on at KAMRA.

 

[LeGenD]

EA-18G Growler is a complex piece of engineering, and pack lot of punch in EW.

- 3 x AN/ALQ-99(v) tactical jamming pods (1 x Low Band on the Center; and 2 x High Band on the LEFT and RIGHT); 6.8 kW each, and computer controlled (automatic radar signal processing).

- ALQ-218(v)2 electronic surveillance and electronic attack suite [INTERNAL and EXTERNAL components]
* (RWR/ESW/ELINT functions with 2 x wingtip pods); HARM targeting concurrent with jamming activity [bands 1 - 10].

- Interference Cancellation System** [INTERNAL]; uninterrupted UHF communications during jamming activity.

- AN/ALQ-227(v)1 Communications Countermeasures Set [INTERNAL] = transmit function through AN/ALQ-99(V) radar jamming pod (1 x Low Band on the Center).

- ALE-50 towed decoy.

*360 degree coverage to figure out what the emitters are and where they are, to disrupt adversary kill chains.
**ICANS in short.

The aircraft is equipped with two engines (F414-GE-400), to manage its heavy payload without significant compromises in KINEMATICS.

The aircraft is equipped with AN/APG-79(v) radar system*** (Optimized for EW operations; 222 KM range)

***Primary characteristics include: Identification Friend or Foe (IFF) [Side Info], Non-Coperative Target Recognition (NCTR) – Narrow Beam Interleaved Search and Track [Class Info], Continous Tracking Capability [Phased Array Radar], Track While Scan (TWS), Low Probability of Intercept (LPI), Pulse Doppler Radar (Full LDSD Capability), Active Electronically Scanned Array (AESA).

The entire electronic warfare system of the aircraft is INTEGRATED:-

Avionics include ASQ-228 Advanced Targeting FLIR (ATFLIR), Shared Reconnaissance Pod (SHARP) and Joint Helmet Mounted Cueing System (JMHCS). Operators include one pilot and one electronic warfare operations officer.

The aircraft ensure full spectrum AEA

---

PAF should order these, when relations with US normalize. A squadron of these would be excellent for operations in a battlespace involving S-400 systems in the future.

 

[CriticalThought]

PAF should order these, when relations with US normalize. A squadron of these would be excellent for operations in a battlespace involving S-400 systems in the future.

The S-400 is meant for operation in highly challenging EM environments. Also, can you tell me what's the offensive range for the systems you mentioned?

 

[Basel]

Come to KAMRA and see what they've been doing with this plane for the last five years. The aircraft in picture is clearly equipped with two pods, a hint that a Wild Wiesel or even several aggressive jamming configuration was being tested. In other words, it is not appropriate to speak on things without knowledge. Unless you know for sure that there will be EW configuration in jf-17, it is too early to go into the naivety mode.

I have had seen a few things hence my claim that a lot is going on at KAMRA.

PAF need a wild Wiesel bird and JFT is the one they can play with to get one as there is no better economical and free hand working option available.

 

[denel]

What about C-802/803 and C-602G?? And H Series of standoff munitions along with A-100Es? All are above 100km weapons.



If its that good then why J-15/16 based solution is developed??



The better solution may be CH-7 stealth drone/UCAV, which will have better chances of survival and can be deployed over enemy territory when needed with not putting any human in harms way.



How capable this system is?



Its not about the members here, its about the military they have rejected it comprehensively as obsolete bird, and China have pitched other options which are not disclosed till now.



AVIC is working on may EW based solutions and it include Stealth UCAVs too.

Its ok; but the leadership is what has been part of the problem overall; so anything they accept or reject is very much at doubt on their incapabilities.

 

[Basel]

Its ok; but the leadership is what has been part of the problem overall; so anything they accept or reject is very much at doubt on their incapabilities.

I don't think PAF and PN are incompetent as they both tested it separately and comprehensively.

 

[Dazzler]

EW and RWR suite is from Indra. Even simulator hardware came from Spain.

 

[SQ8]

Its ok; but the leadership is what has been part of the problem overall; so anything they accept or reject is very much at doubt on their incapabilities.

It isn’t all leadership as the usual tripe by a member is all about that(since he doesn’t know anything else or has any experience or connections to either military or industry).

There have been key mistakes made but mostly due to corruption and self interest, but many decisions were fairly smart considering budget considerations and lack of sources.

One can parrot “leadership” or non-technical blabber to disguise one own need of self fellatio, but at the end there are MANY factors that include operational considerations such as training, logistics and force integration; all of which end up defined under the budget.
A budget which a bad government can throw into disarry. Take a look at the example closest to home; the homegrown solution in the Cheetah which is still very relevant to the security scenario was sold and the Gripen came in. Now, thanks to the economy under Zuma I read an AFM article where even half the fleet wasn’t available and they were putting them in storage due to lack of budget. Can that be blamed on the SAAF leadership alone? If the economy went bust under a bad government?

 

[Silicon0000]

there is no EW JF-17 in development at CAC, they are working on block III`````period

and here is more info for newbie like you, JF-17 block II was designed with open interface, therefore it can carry out multi-role tasks, air-to-air, air-to-ground, air-to-sea, and some EW task```` so it is not specially "modified" for carrying an EW pod, because it is what designed to do````

but a dedicated EW fighter is well another story, that costs more than a stealth fighter````and CAC is not working on that```

it is an EW pod and the plane is still a JF-17 block II````this pod was based on the original one used by JH-7, J-11B, J-16 and J-10`` there is no JF-17 version EW fighter under development````an EW fighter and an EW pod is two totally different thing`````

````an EW fighter and an EW pod is two totally different thing`````

 

[messiach]

Yes. A SEAD version is in blueprint.

What is your view about requirement of a PAF version of Growler??
Do we need one?