JF-17 Thunder Multirole Fighter [Thread 7]

[Cool_Soldier]

waiting for Block 3 first prototype picture available publically

 

[Chak Bamu]

False on logical and technical level.

Smokeless means full combustion
Full combustion means higher temperature
higher turbine temperature means change the design / materials / everything.

All engines smoke at one or another condition.

If fuel contains molecules with more carbon-carbon bonds (branched olefins, double bonds, etc...) then the combustion would be less efficient for a given temperature, leading to more smoke.

 

[Asad-Ali]

Couple of years old video of jf-17b twin seater

 

[MastanKhan]

False on logical and technical level.

Smokeless means full combustion
Full combustion means higher temperature
higher turbine temperature means change the design / materials / everything.

All engines smoke at one or another condition.

Hi,

The chemical engineer who did the chemical analysis on Victor's Mig25 fuel---sat across the desk from me and shared the information---. We had worked together for a couple of years---.

You should read up on some old cold war books---to learn that older russian fighter aircraft were smokeless---and american aircraft smoked a lot---.

The chemical analysis of the fuel from Victor's plane was the biggest surprise for the americans---.

Now all american planes are smokeless and russian---? They can't afford the process---.

The chemical constiuency and the processing of Victor's plane's fuel had nothing to do with LOGIC---.

Your comments are meaningless---you are thinking that simple reasoning of 1+1=2 will justify---not not russians---.

 

[messiach]

@MastanKhan Efficient combustion comes with imposed penalties. Shahid raza Sahib require a synopsis review in CE.

False on logical and technical level.

Smokeless means full combustion
Full combustion means higher temperature
higher turbine temperature means change the design / materials / everything.

All engines smoke at one or another condition.

 

[khanasifm]

 

[mshan44]

 

[Sinnerman108]

If fuel contains molecules with more carbon-carbon bonds (branched olefins, double bonds, etc...) then the combustion would be less efficient for a given temperature, leading to more smoke.

Jet Fuel is hydrocarbons.
hydrocarbons are of several chain lengths
The refining process can be optimized to give a certain length ( hydrocarbon condensation / distillation ).
In a few cases we saw special fuels used, Foxbat was one example.

my initial argument is still valid.

The most critical part of the jet engine design is in the turbine stage.
and the most problematic part is the turbine blade's capacity to survive in heat.
This determines the engine's MTBR;
This is the single biggest most critical problem in the whole game; everything else is predicated on this.

If the turbine stage temperature increases ... as you can see everything changes !

@MastanKhan Let it go.

Hi,

The chemical engineer who did the chemical analysis on Victor's Mig25 fuel---sat across the desk from me and shared the information---. We had worked together for a couple of years---.

Now that I am getting old
I sometimes try to explain and teach young people.

I don't expect them to understand everything I say, and they very seldom surprise me.

 

[GEMINI]

Jet Fuel is hydrocarbons.
hydrocarbons are of several chain lengths
The refining process can be optimized to give a certain length ( hydrocarbon condensation / distillation ).
In a few cases we saw special fuels used, Foxbat was one example.

my initial argument is still valid.

The most critical part of the jet engine design is in the turbine stage.
and the most problematic part is the turbine blade's capacity to survive in heat.
This determines the engine's MTBR;
This is the single biggest most critical problem in the whole game; everything else is predicated on this.

If the turbine stage temperature increases ... as you can see everything changes !

@MastanKhan Let it go.

True, but then engineering is never that straight and simple. Just change the speed at which air enters the turbine and your combustion zone shifts. Control the fuel and air temperature and you can have pre and post burning or add another reheat at the later stages to add thrust/ get more efficiency.
The problem with aircraft engines is their vast operational range. They can be operating on ground (ambient conditions of air temp. and pressure) or at 30000 feet with very cold air and very low ambient pressure.

These can put an immediate thrust demand adding a lot of fuel and stressing fuel/ air mix system. I pity the people who write the control logic for such systems. They have to code for optimum output (not compromising output with maintaining decent fuel efficiency). I believe all aircraft engines smoke at some point (one can reduce the smoke range to a bare minimum). These machines are not like our power gas turbines. I have never seen the control logic of an air craft engine but i believe they take certain penalties on fuel efficiency to keep thrust out put high and response time as low as possible.

 

[ziaulislam]

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Wrong description of hard points

 

[MastanKhan]

Jet Fuel is hydrocarbons.
hydrocarbons are of several chain lengths
The refining process can be optimized to give a certain length ( hydrocarbon condensation / distillation ).
In a few cases we saw special fuels used, Foxbat was one example.

my initial argument is still valid.

The most critical part of the jet engine design is in the turbine stage.
and the most problematic part is the turbine blade's capacity to survive in heat.
This determines the engine's MTBR;
This is the single biggest most critical problem in the whole game; everything else is predicated on this.

If the turbine stage temperature increases ... as you can see everything changes !

@MastanKhan Let it go.



Now that I am getting old
I sometimes try to explain and teach young people.

I don't expect them to understand everything I say, and they very seldom surprise me.

Hi,

I don't have any problem with your definition---. I just shared an accidental conversation that I had with one of my colleagues---.

There is 1 in 3 billion chance that I would come across the chemical engineer who analyzed the fuel on the mig25 some 30 years ago from the time of our interaction---and I comment on it 10 years later---.

So---I don't understand where let go and let not becomes an issue here---.

 

[khanasifm]

In movie parwaz hei junoon there was a comparison of aerodynamic capabilities of jf vs mirage 2000 but cannot find the clip would like to revisit and understand the comprision

Is this movie expected to be made available on Netflix ??

They should

 

[Sinnerman108]

In movie parwaz hei junoon there was a comparison of aerodynamic capabilities of jf vs mirage 2000 but cannot find the clip would like to revisit and understand the comprision

Is this movie expected to be made available on Netflix ??

They should

Mirage and JF ...
two very different machines based on two very different aerodynamic design paradigms.
Mirage 2000 actually sacrificed some of the original design parameters to do same things that F-16s and likes were doing.

 

[mshan44]

Love this beast. in this pic jf 17 just looks like twin brother of f16

 

[Maxpane]