JF-17 Thunder Multirole Fighter [Thread 2]

[Keysersoze]

The above does pose the question of whether they are waiting for the Chinese engine or are going to use the Russian one.

 

[DANGER-ZONE]

OK
CAN ANY ONE TELL ME THAT WHAT THE HEK THIS "FLY-BY-WIRE" IS?AND WAT IS ITS RELATION WITH ROLING AN AIRCRAFT USING AILERONS AND STABILATORS TOO.
AND PLZ SHOW ME THE PLACE WHERE TARGETING POD IS FITTED IN JF-17.

 

[DANGER-ZONE]

NEW IDEA FOR HARD POINTS FOR JF-17.
COMENTS PLZ COMENTS

 

[Patriot]

The fly-by-wire flight control system eliminates the complexity, fragility and weight of the mechanical circuit of the hydromechanical flight control systems and replaces it with an electrical circuit. The cockpit controls now operate signal transducers which generate the appropriate commands, that are in turn processed by an electronic controller. The autopilot is now part of the electronic controller.
More Here: Aircraft flight control systems - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
All of the new jets are controlled by FBW.

 

[DANGER-ZONE]

THIS IS ANOTHER PIC FOR THE HARD POINT VIEW.

 

[DANGER-ZONE]

The fly-by-wire flight control system eliminates the complexity, fragility and weight of the mechanical circuit of the hydromechanical flight control systems and replaces it with an electrical circuit. The cockpit controls now operate signal transducers which generate the appropriate commands, that are in turn processed by an electronic controller. The autopilot is now part of the electronic controller.
More Here: Aircraft flight control systems - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
All of the new jets are controlled by FBW.

SO JF-17 IS OPERATED WITH THIS TECNOLOGY OR NOT?

 

[PAFAce]

CAN ANY ONE TELL ME THAT WHAT THE HEK THIS "FLY-BY-WIRE" IS?AND WAT IS ITS RELATION WITH ROLING AN AIRCRAFT USING AILERONS AND STABILATORS TOO.

Short answer: A computer sits between the pilot and the airplane. The pilot controls the computer, and the computer controls the plane. The pilot does NOT directly operate the plane, reducing his work-load tremendously (under normal circumstances).

A very basic high-to-low level-to-level description is given below. A level only controls the one below it and has no direct control over any levels below it, under routine circumstances (emergency cases are different due to multiple redundancies of various types).

Levels Before Fly-By-Wire:
- Pilot
- Pulleys/Levers/Mechanical/Hydromechanical Systems
- Aircraft

Fly-By-Wire Control Levels:
- Pilot
- Flight Control System (may have one main computer, aka Centralized Control, or more than one computers, aka Distributed Control)
- Pulleys/Levers/Mechanical/Hydromechanical Systems
- Aircraft

What this means is that, when you want to control the aircraft, your action (stick movement, throttle movement, etc) essentially sends electrical signals to the computer(s), which in turn actuate/activate the mechanical/hydromechanical systems required. This makes control of the aircraft a lot more precise, and again, reduces pilot work-load. FBW FCS also allow the aircraft to be designed to be aerodynamically unstable, resulting in better overall agility and performance.

The JF-17 has a composite Flight Control System, a fancy way of saying, it is not completely digital FBW. If I remember correctly, it has digital FBW for the pitch axis and conventional control for the roll and yaw axes. There are plans to have a complete digital FBW system by the next major upgrade (after the first 50), but that is not confirmed.

The F-16 was the aircraft that pioneered FBW FCS for fighter aircraft. The FBW concept was around before the F-16, but the F-16 solidified it, and it has been used in all modern aircraft ever since. It can be said that the F-16 has spoiled the PAF pilots, and the JF-17 will bring them back down to earth with more old-fashioned piloting.

That's a joke, obviously. We've been flying the crap out of the non-FBW aircraft for an eternity.

 

[Arsalan]

SO JF-17 IS OPERATED WITH THIS TECNOLOGY OR NOT?

partially yes! The aircraft has a composite flight control system (FCS), comprising of conventional controls with stability augmentation in the yaw and roll axis and a digital fly-by-wire (FBW) system in the pitch axis. thus the JF do not have a FNW in cross axis. Some sources state that the system will be upgraded to provide fly-by-wire flight control in the roll and yaw axis also.

unlike many modren jets it is not a complete FBW.

i hope this helps!

regards!

 

[DANGER-ZONE]

THEN HOW CAN WE SAY THAT JF-17 IS A GOOD 21CENTURY AIRCRAFT?IF IT DEALS WITH SO COMPLEX CONTROLS.
AND PAF USE TO COMPARE JF-17 WITH F-16,I THINK IT IS NOT EVEN CLOSE TO F-16 BLOCK-15!
NO AESA,NO FBW,NOT MUCH WEIGHT LIFTING AIRCRAFT AND FEW HARD POINTS????
I THAUGHT JF-17 WOULD B GREATER THEN LCA.

 

[gambit]

partially yes! The aircraft has a composite flight control system (FCS), comprising of conventional controls with stability augmentation in the yaw and roll axis and a digital fly-by-wire (FBW) system in the pitch axis. thus the JF do not have a FNW in cross axis. Some sources state that the system will be upgraded to provide fly-by-wire flight control in the roll and yaw axis also.

unlike many modren jets it is not a complete FBW.

i hope this helps!

regards!

Gentlemen,

I will clear up a few misconceptions.

Stability Augmentations have always been incorporated in computerized FCS, be it electro-mech-hydro or fly-by-wire. There are pitch Stab Aug, roll Stab Aug and yaw Stab Aug. The two main aircrafts in my life were the F-111 and F-16. The 1960s technology F-111 had three flight control computers: Pitch, Roll and Yaw. The only F-111 model I have no experience are the Australian's, but the FCS for all are the same. I worked on the F-16A-thru-D up to block 30. And I have less experience on F-4 and F-15, lesser experience on C-130, including the AC-130 gunship. All of these aircrafts have some forms of computerized stability augmentations in all three flight axis.

When an aircraft is in flight, and we can go far back to the biplane era, the aircraft is under constant buffeting from aerodynamic forces, making flight very uncomfortable and physically demanding on the body and the mind as the pilot must constantly compensate for deviations, minor and major, thru pilot inputs. The inventions of gyroscopes, which has a branch call 'acceleromters', coupled with increasingly sophisticated electronics, allow us to off-load these minor flight control inputs to the computers. As gyroscopes and accelerometers becomes more sensitive and reliable, flight control surfaces movements also becomes more responsive and minute, resulting in even more stable and comfortable flight. As speed approaches Mach, stab-aug became a quasi-requirement and not a luxury as even the smallest aerodynamic induced deviation that are uncorrected can make an aircraft be out of control.

The Real X-Men | Military Aviation | Air & Space Magazine

Two things had been learned from earlier rocketplane experience: First, stability—the quality that enables an airplane to be controlled by a pilot—decreased steadily with increasing speed; and second, aerodynamic heating would weaken and distort an airplane’s structure in flight.

The Real X-Men | Military Aviation | Air & Space Magazine

Ships 1 and 2 had conventional controls, plus a three-axis stability augmentation system, which would weakly counteract any unintended motions in pitch, yaw, or roll. Ship 3 had the fly-by-wire adaptive flight control system that Armstrong helped design.

Note that -- stability decreases with increasing speed.

In an electro-mech-hydro FCS, pilot inputs are in PARALLEL paths: the mechanical linkages and a 'transducer' which translate the same linkage movement into electrical signals and send them to the FCS computers. The mechanical linkages are subtly overriden by electrical flight control signals from the FCS computers. Mechanical linkages are the initiators of a movement. Once the aircraft is in motion in response, gyros and accelerometers measures deviations from the command, if any, and the computer sends corrrection signals to an electrical motor that are in the same stream as the linkages. The processes are very subtle and milliseconds quick. The final corrected commands are received by the hydraulic actuators that finally move the flight control surfaces. In a straight and level flight with no pilot commands, these surfaces are NOT idle. They are in constant response to the FCS computers' commands, especially the horizontal stabs. May be the rudder can be idle but in a coordinated turn, which pretty is every turn, yaw stab-aug does occur.

In an electrical FCS, aka 'fly-by-wire', the computer does everything, from receiving pilot command degree and rate to calculating the final command to the hydraulics, in all three axis. Stability augmentation included. It does not matter if one flight axis is under the one type of FCS or the other, for modern jet fighters, all have stability augmentation in all three axis.

 

[Patriot]

partially yes! The aircraft has a composite flight control system (FCS), comprising of conventional controls with stability augmentation in the yaw and roll axis and a digital fly-by-wire (FBW) system in the pitch axis. thus the JF do not have a FNW in cross axis. Some sources state that the system will be upgraded to provide fly-by-wire flight control in the roll and yaw axis also.

unlike many modren jets it is not a complete FBW.

i hope this helps!

regards!

According to some guys at PAKDEF..There was a bug with Axis FBW and it was fixed and it is complete FBW now.

 

[Munir]

May be the rudder can be idle but in a coordinated turn, which pretty is every turn, yaw stab-aug does occur.

The rudder is not triggered after certain speed.

 

[DANGER-ZONE]

According to some guys at PAKDEF..There was a bug with Axis FBW and it was fixed and it is complete FBW now.

what jf-17.? is it controled wid digital FBW?

 

[a1b2c145]

THIS IS ANOTHER PIC FOR THE HARD POINT VIEW.

Hardly believe that Jf-17 has two hard points besides air inlet port,isn't it???

 

[DANGER-ZONE]

Hardly believe that Jf-17 has two hard points besides air inlet port,isn't it???

its not! its just my idea for new hardpoints