Its official now--India, Russia to design T-50 5th generation fighter at $295 mln

[rockstarIN]

295$ million is design cost. Total development cost around 5 Billion. Each piece will be of 100$ Million. India wants 300 such fighters. so around $30 Billion + $5 Billion = 35$ Billion

Are we able to build a stealth fighter @$100 M per plane?

Where as EF costs around 60-70 Million.

Three chances

1. Cost wont be 100 Million per plane.

2. Serious compromise on stealth, may be slightly above F-15 Silent Eagle.

3. Else Russians invented something other than conventional stealth technology, which is cost effective and above US technology.

 

[pulsar220]

Are we able to build a stealth fighter @$100 M per plane?

Where as EF costs around 60-70 Million.

Three chances

1. Cost wont be 100 Million per plane.

2. Serious compromise on stealth, may be slightly above F-15 Silent Eagle.

3. Else Russians invented something other than conventional stealth technology, which is cost effective and above US technology.

manufacturing costs is less here than the west..

 

[rockstarIN]

manufacturing costs is less here than the west..

You mean cheat labour?

 

[tallboy123]

You mean cheat labour?

Dear friend,it's not cheap labour,It's money value..
$1=45Rs..
So if u manufacture..
F-22 in India..
F-22 is about $300Million(God know wat's there in it)
It will cost Quarter of $300 million..

 

[sancho]

Are we able to build a stealth fighter @$100 M per plane?

Where as EF costs around 60-70 Million.

Three chances

1. Cost wont be 100 Million per plane.

2. Serious compromise on stealth, may be slightly above F-15 Silent Eagle.

3. Else Russians invented something other than conventional stealth technology, which is cost effective and above US technology.

If the $100 million will be reality will be cleared only when the fighters will be ready, especially if they will come in the time that they are planed (Russian and Indian developments are known for delays and this is a very difficult one), but you can't compare it to the high R&D and production costs in Europe, not to mention the change rates of the Euro.
Pak Fa and FGFA should be clearly better than the F15SE (which is aimed at the same price btw), because of real stealthy design (airframe, fully internal weapon bays, angled tail fins), not just upgraded. However, the real question will be how it will compare to stealth of F35, or a future J-XX, but that can be said only when we see the final prototype.

 

[angeldemon_007]

F-22 is about $300Million(God know wat's there in it)

Don't talk smack about the best flying bird. From an engineer point of view its a beauty.
Secondly, the main reason for its high cost was limited number of units. US does not want to give this bird to any1 else. If they would have agreed to produce this bird in the same number as F35. The price would have decreased considerably, something around 200 million $.

 

[Ghostwhowalks]

If the $100 million will be reality will be cleared only when the fighters will be ready, especially if they will come in the time that they are planed (Russian and Indian developments are known for delays and this is a very difficult one), but you can't compare it to the high R&D and production costs in Europe, not to mention the change rates of the Euro.
Pak Fa and FGFA should be clearly better than the F15SE (which is aimed at the same price btw), because of real stealthy design (airframe, fully internal weapon bays, angled tail fins), not just upgraded. However, the real question will be how it will compare to stealth of F35, or a future J-XX, but that can be said only when we see the final prototype.

do you mean to imply that PAK FA will probably be inferior to JXX

JXX is a paper plane from a country that is struggling to manufacture a fourth gen jet. And you are pitting it against one of the premier fighter manufacturer in the world with a proven track record.

 

[angeldemon_007]

Now there are some articles opposing the deal in the media. I am not saying there should not be other opinion but still if these people were opposed to deal, then where were they when the matter was under consideration? They should have published their articles 6 months ago why now ?
I am still confused about the FGFA, what will be its design ? Whether it will be stealthier than PakFa? Should we buy PakFa instead ? What will be the exact nature of India's participation ? Whether Russia will share the important techs of Stealth development ? Whether we will learn something worthy to develop our AMCA ? etc.
I have even read in forums of defence.pk that India will buy 50 PakFa in the beginning but I have never seen any official report about this, except the speculation on this forum.
In my opinion, if it turns out that FGFA is not better than PakFa we should buy PakFa only.

 

[sancho]

do you mean to imply that PAK FA will probably be inferior to JXX

JXX is a paper plane from a country that is struggling to manufacture a fourth gen jet. And you are pitting it against one of the premier fighter manufacturer in the world with a proven track record.

You couldn't rule it out, before you have at least seen the J-XX prototype right? The J10 is already flying, same as J11, where they still struggle are their own engines, but that doesn't mean they can't develop fighters. Not to forget that they might have less know how than Russia, but way more money to fund such projects, so underestimating the Chinese is the biggest mistake one can do.

 

[shaktiman2010]

Don't talk smack about the best flying bird. From an engineer point of view its a beauty.
Secondly, the main reason for its high cost was limited number of units. US does not want to give this bird to any1 else. If they would have agreed to produce this bird in the same number as F35. The price would have decreased considerably, something around 200 million $.

cool down buddy. I don't know why but talking about american planes brings out wrong side of Indo-americans, that's funny.

Also, he is just an Indian so don't expect him to pray and worship american planes. Just learn to be little humble and patient to other cultures. Just little more common sense!

F-22 is an over-expensive plane with paper-RCS whose combat utility is still not proven in battlefield. So, we will see how it performs with its copied German technology, when its actually used in war(if ever).

Also, its doubtful that USA has anything new to offer with F-22 since its a piece of steel junk without ToT. So, India won't buy it even if offered.

 

[shaktiman2010]

I have even read in forums of defence.pk that India will buy 50 PakFa in the beginning but I have never seen any official report about this, except the speculation on this forum.
In my opinion, if it turns out that FGFA is not better than PakFa we should buy PakFa only.

Its not about what is better or best. Its about what IAF wants. The mere reason FGFA exists is because PAK-FA doesn't meet IAF's requirements so they asked for a different aircraft totally customized for IAF's needs.

 

[GUNS-N- ROSES]

Ourdedicated attack jets (Mig-27 etc) will be retired very soon.

So it is better to convert our Su-30 MKI as our primary strike force once FGFA arrives. For interceptor role, we have LCA & for air superiority, we have Mig-29 SMT, Mirage 2000H upgraded and MRCA(I prefer EF) and FGFA as IAF spearhead.

Mig-27 are being upgraded and will serve in india air force at least till 2020.

 

[GUNS-N- ROSES]

IMHO we should not abandon AMCA. countries are built on indegenous products we cant hope to become strong on foreign products and collaborations. we need AMCA. the experience of LCA has taught us valuable lessons and the mistakes which occured in LCA wont happen now. even if AMCA is short of expectations i will take it. cas aeronautical engineering cant be mastured in 2-3 products. the west and russians have over 100 yrs exp in that field and still they fail sometimes and experience difficulties. so i wont lose heart.

 

[angeldemon_007]

cool down buddy. I don't know why but talking about american planes brings out wrong side of Indo-americans, that's funny.

I am not pro American. Its about the fighter... no culture, no country, only science.

 

[raveolution]

russia has sold SU 30 to china
russia planning to sell PAKFA to china
russia planning to sell brahmos to some countries!

Russia sold the SU-27 and the SU-30 MKK to China. Both aircraft have been designed by and paid for by Russia without Indian contribution.
Russia may sell the Pak-Fa to whomsoever it pleases, although i don't think that it will do so. However it cannot do the same with the FGFA which is being tailor-made for India with joint development costs, without our consent. The Pak-Fa was again paid for and designed by Sukhoi and will be inducted into the Russian Airforce.
Regarding the Brahmos, Russia or India may sell it to any country with mutual consent of both parties and part of the proceeds indeed come back to us.

This is basic information easily available on this forum. Please read up. Thanks