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Islamabad Dharna 2nd November-News, Updates And Discussions

By now you should have known the reason why I don't worship anyone....... because all of you lack the basic decency to address anyone who opposes or doesn't conform to your ways or demands.

What was indecent? Go through your posts and then compare them to my posts. Check the tone. From the beginning you seemed so angry and I was just calling you "dear brother" or "friend".

What made you think that I was lacking "basic decency"?

For the God sake, come out of this myth that Army will do better. No way. This all mess is due to Army in Mush era. Our army is so much busy in tweets and making songs that they even don't know that terrorists breached in from Afghanistan and reached in Quetta after crosing many army check points. Same happened in APS attack. They have only agenda of selling Fertilizer, Cement and plots.

The person in your profile picture is being supported by your Army. Your PM has already decided to hand him over to your enemies.
 
For the God sake, come out of this myth that Army will do better. No way. This all mess is due to Army in Mush era. Our army is so much busy in tweets and making songs that they even don't know that terrorists breached in from Afghanistan and reached in Quetta after crosing many army check points. Same happened in APS attack. They have only agenda of selling Fertilizer, Cement and plots.

It seems you have absolutely no clue what gorilla warfare is. If you expect the Army to do everything and be perfect then they may as well take it all over but they won't. Before the operation was started, look at the bomb and death statistics. Army simply can't stop every suicide bomber, even Army if USA etc can't do that.

Have you even bothered reading the National Action Plan??? what are civilian's responsibilities in that, so you even know???
 
What made you think that I was lacking "basic decency"?

You said this to my genuine demand that nobody should be made to loose anything because of this protest.

When will you guys understand your rights and raise your voice against illegal spending of your taxes collected by NS and his family members?

Do you know me? Or how are you any different then rest of us guys?
 
You said this to my genuine demand that nobody should be made to loose anything because of this protest.



Do you know me? Or how are you any different then rest of us guys?


So me asking you to raise for your rights is indecent behaviour? Good going.

By the way, are you a businessman who is concerned about the losses of other businessmen, and if you are why aren't you bothered about the ruling elite looting your tax money?
 
Kingdom is really scared....

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According to Democracy , a peaceful protest is allowed , I dont get why the govt. is so scared , they've arranged an army of policemen as if a war is going to take place and not a protest.
Because 1 million crowd is expected to reach there. Those security measures for safety of them and buildings including P.M house, supreme court, PTV and many others.
 
So me asking you to raise for your rights is indecent behaviour? Good going.

You assuming about the rest of us and then trying to pretend as if you are not one of us .......... well all your assumptions are indecent. Like the one below

By the way, are you a businessman who is concerned about the losses of other businessmen, and if you are why aren't you bothered about the ruling elite looting your tax money?

So if I care about people loosing their business ............... I must be a businessman myself? Wah kya logic hay. Subhan ALLAH.

Just read this to understand where I stand. I can have a different view than yours but that doesn't mean you can label me anything or assume anything about me.

https://defence.pk/threads/for-pakistanis-only.457910/
 
You know, I have also started thinking on the same lines. The news that I am getting from some sources are although very encouraging but I will only wait till the result of this Dharna. After that I will just leave Pakistan. It's not because I don't have faith on my Army, it's because a big chunk of our population still thinks that Nawaz, Zardari or Altaf are their saviors. Army can't do much without the support of a majority of people which is still not there.

I am a professional accountant and I have worked in the tax in Pakistan in the past. I used to pay so much tax from my salary in 2008 that is still (in 2016 currency) more than the annual tax of 75% of our assembly members, who (and their family members) get all the perks, who get allowances, German cars, protocols etc.

Let me tell you an interesting account. In mid 2000's, Musharraf's government tried to setup a bank for poor people related to agriculture. The purpose was to provide cheap loans that they could use to buy seeds, machinery etc and stand on their own feet rather than asking money from the village elders, chaudhries or waderas. I was a junior member of a big team that was given the task to perform feasibility study for this bank. We hired a social scientist (a PhD) who was given the task to lead a team of surveyors who will collect the information from poor villagers on whether they will get loans from bank and the bank will be able to operate and serve them,

The findings were very astonishing. In interior Sindh and Punjab, poor villagers said that they get the loans on 300% interest. So if a person has got 100,000, he has to return much higher amount in a years time. And if they are not able to give it back, either they would have to give their land or their women in return.

We thought that if a bank is giving them at 5% annual, they will most probably apply loans from the Bank rather than the waderas. But we were amazed to find out that most of the people will still prefer to get loans from waderas because they "respect" him. The waderas on the other hand were very happy with the proposed bank. They wanted to install a middle man who could get loans from Bank and give them to poor villagers.

I think the plan to setup that bank was abolished. This is how most of us are. Democracy in Pakistan can't provide any good until we bring land reforms. The elders are so powerful that they create electables. These electables don't have any mercy for poor people and most of our assembly seats come from these areas where public can't think from their own mind.

But now I am finding out that educated people are also dumb. What can Army or other institutions do without public support that they can't get given the situation in rural areas of Pakistan?

Theres an inherent flaw in this democracy in Pakistan.. Army and other instituitions need to realise this... Most of our people are uneducated, illiterate... They dont have a mind of their own... The example you quoted, of a bank..is a perfect example of this... Army, and other people, who matter, MUST realise this... They cant wash away their responsibility by saying tht..if people dont want change, or if people are happy with zardaris, and altafs and nawaz..what can we do? NO.... U cant do tht... U are at the helm of affairs.. U can manipulate things, to bring a better system... U do know tht people are illiterate.. U cant just leave it on them....We cant wait...tht maybe..in next 10 yrs, people will just grow mature with time, and they will elect better people, amd everything will be fine... No ..it cant happen, due to many reasons.. First this rotten system is not producing good educated, sensible people.. People who a ruling have not even the least interest, in educating pakistanis.. Its in their interest, tht people remain the same and they continue to loot and plunder... So even in next 20 yrs, if this system is not changed, people will continue to elect nawaz, then zardari, then nawaz, and so again... Heck even elections are not fair.. So even if people want change, nawaz, zardari will continue to win through dhandli... And do we have this much time? Tht we can wait for next 10 yrs, tht things will automatically change for the better, in this system?

Its a doomsday scenario... I must repeat..army can not just say..tht what can we do ..if people are not ready to change? No..people are illiterate..unless majority is eduacted....democracy is the worst system... As Allama Iqbal said, ke logon ko gina kartay hain, tola nahi kartay.. Army has the power to manipulate..they have power to bring change through any means...even if they dont want direct action... Army can manipulate things..and bring a better system IF THEY WANT... If they leave everything onpeople...thts means they are not sincere.. Only because, they know..people cant change the system, even if they want, on their own.. We have no power... We have no power to manipulate... What should i do, and my likes do, if we want to bring change? Just go around, and start firing...tht look..i have come here.. I want to change the whole system..and i will kill anyone who comes in my way? Should i go and start firing on national assembly, prime ministers house? Because other than this, this system isnt providing me any opportunity to bring change.. Even elections are rigged..so u cant even bring change through elections...no matter how many times elections take place

Thts the reason, i say...support and willingness of army is a must..because THEY CAN DO it...if they want.. do they want it? Are they sincere with the people of this country? Or they are simply trying to shift the responsibility tht we cant do it people dont want it... What opportunities have been provided to make people educated and bring change, in the first place? I am sorry...army is being insincere to this country...if they conveniently take this excuse..

Is army even true to its words? Or they are only for public consumption and public posturing? How many times, have General Raheel Sharif said, tht peace cant come in this country, unless corruption is eliminated? Didnt Gen Raheel Sharif say..tht army will support everymove tht ensures accountability at all levels? Was it only for public posturing? And u didnt really mean it? And when, because, of ur statements, people start expecting from you...u say we cant do anything...then, why give us hope, in the first place, by such statements? First u say national security breached..and then nothing... Does army take us, for fools too?

You know I am so much desperate...tht hypothetically speaking, if by any chance, i somehow come across, Gen Raheel sharif.. I will go and confront him... Tht back your words with action... Dnt take us for granted, tht first you give us hope, and then conveniently say, i dont have power to do any thing.. Its like what politicians do..make false promises...gen Raheel Sharif made good statements with regard to accountability, but no action to follow then.. I will even beg him, tht please kuch reham karo..is mulk par.........

Will Allah Ask Gen Raheel Sharif, abt different articles in 1973 constituition, tht which articles u protected? Or will Allah ask him, abt his duty to protect Pakistan? Will he not be asked, tht u were in a position of authority to do something..what did u do? I am sorry..but certainly army / Gen Raheel Sharif is not being sincere to Pakistan, if they want to shift the blame to people..

I dont know what to say...
 
Theres an inherent flaw in this democracy in Pakistan.. Army and other instituitions need to realise this... Most of our people are uneducated, illiterate... They dont have a mind of their own... The example you quoted, of a bank..is a perfect example of this... Army, and other people, who matter, MUST realise this... They cant wash away their responsibility by saying tht..if people dont want change, or if people are happy with zardaris, and altafs and nawaz..what can we do? NO.... U cant do tht... U are at the helm of affairs.. U can manipulate things, to bring a better system... U do know tht people are illiterate.. U cant just leave it on them....We cant wait...tht maybe..in next 10 yrs, people will just grow mature with time, and they will elect better people, amd everything will be fine... No ..it cant happen, due to many reasons.. First this rotten system is not producing good educated, sensible people.. People who a ruling have not even the least interest, in educating pakistanis.. Its in their interest, tht people remain the same and they continue to loot and plunder... So even in next 20 yrs, if this system is not changed, people will continue to elect nawaz, then zardari, then nawaz, and so again... Heck even elections are not fair.. So even if people want change, nawaz, zardari will continue to win through dhandli... And do we have this much time? Tht we can wait for next 10 yrs, tht things will automatically change for the better, in this system?

Its a doomsday scenario... I must repeat..army can not just say..tht what can we do ..if people are not ready to change? No..people are illiterate..unless majority is eduacted....democracy is the worst system... As Allama Iqbal said, ke logon ko gina kartay hain, tola nahi kartay.. Army has the power to manipulate..they have power to bring change through any means...even if they dont want direct action... Army can manipulate things..and bring a better system IF THEY WANT... If they leave everything onpeople...thts means they are not sincere.. Only because, they know..people cant change the system, even if they want, on their own.. We have no power... We have no power to manipulate... What should i do, and my likes do, if we want to bring change? Just go around, and start firing...tht look..i have come here.. I want to change the whole system..and i will kill anyone who comes in my way? Should i go and start firing on national assembly, prime ministers house? Because other than this, this system isnt providing me any opportunity to bring change.. Even elections are rigged..so u cant even bring change through elections...no matter how many times elections take place

Thts the reason, i say...support and willingness of army is a must..because THEY CAN DO it...if they want.. do they want it? Are they sincere with the people of this country? Or they are simply trying to shift the responsibility tht we cant do it people dont want it... What opportunities have been provided to make people educated and bring change, in the first place? I am sorry...army is being insincere to this country...if they conveniently take this excuse..

Is army even true to its words? Or they are only for public consumption and public posturing? How many times, have General Raheel Sharif said, tht peace cant come in this country, unless corruption is eliminated? Didnt Gen Raheel Sharif say..tht army will support everymove tht ensures accountability at all levels? Was it only for public posturing? And u didnt really mean it? And when, because, of ur statements, people start expecting from you...u say we cant do anything...then, why give us hope, in the first place, by such statements? First u say national security breached..and then nothing... Does army take us, for fools too?

You know I am so much desperate...tht hypothetically speaking, if by any chance, i somehow come across, Gen Raheel sharif.. I will go and confront him... Tht back your words with action... Dnt take us for granted, tht first you give us hope, and then conveniently say, i dont have power to do any thing.. Its like what politicians do..make false promises...gen Raheel Sharif made good statements with regard to accountability, but no action to follow then.. I will even beg him, tht please kuch reham karo..is mulk par.........

Will Allah Ask Gen Raheel Sharif, abt different articles in 1973 constituition, tht which articles u protected? Or will Allah ask him, abt his duty to protect Pakistan? Will he not be asked, tht u were in a position of authority to do something..what did u do? I am sorry..but certainly army / Gen Raheel Sharif is not being sincere to Pakistan, if they want to shift the blame to people..

I dont know what to say...

Just relax.
Everything will be alright. Things are boiling up for a reason.
Just stay sincere to Islam and Pakistan.
 
Just relax.
Everything will be alright. Things are boiling up for a reason.
Just stay sincere to Islam and Pakistan.

Sir ji... Bhtt relax kar liya... Relax kar kar ke tu ye time aagaya hai

Doesnt it feel like dejavu all over again? Isnt it exactly a repeat of what happened in 2014? Till last time..i was still hopeful but then we know how it ended? Tht is..nothing happened... Nothing will happen again... Its hurting..even more because...until now...it was only corruption tht had become the norm.. Now u can get away with treason too, in this country, and we are just supposed to accept things, the way they are... Otherwise jamhoorityat ko khatra hai and people can become political martyrs...

In this system, when SC acquits two brothers, after many years..but they have already been executed two yrs ago....this is the system we live in...

But no..teams shouldnt celebrate by push ups..because jamhooryat ko khatra hai

No one will be punished for calling back those police cadets even after their training finished ..they were to be sent for dharna..and hence called back UN ARMED..and 60 ppl got martyred...but no...people responsible cant be punished..because jamhooryat ko khatra hai

You can get away with murdering ppl in model town..but they cant be punished..because punishing them will make them political martyrs...

So nothing happened in 2014 dharna..nothing will happen again...

I so want myself to be proven wrong and will happily accept tht...i was wrong......... But where do i bring hope from?
 
How can Imran Khan become the PM of Pakistan by just removing Noora?. Which Parliment you are talking about? where you see PPP, PMLN, ANP, MQM, JUIF do Noora Kushti hurling tantrums at each other and blackmail each other on their corruption and stay mum because they know about each others corruption very well. Which NAB? who requests Corrupt for plea bargains & it's Chief's are appointed on bases of his affiliation with the ruling party? Which Supreme court? which is more concerned about hanging Shalwar's on the Supreme courts walls rather then corruption and real problem of this nation, which do not bring reforms to make swift justice available to common people. What an Idiot You are!

You are the real idiot here if you think this dharna has anything to with justice.

Corruption: All the lotas IK has gathered around him are corrupt to the core.
Election issues: PTI faced massive rigging in its internal elections. Justice Wajihudin mentioned it in his report and had to resign because IK and others didn't want to take action.
Violence: IK has been a supporter of Taliban. Now his Laal Masjid buddies are joining in too.

How about PTI fix these issues first? Nobody wants to have Nawaz as their PM. Nobody wants corruption. But this is no way to achieve anything positive. What IK is doing is for pure greed. He is just another politician.

People in the twin cities will directly pay its price. And Pakistanis in general will pay the price with reduced investor confidence. That's why I hate this dharna. Now keep trying to spin it as if I or people like me are opposing this dharna because we support PMLN.
 

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