Is the JF-17 Really a Tough Sell for China and Pakistan?

[Khalid Newazi]

The Indians influence is to be vanished soon ....but I do agree to the part where some Afghani Pilot could deflect with a Thunder all the way to Farkhor AFB ....Block-1 was the realization of a dream project I must say ....Block-2 shall have some real customers ....!

Being a fighter pilot isn't easy, it takes a lot of training to be one. Don't think Afghanistan will have any real Air Force within the next few years.

Also we have yet to see the Taliban summer offensive after the NATO withdrawal.

 

[Sage]

Pakistan is itself short of at least 30 JF-17's , we must have at least 70-80 birds till now ... and block 2 is still in the cover of Mysteries , but we know it will have a Refueling system , and increase tons of weapon package ...
i dont think any Arab country will think about JFs because they got what world wants , Cash they can buy any bird they want ... look at the RSAF , they got so many birds but all are exported but they didnt got any project to build their own ... aka foreign dependence ..
its ok if we dont get any buyers , but this plane must satisfy the needs of PAF .. and with time it will mature anyway , so many planes are flying today which are not battle proven ... as Pakistan economy improves , we can put more cash in R&D in this project , buy French EW suites for thunder , and it will come close or ever par with F-16' blk 52's ... but the thing is we need to have it in numbers ,since 2007 , we only made 50 blk 1 Jf-17s which is very slow production ..

Arabs will definitely buy Thunder .....the time they were buying Super Mashaks, that time they also had the money to buy anything from the rest of the world ...Good diplomacy is all Thunder would need ...Pakistan has offered almost every military skills to its arab allies ....this might become one ground for exporting Thunder to some of them ...its Block-2 variant of course ...again I am stressing its carrier killing ability as well ...and you are right ...It can come par with Block-52 and lesser in price and with no strings attached as well !

 

[Ind4Ever]

Pakistan is itself short of at least 30 JF-17's , we must have at least 70-80 birds till now ... and block 2 is still in the cover of Mysteries , but we know it will have a Refueling system , and increase tons of weapon package ...
i dont think any Arab country will think about JFs because they got what world wants , Cash they can buy any bird they want ... look at the RSAF , they got so many birds but all are exported but they didnt got any project to build their own ... aka foreign dependence ..
its ok if we dont get any buyers , but this plane must satisfy the needs of PAF .. and with time it will mature anyway , so many planes are flying today which are not battle proven ... as Pakistan economy improves , we can put more cash in R&D in this project , buy French EW suites for thunder , and it will come close or ever par with F-16' blk 52's ... but the thing is we need to have it in numbers ,since 2007 , we only made 50 blk 1 Jf-17s which is very slow production ..

Buying french ew ll botch up the price tag and I don't think french will RIP their stuff to Chinese . Until it's for lots of money

 

[Sage]

Being a fighter pilot isn't easy, it takes a lot of training to be one. Don't think Afghanistan will have any real Air Force within the next few years.

Also we have yet to see the Taliban summer offensive after the NATO withdrawal.

Things may get calm and fine if Ghani continues cooperation with Pak

Buying french ew ll botch up the price tag and I don't think french will RIP their stuff to Chinese . Until it's for lots of money

Just a matter of some time ...I bet Chinese will come up something better to offer to the JF-17 Block-2 ...you can see how fast they are going given their most recent accomplishments in aviation industries !

 

[Paksanity]

Last we heard, it was 50 birds till date and 2 squads. the 3rd squad was still under consideration. Are you sure of this 70-80 number. That is enough to have 4 squadrons of JF 17 and not 2

Third squadron was raised today.

 

[rockstar08]

Arabs will definitely buy Thunder .....the time they were buying Super Mashaks, that time they also had the money to buy anything from the rest of the world ...Good diplomacy is all Thunder would need ...Pakistan has offered almost every military skills to its arab allies ....this might become one ground for exporting Thunder to some of them ...its Block-2 variant of course ...again I am stressing its carrier killing ability as well ...and you are right ...It can come par with Block-52 and lesser in price and with no strings attached as well !

Arabs dont give a shit about Pakistan and brotherhood ..its only one way love which we show ... sorry to burst your bubble , but we are hearing this rumors since years now that KSA is buying ... if they are so brotherly towards us , and if they want Jf's they put some millions of $$ into this project , which is for their own good , if they want it ... but we see nothing so far and no in near future .. so stop living in a delusion ..

Buying french ew ll botch up the price tag and I don't think french will RIP their stuff to Chinese . Until it's for lots of money

Dude i know French EW will increase the Price tag , but it will also increase the performance .. just have a look at the weapon package of JF-17 ... it will mature over the time .. and as we put some more money in the project it will improve .. once Chinese Engine is ready , we can easily buy them in bulk and even export it without any much issues ... as far as China is concern , they are far more superior to Indians ..in every aspect , they are building Subs , A/C , 5th gen Planes , ICBM's , CMs , and you name it ... you are yet to make CM ... and 4th gen Plane ...

 

[Khalid Newazi]

Things may get calm and fine if Ghani continues cooperation with Pak

Don't think Pakistan would want to fight the Afghan Taliban.

 

[Folkindia]

Pakistan should explicitly focus on growth, growth and more growth.

Don't think Pakistan would want to fight the Afghan Taliban.

 

[Khalid Newazi]

Pakistan should explicitly focus on growth, growth and more growth.

Almost every country plays dirty wars, India, US, Pakistan, Iran, Saudi Arabia, Russia, Britain, China, etc. Some just more than others. Also it's about not only strengthening your country but also weakening your rivals.

NOTE: I am not saying I am a supporter of such activities (I am not) but rather stating facts.

 

[Ind4Ever]

Arabs dont give a shit about Pakistan and brotherhood ..its only one way love which we show ... sorry to burst your bubble , but we are hearing this rumors since years now that KSA is buying ... if they are so brotherly towards us , and if they want Jf's they put some millions of $$ into this project , which is for their own good , if they want it ... but we see nothing so far and no in near future .. so stop living in a delusion ..



Dude i know French EW will increase the Price tag , but it will also increase the performance .. just have a look at the weapon package of JF-17 ... it will mature over the time .. and as we put some more money in the project it will improve .. once Chinese Engine is ready , we can easily buy them in bulk and even export it without any much issues ... as far as China is concern , they are far more superior to Indians ..in every aspect , they are building Subs , A/C , 5th gen Planes , ICBM's , CMs , and you name it ... you are yet to make CM ... and 4th gen Plane ...

Bhai the main purpose of having JF17 for pakistan is its more cost effectiveness . Of course French EW suites will be a performance booster but if China can pride huge amounts of soft loans to Pakistan then they might had provided pak with J10B or j11 . Which had better EW suit and better performance. The problem is the fund. Block -2 you are talking about won't be having all around upgrade due to it frame (Skelton) External refuelling and some upgrades over radar , avionics. This itself will increase the price unless china orders atleast some Jf17 . Which won't happen. Or export orders. This is why both China and Pakistan are mulling to sell and create another supply line . To reduce the cost. China can't be spending for ever for pakistan. Soft loans are also loans provided by Chinese Bank and their people but anyway they won't get it for atleast some time now . So I agree by adding new generation ew will improve but increase the price aswell . So slow approach is been taken by Chinese on JF -17 programme. They can easily build Block 2 or block 3 in just a easy task for their industries .... but why is so much delay ?

 

[rockstar08]

Bhai the main purpose of having JF17 for pakistan is its more cost effectiveness . Of course French EW suites will be a performance booster but if China can pride huge amounts of soft loans to Pakistan then they might had provided pak with J10B or j11 . Which had better EW suit and better performance. The problem is the fund. Block -2 you are talking about won't be having all around upgrade due to it frame (Skelton) External refuelling and some upgrades over radar , avionics. This itself will increase the price unless china orders atleast some Jf17 . Which won't happen. Or export orders. This is why both China and Pakistan are mulling to sell and create another supply line . To reduce the cost. China can't be spending for ever for pakistan. Soft loans are also loans provided by Chinese Bank and their people but anyway they won't get it for atleast some time now . So I agree by adding new generation ew will improve but increase the price aswell . So slow approach is been taken by Chinese on JF -17 programme. They can easily build Block 2 or block 3 in just a easy task for their industries .... but why is so much delay ?

you dont understand my point don't you ? rafale is expensive but because of its performance you are ready to buy it ... for small countries , JF is a good Plane , not as expensive as other in same class aka Gripen .. but but as i said look at the weapon package provided by JF , and EW suites will not make the price double or three times i guess ... it will still remain cheap, and once the Engine issue is solved , it will be more cost effective , i dont know why we produce slow but maybe because of funds , the Zardari harami eat everything

 

[Ind4Ever]

you dont understand my point don't you ? rafale is expensive but because of its performance you are ready to buy it ... for small countries , JF is a good Plane , not as expensive as other in same class aka Gripen .. but but as i said look at the weapon package provided by JF , and EW suites will not make the price double or three times i guess ... it will still remain cheap, and once the Engine issue is solved , it will be more cost effective , i dont know why we produce slow but maybe because of funds , the Zardari harami eat everything

Hare Bhai Jaan . JF -17 is a good fighter for what it is ment for. Let's be real it's light weight fighter jet with multi role capabilities. Let's not fool ourself by giving it a status of Rafale or f22 . As I said EW suite upgrade will be good. And don't you think why china dint had their latest advanced EW suit already they posses ? Chinese are very advanced in 4 gen . Why there was no MK 2 capabilities in the first time itself ? Because of cost . When u upgrade ur EW suite you must also upgrade avionics and make many other changes to get the results for which u have upgraded .

MK2 won't be 40 million but definitely not 20 mil also . It will be above. Don't forget amount of modernisation means more carbon material. Am also stating the same as u mentioned .

 

[rockstar08]

Hare Bhai Jaan . JF -17 is a good fighter for what it is ment for. Let's be real it's light weight fighter jet with multi role capabilities. Let's not fool ourself by giving it a status of Rafale or f22 . As I said EW suite upgrade will be good. And don't you think why china dint had their latest advanced EW suit already they posses ? Chinese are very advanced in 4 gen . Why there was no MK 2 capabilities in the first time itself ? Because of cost . When u upgrade ur EW suite you must also upgrade avionics and make many other changes to get the results for which u have upgraded .

MK2 won't be 40 million but definitely not 20 mil also . It will be above. Don't forget amount of modernisation means more carbon material. Am also stating the same as u mentioned .

no one is comparing thunder with Rafale i just give an example ... when you put more money into a plane , it increase the performance .. and right now we have short budget that is why , we cant afford to buy even Chinese EW suites .. its simple ....

 

[Ind4Ever]

i dont know why we produce slow but maybe because of funds , the Zardari harami eat everything

True that. Chinese are very advanced . What ever they did. Copy hack steal. But they reached a stage where they can produce fighter jets like J10 B j20 j11 j31 and so on. In very short time. Even Russians surprised by it. So don't you think JF -17 block 2 /3 as just like piece of cake ? No reason for the delay . Except one. Which is money. But you can't blame them. They are doing best to provide pakistan with what ever they could. And ur economy also not good as of now. Upgrades means more money needed to be spent. JF17 might be cheaper but still 20 mill per plan is a huge amount . For pakistan china and india

no one is comparing thunder with Rafale i just give an example ... when you put more money into a plane , it increase the performance .. and right now we have short budget that is why , we cant afford to buy even Chinese EW suites .. its simple ....

I know . But not to worry. You already got some 50 Jf17 as of now. Thank Chinese . They will surely do something to arm pakistan . Because they love my country very much

 

[rockstar08]

True that. Chinese are very advanced . What ever they did. Copy hack steal. But they reached a stage where they can produce fighter jets like J10 B j20 j11 j31 and so on. In very short time. Even Russians surprised by it. So don't you think JF -17 block 2 /3 as just like piece of cake ? No reason for the delay . Except one. Which is money. But you can't blame them. They are doing best to provide pakistan with what ever they could. And ur economy also not good as of now. Upgrades means more money needed to be spent. JF17 might be cheaper but still 20 mill per plan is a huge amount . For pakistan china and india


I know . But not to worry. You already got some 50 Jf17 as of now. Thank Chinese . They will surely do something to arm pakistan . Because they love my country very much

you cant just say that Chinese did everything , its a joint venture .. PAC has done a lot for thunders , and we will soon take care of more parts of JF .. and yeah China is always there to help us , but only if we can pay