Is Punjabi a mere dialect of Hindi?

[Indus Pakistan]

Incredibly ignorant comment, if you're saying this, then you probably don't know Punjabi, at least Punjabi beyond the common speech of city folk.

Was that directed at me ? If so care to elaborate?

 

[Jungibaaz]

Was that directed at me ? If so care to elaborate?

No, it was for OP.

 

[punit]

In 1950s when states were reorganised on linguistic lines,Hindus of Punjab claimed their mother tongue was Hindi saying Punjabi is nothing but a dialect of Hindi with little to no literary history.if I remember right,even Nehru dismissed Punjabi as a dialect of Hindi..I too agree with it(inspire of my zero knowledge of Punjabi) because we can see how pakistanis and indian Punjabi's can so effortlessly speak Urdu or Hindi.punjabis please answer without any language bias.

Punjabi is not a dialect of Hindi but shares same parent with Hindi.
Shauraseni Prakrit is the mother of Punjabi and Western Hindi (khadi boli,hariyanavi etc).

 

[Indus Pakistan]

Punjabi is not a dialect of Hindi but shares same parent with Hindi.
Shauraseni Prakrit is the mother of Punjabi and Western Hindi (khadi boli,hariyanavi etc).

What is Hariyanavi when Haryana was only carved up recently? Also what is this 'Prakrit' all about. I notice it comes up with frightening regularity in Wiki?

Is this some attempt to make uniformity out of something that is not in fact uniform? In other words create homogenous entity when the real situation on the ground was/is heterogenous by using the word unneccassrily using the word 'Prakrit'?

 

[scionoftheindus]

What is Hariyanavi when Haryana was only carved up recently? Also what is this 'Prakrit' all about. I notice it comes up with frightening regularity in Wiki?

Is this some attempt to make uniformity out of something that is not in fact uniform? In other words create homogenous entity when the real situation on the ground was/is heterogenous by using the word unneccassrily using the word 'Prakrit'?

It is not about wiki,it is how linguists categorised Indian languages..every language has evolved..hasn't it?so there might be some language when all north Indians were residing in a much smaller area or when they weren't spread out...that language was Sanskrit..Sanskrit branched out into various dialects called prakrits (the word prakriti means nature) which in turn evolved into different north Indian languages

 

[Shamain]

Yes.

Actually ppl who confuse urdu with punjabi, they dont know that actually punjabi used 2 be quite difficult to be understood by an urdu speaker and was much different from the punjabi spoken now and hence more different from urdu. Atleast this is something ihave heard. In a way punjabi has evolved and become more urdunized at the moment,just as urdu is absorbing english words.

But current day punjabi is not what real punjabi was tho still stands apart from urdu and if u go to the rural areas it will be so hard and difficult. So whn u will be an ignorant person u will make a statement like the OP.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

It is not about wiki,it is how linguists categorised Indian languages..every language has evolved..hasn't it?so there might be some language when all north Indians were residing in a much smaller area or when they weren't spread out...that language was Sanskrit..Sanskrit branched out into various dialects called prakrits (the word prakriti means nature) which in turn evolved into different north Indian languages

In the past there was more divergence, more heterogenity then now simply because of limitation of travel. 200 miles away would be like 2,000 miles away.

So Prakrit means in this context 'dialect'? If so why not use the word dialect? This goes to my earlier suspicion that this was attempt at creating homogenity when there was'nt any.

It is like this. a, b, c, d, e, f, languages. However if I want to create uniformity in what appears as a heterogenous group if I call them Prakrit a, Prakrit b, Prakrit c, I am in effect imposing on them uniformiy and making them appear homogenous.

 

[scionoftheindus]

@Atanz So how we differentiate between language and dialect? My take on this is, a language is always associated with a distinct culture whereas dialects lack this association.

No...a language may be richer in culture than a dialect..take for example a language called lambada by some tribes of Rajasthan..it is so close to Hindi yet they have distinct culture and songs and folklore..same is the case with marvadi...inspite of having their unique culture and folklore they are considered dialects of Hindi..I think language has rich past of literature whereas dialect a bit less.

 

[Shamain]

What is Hariyanavi when Haryana was only carved up recently? Also what is this 'Prakrit' all about. I notice it comes up with frightening regularity in Wiki?

Is this some attempt to make uniformity out of something that is not in fact uniform? In other words create homogenous entity when the real situation on the ground was/is heterogenous by using the word unneccassrily using the word 'Prakrit'?

Ya in a way haryanvi is nothing but another dialect of punjabi.

This op is btw a troll.he often creates troll threads. Once he made one making fun of pakistanis accent,it was the stupidest thread u cud believe that wud have ever existed.and mods had deleted it.
According to the guy we pakistanis call driver, dairiver, bread as baread etc etc nonsense.

 

[scionoftheindus]

In the past there was more divergence, more heterogenity then now simply because of limitation of travel. 200 miles away would be like 2,000 miles away.

So Prakrit means in this context 'dialect'? If so why not use the word dialect? This goes to my earlier suspicion that this was attempt at creating homogenity when there was'nt any.

It is like this. a, b, c, d, e, f, languages. However if I want to create uniformity in what appears as a homogenous group if I call them Prakrit a, Prakrit b, Prakrit c, I am in effect imposing on them uniformiy and making them appear homogenous.

But people now don't prefer to call their languages with names like prakrit a, prakrit b etc..the languages from which they evolved are dead..people now want their own identity... In fact Indians never thought to bring such homogeneity.. because India is a mini continent..everyone is proud of their language and culture..if bringing uniformity is as simple as you said then all the north Indian languages were branded as Hindi just like how totally mutually unintelligible languages are branded as Arabic or mandarin after all most north Indian languages are not as mutually unintelligible as those languages.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

Ya in a way haryanvi is nothing but another dialect of punjabi.

This op is btw a troll.he often creates troll threads. Once he made one making fun of pakistanis accent,it was the stupidest thread u cud believe that wud have ever existed.and mods had deleted it.
According to the guy we pakistanis call driver, dairiver, bread as baread etc etc nonsense.

Surprising ... When it comes to accents ( or for that matter the head wobbling ) I think the Indian's take the gold medal.

That cat avatar of yours gives me the creaps .......

 

[Kabira]

Punjabi is unique, only surviving tonal language among indo-europeans. Punjabi is mother of indo-aryan languages in subcontinent.

 

[scionoftheindus]

Ya in a way haryanvi is nothing but another dialect of punjabi.

This op is btw a troll.he often creates troll threads. Once he made one making fun of pakistanis accent,it was the stupidest thread u cud believe that wud have ever existed.and mods had deleted it.
According to the guy we pakistanis call driver, dairiver, bread as baread etc etc nonsense.

Hahaha..it sounded troll but a person who is interested in linguistics could learn something from that..sad that mods deleted it..I gave phonological reasons behind you people to have difficulty in pronouncing some words.

 

[Shamain]

When it comes to accents ( or for that matter the head wobbling ) I think the Indian's real take the gold medal.

That cat avatar of yours gives me the creaps .......

Hahahhaha ya true abt accents true, well yet he was making fun of us.

And avatar lolzzzz, oh magar abhi tau change kiya tha......iwant 2 keep it for sometime.

 

[Kabira]

Hahaha..it sounded troll but a person who is interested in linguistics could learn something from that..sad that mods deleted it..I gave phonological reasons behind you people to have difficulty in pronouncing some words.

There was no evidence, just watch Modi speak hindi and see how he bucther pure words. Indians can't pronounce sh/s, z/j, ph/p etc properly to save their lives. Thats why Indian english accent is most horrible accent.