Is orange line train part of CPEC or its Punjab own project ?

[Pandora]

So if it's part of CPEC why SS signed? wasn't it part of CPEC agreement between Pakistan and China? BTW plz tell us wtf has this service to do with economic corridor?

And why not cm of other provinces signed contract for their area.

So it will finish in October 2017. Which means another public stunt for 2018 election.

Bhae KPK should also perform public stunts otherwise next time phir dhandli dhandli kartay raho gay. Ordinary people like gimmicks. Also they are fast tracking coal based project so they will have a lot to show but this will be at the front of all their campaign posters. Despite what you think ordinary people will vote like crazy.

Khatak has no brains otherwise he could have flooded KPK with small hydro and wind based energy projects. I still dont understand why PTI choose this moron as PM who has no qualification whatso ever. He is busy creating his own dynasty in KPK. He flooded PTI local governments with his faimly members. Khatak is the worst thing that happend to PTI. He has no vision whatso ever and even if you hand him a vision he is too dumb to even do anything about it.

 

[Valkyrie]

Pakistan is a federation. Each federating unit (province) has its own government and can sign its own agreements, to the extent allowed by the federal government (18th amendment was the latest rule in the book)

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ALL CMs (or their representatives) were given opportunity to go to China and if they could convince some Chinese investor to invest in their province, Pakistan and Chinese government would help them sign agreements.

These are in ADDITION to Federal Government's own initiative for projects anywhere in the country. Federal Government's own plans are rather limited, to specific corridor projects. Provincials projects are a "side benefit" projects, that are not part of the "corridor" *per se* but more of "making hay while the sun shines".

Look at the Federal level even, all those power plants all over the country and what not, that doesn't have anything to do with the "corridor". Corridor is only the three routes, fibre, rail, pipelines, Gwadar Airport and Seaport. But since China is investing, federal government said, why not invest here too? Provincial governments offered opportunities too, in a similar vein.

So there are CPEC agreements both at Federal level (which Ahsan Iqbal deals with, as federal minister) and at provincial levels (which is not his headache, the province signed it can manage it, he is not their provincial minister)

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Like it or not, SS did his homework, and got the most projects. So he convinced the most investors. He managed to convince them for Metro Train for example. Punjab is a very good investment opportunity, because SS has invested in Infrastructure, and he personally gives danda to bureaucracy, so investors feel more confident.

CM Sindh also went, but he is an idiot. He barely managed to sell any opportunities. I think he managed to get some some wind-farm projects? Let me check, I forget the specifics.

CM Baluchistan also went. I don't think he managed to sell any opportunities on his own, mostly due to security and weak economic situations, so I think most projects there are Federal government's own initiatives.

CM KPK... he was dancing in Dharna at that time. He was specifically asked but he refused to go. He didn't do ANYTHING. Maybe because he thought he would topple PMLN government and then a federal PTI government will do it.

Now he complains.

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I have been following CPEC for a long time, (come join us on SSC) it's not a big conspiracy.

Nicely put. Your post needs to be read by everyone here.
On a side note, are you the same ryzvonusef from r/pakistan ?

 

[ryzvonusef]

Nicely put. Your post needs to be read by everyone here.
On a side note, are you the same ryzvonusef from r/pakistan ?

Yes, anywhere you see ryzvonusef, 90% chance it's me, on some websites some one else took the username but on most places this is the username I use.

 

[Muhammad Omar]

no wonder Bangladesh wanted to leave u guys...

Is that the same Reason Punjab and South India along with Eastern India wants to leave India Khalistan nagaland Etc etc

 

[xyxmt]

Would PTI leadership instead of comparing PMLN statements and start doing some work in KPK, is this how they are going to get votes in next elections...Look two different statements from PMLN thats why vote for us, because we say the same thing of "talk to TTP" even after 4 years

 

[Valkyrie]

Yes, anywhere you see ryzvonusef, 90% chance it's me, on some websites some one else took the username but on most places this is the username I use.

Behtreen!
I have been lurking on reddit for a while now (could never gather enough motivation to sign up), following r/pakistan and your posts there. They're always a pleasure to read.
Keep up the good work buddy!

 

[libertycall]

It's a part of CPEC project but the agreement was signed between Punjab Gov and Chinese Bank/Gov....

I'm puzzled that a provincial government is signing deals with a foreign state. Is that normal for Pakistan?

 

[Muhammad Omar]

I'm puzzled that a provincial government is signing deals with a foreign state. Is that normal for Pakistan?

yes after 18th Amendment

 

[ryzvonusef]

I'm puzzled that a provincial government is signing deals with a foreign state. Is that normal for Pakistan?

Why not? We have a federated system of government, not unitary system.

In a federation, the federating units have some (limited) rights to make their own decisions. It's normal in a federation. You live in the US, (acc to your flair) American States and Canadian Provinces make decision on their own all the time. Infact American states are some of the most independent federating units anywhere.

Our provinces are federation units too. They have their own elected governments, their own banks, own taxes etc.

So yes, Provincial government CAN deal with others, as long as it is within the circle of defined rules.
The recent 18th Amendment was the latest expansion of those rules, giving them even greater autonomy.

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But regardless, these agreements happened WITH the blessing of the federal government, it's not like SS sneaked out and signed a contract surreptitiously. Also, the agreement was not with the chinese government, but with chinese banks/investors. So the question doesn't even arise in this particular case. Pakistan and Chinese governments agreed to help develop the projects, this is why the CMs were invited in the first place.

 

[libertycall]

Why not? We have a federated system of government, not unitary system.

In a federation, the federating units have some (limited) rights to make their own decisions. It's normal in a federation. You live in the US, (acc to your flair) American States and Canadian Provinces make decision on their own all the time. Infact American states are some of the most independent federating units anywhere.

Our provinces are federation units too. They have their own elected governments, their own banks, own taxes etc.

So yes, Provincial government CAN deal with others, as long as it is within the circle of defined rules.
The recent 18th Amendment was the latest expansion of those rules, giving them even greater autonomy.

----

But regardless, these agreements happened WITH the blessing of the federal government, it's not like SS sneaked out and signed a contract surreptitiously. Also, the agreement was not with the chinese government, but with chinese banks/investors. So the question doesn't even arise in this particular case. Pakistan and Chinese governments agreed to help develop the projects, this is why the CMs were invited in the first place.

United States Constitution, Art. I, Sec. 10, provides in Clause 1: "No state shall enter into any treaty, alliance or confederation. . . ." Clause 3 provides: "No state shall, without the consent of Congress.... enter into any agreement or compact with another state or with a foreign power .... "

What is the 'circle of defined rules' please? Have you studied Chinese history, and do you understand how the Chinese interpret the granting to them of such rights by a foreign state?

I'm not sure if you understand this point but banks in China are controlled by the Chinese government. They were created with a fictional fig-leaf of independence, please see 'The Party: the secret world of China's communist rulers' by Richard McGregor, and in particular the section regarding John Thornton, the former president of Goldman Sachs.

 

[I FLY HIGH]

So if it's part of CPEC why SS signed? wasn't it part of CPEC agreement between Pakistan and China? BTW plz tell us wtf has this service to do with economic corridor?

And why not cm of other provinces signed contract for their area.

So it will finish in October 2017. Which means another public stunt for 2018 election.

Because other CM was smoking and dancing on container expecting a finger from Umpire .

 

[Muhammad Omar]

nope, we don't bark against each other in front of whole online world.

Did online barking makes difference?? they still wants to be separate from India

but they sure post anti India videos and Burning Indian flags etc etc on Social media Facebook Youtube etc etc

Because other CM was smoking and dancing on container expecting a finger from Umpire .

And Umpire Showed Mid Finger

 

[ryzvonusef]

United States Constitution, Art. I, Sec. 10, provides in Clause 1: "No state shall enter into any treaty, alliance or confederation. . . ." Clause 3 provides: "No state shall, without the consent of Congress.... enter into any agreement or compact with another state or with a foreign power .... "

What is the 'circle of defined rules' please? Have you studied Chinese history, and do you understand how the Chinese interpret the granting to them of such rights by a foreign state?

I'm not sure if you understand this point but banks in China are controlled by the Chinese government. They were created with a fictional fig-leaf of independence, please see 'The Party: the secret world of China's communist rulers' by Richard McGregor, and in particular the section regarding John Thornton, the former president of Goldman Sachs.

-_-'

Yes yes, Chinese Bank are the next coming of Satan.

Also, as I said, in that SAME post, the discussion happened WITH the blessing of the Federal government. Not sure what the issue is.

 

[libertycall]

-_-'

Yes yes, Chinese Bank are the next coming of Satan.

Also, as I said, in that SAME post, the discussion happened WITH the blessing of the Federal government. Not sure what the issue is.

The federal government authorized a provincial government to sign agreements of this complexity and having such significant implications for the future defense of the state? Can you please provide proof? I don't mean just a statement by the Sharif family or their relatives.

Also, why the sarcasm regarding Chinese banks? I provided you with a source for my comments. Do you have any evidence to the contrary? Because Thornton was given the responsibility by the Chinese state for taking their state companies to the international stock market.

 

[ryzvonusef]

The federal government authorized a provincial government to sign agreements of this complexity and having such significant implications for the future defense of the state? Can you please provide proof? I don't mean just a statement by the Sharif family or their relatives.

Also, why the sarcasm regarding Chinese banks? I provided you with a source for my comments. Do you have any evidence to the contrary? Because Thornton was given the responsibility by the Chinese state for taking their state companies to the international stock market.

What? "Future defence of state"? Since when was the Metro a risk to the defence of the state? What tangent are you taking this? It's a friggin' metro, not a bomb.

Also, Have you missed the first page, where all the CMs are travelling with the federal delegation to sign agreements? Google their signing photos if you like. But here is a quick link:

Metro train project: Govt, Chinese bank ink Rs162b loan agreement - The Express Tribune

The person signing it is a Provincial Minister of Punjab. Note all the Federal Government Minsters etc in the signing ceremony.

This discussion has gone way beyond crazy.