Is India one people?

[Deltadart]

You may be right. We Indians have different ethnicities, language, customs, religions - but we have a common idea. We have a shared history.
We believe in 'Unity in Diversity'.

It is difficult for non-Indians to grasp this concept. It is natural for Indians since this has been ingrained in us since childhood.

Yes just ask indian muslims.....it is ingrained in them through the other end with full force

 

[Maira La]

India is a civilization,that is the basis of the indian nation state not any racial or people group.Its indian civ areas plus few tribal groups.
Pakistanis may have some genetic and linguistic similarities with western indians in particular but they are a seperate civilization -the islamic one.Thats why there was partition and although violence should have been avoided it was for the better.You got your pure land,we got our indic empire.

There are only 3 true civilizations in the world: West, Islamic and China. Everything else is a copy of these + some local voodoo elements.

India is basically Islamic civ layer + Western civ layer (strongest element) + local hindu voodoo rituals (including hygiene issues).

If you look at your government bureaucracy documents, you will find 2 layers of admin system, an older one from Muslim era and a newer one by British that has mostly replaced the Muslim era systems, however some words and terminologies from Muslim era remains.

I find Indians use the word "civilization" too casually. If you were indeed a separate civilization, you would find Western world alien and inadaptable, which you don't. Muslims and West find it very difficult to adapt at each others countries, despite so many Muslims living in Europe, and both Muslims and Westerners have very hard time understanding Chinese people or assimilating to it. Indians can easily settle anywhere, though the host may have hygiene objections. That's because you don't have rules or systems of your own.

 

[JackFell]

Pakistanis Muslims are Whites/Aryans.

Bangladesh Muslims are Blacks/Dravidians.

Indian Hindus are a mixed breed of both Whites/Aryans and Blacks/Dravidians.


Why should Muslims of India unite with non-Muslims of India? We are white/Aryans and have nothing to do with your genes or history.


Our identity will always be Muslims and Muslims only. We do not believe in fake nation states like India.

This has to be a troll post. The Kalash people of Pakistan are the only group that can be regarded as White/Aryan, the rest are a mix of Steppe, Iranic and ASI.

As for OP, if you have read David Reich's book, you will know that the average distance between two people of different "jatis" in India living side to side can sometimes be 3 times more than the distance between a Swede and an Italian (Northern and Southern European)

Pakistan is a hybrid nation composed of Indo-Aryans like Punjabis and Sindhis and Turko-Iranians like Pashtun and Baloch.

Only Bangladesh is a real nation state in the true sense of the word, India and Pakistan are both pseudo-nations which is why both of them are wracked by separatist insurgencies.

 

[JackFell]

Stop calling us white. We have nothing to do with degenerate Europeans.

Except when you migrate to their countries...

 

[masterchief_mirza]

That was a nice rambling with no substance. Mirza it's embarrassing when you call your ancestors cucks, but hey, I'm not here to contest that. Even the Arabs are proud of their pagan ancestors, and they are sure what their identity is.

I said a very simple fact, religions like Hinduism, Sikhism, Buddhism, and Jainism originated in India. And religions like Christianity, Judaism, Zoroastrianism, Islam came from outside the subcontinent which is part of history. I'm not here to compare Islam and Mughals to whoever there is. The merits and demerits of Mughals is a topic for an entirely different discussion that I am open to, get to the relevant thread. And Islam or Gazwa e Hind is a topic has nothing to do with topic at hand, such discussion, especially in PDF, is pointless. Get to a Neutral venue and I will deal with those there.

Again with the disjointed substance-less multifaceted bullshtt?

1. Being a "cuck" means taking pride in being enslaved instead of empowering oneself with something better that happens to come along. The problem with brahminist defenders is that they are proud of a substandard foreign system (more on why it's foreign later) while violently rejecting a more egalitarian foreign system because of the mental abyss within which they reside. The Arab comparison is apt. They do very much recognise their pagan roots and have sensibly washed their hands clean of human sacrificing, cannibalism, and other bizarre ritualism because something better came along. They immediately realised that such nonsense will limit their progress against regional competition (Christians). The Aztecs are an example of such cultist slave-generating practices that could not stand up to foreign pressure from those of advanced thought. Now the brahminist post-Vedic cult is an interesting case - this persisted because of the inherent mercy of monotheistic faiths (Islam and Christianity) and because those groups were too busy rivalling one another at critical junctures. The slave network has persisted and flourished to this day, with any cosmetic mitigating efforts having minimal impact in India itself or in the wider Indian psyche.

2. There are TWO ways in which stating dharmic faiths originated "in India" are factually incorrect AND misleading.

Firstly, the SECULAR REPUBLIC OF INDIA DOES NOT EQUATE TO ANCIENT "INDIA". You yourself know this when you subtly insert "subcontinent" later in your comment. You are deliberately and malevolently aligning all regions of "ancient India" with your nation state. This is precisely the problem we have with you lot naming your country after a historical geographic region cooked up in Greek and Persian texts. You have appropriated other people's history. You've done "a Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia" but moreover, you've not only deceived others, you've fallen for your own propaganda. You have brainwashed yourself into thinking Delhi holds some ancient historical sway over land in Pakistan. The origins of dharma are far more centred around NON-SECULAR REPUBLICAN lands than the lands of your nation state. Buddhism and Hinduism patently originated west of your country and inside Pakistan. You and other bhakts are aware of this discrepancy in the hindutva narrative, hence insert "subcontinent" in place of "India" hoping nobody else notices.

Secondly, even if, by some twisted logic, the modern entity of "India" could lay claim to the IVC and Gandhara, the people who inhabited and resided within the IVC were genetically substantively Iranian. Their rituals and thoughts and social alignments mimicked pagan societies to their west, not those of the tree swingers to their east. Multiple genetic studies including those done at Rakhigiri support this.

Hinduism was borne of an Iranian people within the Pakistani region of the IVC. It was foreign to your nation and moreover, it was foreign to the subcontinent as its proponents were Iranian settlers whose philosophy and city building traits came from the great civilisations to their west. The next defining moment in the history of Hinduism arose when the Aryans migrated into the subcontinent and split off from the traditional animistic, meat eating, non-stratified non-caste adherence of the harappans. This moment was more or less a schism in ancient Hinduism, creating the even more foreign-derived Vedic era, within which we all now find ourselves languishing. I dare not dwell on this matter but it gets to the very core of what "India" and Hinduism really are, and the inherent hypocrisy or outright lies espoused by senior bhaktistanis when trying to educate us on only "local produce" being acceptable for "local people". I thank you once again @Chhatrapati for giving me ample opportunity to express the above. Be careful or folks might start thinking you deliberately set me up because you're a cleverly engineered and planted ISI mole. #adnansami

This has to be a troll post. The Kalash people of Pakistan are the only group that can be regarded as White/Aryan, the rest are a mix of Steppe, Iranic and ASI.

As for OP, if you have read David Reich's book, you will know that the average distance between two people of different "jatis" in India living side to side can sometimes be 3 times more than the distance between a Swede and an Italian (Northern and Southern European)

Pakistan is a hybrid nation composed of Indo-Aryans like Punjabis and Sindhis and Turko-Iranians like Pashtun and Baloch.

Only Bangladesh is a real nation state in the true sense of the word, India and Pakistan are both pseudo-nations which is why both of them are wracked by separatist insurgencies.

You were making a lot of sense until the end. This hybrid origin is not the reason of insurgency. Let me add the other key difference between Pakistan and India - one nation is at peace with and accepts its hybrid origins whereas the other is not, still clinging to a false notion of traceability to exclusively gangetic origins.

 

[kongn]

Frankly, I think your the joker. Let me clear the mist in your head. It was us who begged to break away from you guys. Not the other way around. I know what India is. There is a old English saying. Cathedrals in the desert. Your cities have small number of filthy rich but rest of your population is poor. The bottom 25% is disgustingly poor. Your cities are filthy hellholes. Karachi is another filthy city - a clone of India.

Jinnah may have had many failings but I want to do puja to him from saving us from billion of semi-naked junglee half Dravidian half Aboriginals. Why would our poor want to go to your filthy cities to pull rickshaws like animals?

It is your beggar country with more poor as population percentage,huge malnutrition,and worse sanitation.The karachi you hate,take that out and you no longer have an economy.You are a feudal agricultural state held together by an alliance between zamindars,armymen and mullahs.Rest of the populace are 'dalit' level.I will gladly donate to your puja,thanking jinnah for partition.I suffer no delusions like a few romanticists of 'united' india.That would be a nightmare with 700 million muslims moving around freely inside the country.You got your pure land,we got our indic empire.Win-win.

 

[kongn]

There are only 3 true civilizations in the world: West, Islamic and China. Everything else is a copy of these + some local voodoo elements.

India is basically Islamic civ layer + Western civ layer (strongest element) + local hindu voodoo rituals (including hygiene issues).

If you look at your government bureaucracy documents, you will find 2 layers of admin system, an older one from Muslim era and a newer one by British that has mostly replaced the Muslim era systems, however some words and terminologies from Muslim era remains.

I find Indians use the word "civilization" too casually. If you were indeed a separate civilization, you would find Western world alien and inadaptable, which you don't. Muslims and West find it very difficult to adapt at each others countries, despite so many Muslims living in Europe, and both Muslims and Westerners have very hard time understanding Chinese people or assimilating to it. Indians can easily settle anywhere, though the host may have hygiene objections. That's because you don't have rules or systems of your own.

When it comes to civilizations i will take the word of huntington author of 'clash of civilizations' rather than a bangladeshi 'intellectual' forumer on what qualifies as a civilzation.We have our own unique stories, philosophy, art,crafts, dance,religion,script,mathematics,sciences,scriptures, language,architecture, cuisine,music - all the markers of a civilization.
Islam in indian history was little more than a parasitic force that has now been cut off from its host and thrown away.Indians settle everywhere well because we are used to living in diverse cultural settings while muslims and chinese are not.There are dozens of subcultures within indian civilization.Infact your own language which you are so proud of = bangla is a product of indian civilization.Without sanskrit your language or identity wouldn't exist.So thank the greatness of indian civilization everyday in gratitude.

 

[Maira La]

When it comes to civilizations i will take the word of huntington author of 'clash of civilizations' rather than a bangladeshi 'intellectual' forumer on what qualifies as a civilzation.We have our own unique stories, philosophy, art,crafts, dance,religion,script,mathematics,sciences,scriptures, language,architecture, cuisine,music - all the markers of a civilization.
Islam in indian history was little more than a parasitic force that has now been cut off from its host and thrown away.Indians settle everywhere well because we are used to living in diverse cultural settings while muslims and chinese are not.There are dozens of subcultures within indian civilization.Infact your own language which you are so proud of = bangla is a product of indian civilization.Without sanskrit your language or identity wouldn't exist.So thank the greatness of indian civilization everyday in gratitude.

Are you so incapable of making your own mind about the world around yourself that you have to treat book written by some Western academic as the Bible? Very Indian of you. Huntington himself has revised his own predictions countless times. He's just a money maker.

For a moment ignore your own verbal vomit and see what this "parasitic force" does for you. Taj Mahal, a Muslim legacy, brings in hundreds of millions of dollars to your country as tourist attraction. Every Indian restaurant abroad sell Kabobs, Tandoori and what not Islamic Meat items to survive because vegetarian restaurants make peanut $.

Language is not civilization. Korean have their own language and I've never heard anyone say "Korean civilization". Koreans had largely borrowed Chinese civilization and added local voodoo spirit stuff to make it palatable for local consumption. Today they (South) have transitioned to Western civ.

If I had to thank someone for Sanskrit, that's definitely not you or your junglee ancestors who got forcefully placed into the caste system by Aryan men who came from Pakistan, bringing their old IE language along with them.

 

[Chacha_Facebooka]

Nope.

 

[Juggernaut_Flat_Plane_V8]

I donot think India has any right to lecture Pakistan on sanitation, hygiene,malnutrition till India achieves at least Brazil,Thailand level of infrastructure,development,cleanliness,hygiene,waste management...It's pure cringe when Indians do that these days

 

[kongn]

Are you so incapable of making your own mind about the world around yourself that you have to treat book written by some Western academic as the Bible? Very Indian of you. Huntington himself has revised his own predictions countless times. He's just a money maker.

For a moment ignore your own verbal vomit and see what this "parasitic force" does for you. Taj Mahal, a Muslim legacy, brings in hundreds of millions of dollars to your country as tourist attraction. Every Indian restaurant abroad sell Kabobs, Tandoori and what not Islamic Meat items to survive because vegetarian restaurants make peanut $.

Language is not civilization. Korean have their own language and I've never heard anyone say "Korean civilization". Koreans had largely borrowed Chinese civilization and added local voodoo spirit stuff to make it palatable for local consumption. Today they (South) have transitioned to Western civ.

If I had to thank someone for Sanskrit, that's definitely not you or your junglee ancestors who got forcefully placed into the caste system by Aryan men who came from Pakistan, bringing their old IE language along with them.

Huntington was reference.As i said we fulfill every single marker of a civilization- unique language is only one aspect of it.And we are unique in every regard.We gave birth to 4 of the world's religions,we have our own philosophies,own artforms, architecture, classical music, dance,mathematics,epics,languages, literature,sculpture,sciences -I know its difficult to swallow since all you have is resort to aping arabs.All the great bengalis were hindu bengalis.

As for parasite.If all you can show for the massive blood and tears inflicted on indian civilization by barbarians is taj mahal(built with indian blood and treasure) and some kebabs i will gladly exchange it all,lol.Monuments wer built for their personal glory,cuisine was for their personal luxury ,they never did anything for the people of india except taxation, destruction,rape and slaughter- alien language,alien civilization and alien faith.Nothing to do with us.

Junglee kala bangali isn't that what your pakistani arya biradari called you when they genocided and mass raped your lot in 1971 and we had to go in and save you from extinction?Pakistanis sanskrit?HAHAHA.They have a bastardized form of hindustani derived from prakrit mixed with persian as their language.I doubt even a single pakistani knows sanskrit.Sanskrit is preserve and legacy of vedic civilization.So everytime you 'kala' bangalee say i'm proud to be bangla know that your very identity was a product of indic civilization and bow your head in respect.Also do try to produce some actually great bengalis that can size up to the stalwarts on the indian side before calling yourself as civilized.Hell even your national anthem was written by a tagore.

 

[sinait]

However most impressive is Singapore which has been hasahed out of two migrants groups on top of the natives.

• Chinese migrants
• Indian migrants
• Malay natives

Turned into a solid Singaporan identity which as artificial as you can get but that does not matter. It has more panache across the globe than Pakistan.

A correction here.

• Chinese migrants
• Indian migrants
• Malay migrants

The Malay is also migrant in Singapore.
The natives of Singapore and Malaya are the Orang Asli.
Currently there are 1200 Orang Asli, the true natives in Singapore.

Our Current "Malay" President have a Muslim Indian father.
Former "Malay" Prime Minister of Malaysia Mahathir Mohamad is Muslim Indian.
Arabs and all my friends from Afghanistan( I suspect all of them) in Singapore identify themselves as "Malay" as well, to qualify for subsidies and priviledges.

Many of my Malay classmates have gone over to Malaysia for even more subsidies and priviledges.
Many of our "Malay" are mostly Indonesian migrants.
.

 

[Chhatrapati]

Again with the disjointed substance-less multifaceted bullshtt?

1. Being a "cuck" means taking pride in being enslaved instead of empowering oneself with something better that happens to come along. The problem with brahminist defenders is that they are proud of a substandard foreign system (more on why it's foreign later) while violently rejecting a more egalitarian foreign system because of the mental abyss within which they reside. The Arab comparison is apt. They do very much recognise their pagan roots and have sensibly washed their hands clean of human sacrificing, cannibalism, and other bizarre ritualism because something better came along. They immediately realised that such nonsense will limit their progress against regional competition (Christians). The Aztecs are an example of such cultist slave-generating practices that could not stand up to foreign pressure from those of advanced thought. Now the brahminist post-Vedic cult is an interesting case - this persisted because of the inherent mercy of monotheistic faiths (Islam and Christianity) and because those groups were too busy rivalling one another at critical junctures. The slave network has persisted and flourished to this day, with any cosmetic mitigating efforts having minimal impact in India itself or in the wider Indian psyche.

1. This one again I'm not going to contest, it's your belief, after all we are not the ones enslaved by something that's alien to this land. Your ancestors, your problems. There is no point in repeating the same Brahminism and stuff, Brahminism Hinduism, or any Dharmic philosophies are born into this land, it developed and changed over time in this region and hence there is no point trying to explain to me, our religion is a foreign system. Which someone with basic historic, archaeological knowledge would laugh at. If something, in fact, better came along, those regions would've flourished with science and art, most of the discoveries and ideas happened up until a new idea came along the region was ravaged in wars, also, nobody brought anything advanced to the region neither relating to science or art, all that there is are remnants of the past, which the invaders build on. Be it the Sakas, Kushans or Mughals. Like I heard some losers claim desert munchers bought rice to the region. Like seriously? Give me one critical contribution to the science or art that was brought up into the region that can trump the middle Kingdoms or an age that's called as the Golden age of India, that is from Mauryas un until the Guptas.

2. There are TWO ways in which stating dharmic faiths originated "in India" are factually incorrect AND misleading.

View attachment 728633

Firstly, the SECULAR REPUBLIC OF INDIA DOES NOT EQUATE TO ANCIENT "INDIA". You yourself know this when you subtly insert "subcontinent" later in your comment. You are deliberately and malevolently aligning all regions of "ancient India" with your nation state. This is precisely the problem we have with you lot naming your country after a historical geographic region cooked up in Greek and Persian texts. You have appropriated other people's history. You've done "a Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia" but moreover, you've not only deceived others, you've fallen for your own propaganda. You have brainwashed yourself into thinking Delhi holds some ancient historical sway over land in Pakistan. The origins of dharma are far more centred around NON-SECULAR REPUBLICAN lands than the lands of your nation state. Buddhism and Hinduism patently originated west of your country and inside Pakistan. You and other bhakts are aware of this discrepancy in the hindutva narrative, hence insert "subcontinent" in place of "India" hoping nobody else notices.

It doesn't matter what equates to ANCIENT INDIA, you can dwell in the semantics forever, our civilization is continuous since the Vedic age. Since then ideas flourished in this land, new interpretations of our texts and ways of life followed, that expanded to regions as far as Japan.
Now, you, that is Pakistan has no real importance for an average Indian, and nobody claimed Gandhara is now in India or Taxila is in India, it is in today's Pakistan. Your issue is not India appropriating Pakistans history, but, you ridicule your own ancestors as pagans animalistic, Cannibalistic cucks then when Indians be proud of their religion and culture, you will automatically switch to, "oh that came from us, we are cool, brilliant". You can't have your cake and eat it. Forget about India, what is your identity? Stick to it, we Indians are not confused about our history or our identity, a Tamil brahmin and a North Indian Dalit worship the same lord Shiva using the same Mantra. That's the only relation that matters not some genetic or DNA stuff, which most Indians don't care much which is exactly your problem.

Secondly, even if, by some twisted logic, the modern entity of "India" could lay claim to the IVC and Gandhara, the people who inhabited and resided within the IVC were genetically substantively Iranian. Their rituals and thoughts and social alignments mimicked pagan societies to their west, not those of the tree swingers to their east. Multiple genetic studies including those done at Rakhigiri support this.

View attachment 728632

The relevance here??

Hinduism was borne of an Iranian people within the Pakistani region of the IVC. It was foreign to your nation and moreover, it was foreign to the subcontinent as its proponents were Iranian settlers whose philosophy and city building traits came from the great civilisations to their west. The next defining moment in the history of Hinduism arose when the Aryans migrated into the subcontinent and split off from the traditional animistic, meat eating, non-stratified non-caste adherence of the harappans. This moment was more or less a schism in ancient Hinduism, creating the even more foreign-derived Vedic era, within which we all now find ourselves languishing. I dare not dwell on this matter but it gets to the very core of what "India" and Hinduism really are, and the inherent hypocrisy or outright lies espoused by senior bhaktistanis when trying to educate us on only "local produce" being acceptable for "local people". I thank you once again @Chhatrapati for giving me ample opportunity to express the above. Be careful or folks might start thinking you deliberately set me up because you're a cleverly engineered and planted ISI mole. #adnansami

You were making a lot of sense until the end. This hybrid origin is not the reason of insurgency. Let me add the other key difference between Pakistan and India - one nation is at peace with and accepts its hybrid origins whereas the other is not, still clinging to a false notion of traceability to exclusively gangetic origins.

I will make it simple for you

1. Genetically, India is a mix of ANI and ASI. But Hinduism is not a "genetic" religion and genetics does not matter in our religion.

2. Persians, Gandharans, Kambojas and those from Central/west Asians were called Yavanas/Mlechchas and not part of Aryavarta which basically means there was a clear distinction between those who followed the Vedic faith (Us) and those who didn't (them).

3. Harappa - IVC died as per historians, and there was a few centuries of gap between the origins of Vedas and Harappa - IVC. Inserting, foreign foreign foreign every now and then doesn't make it one, but commend your failed attempts. Not many takers for it sorry.

4. Indians have no confusion about their history, we know our religion originated and flourished in India, along with 3 other faiths and expanded to regions beyond the Himalayas. You, on the other hand, adopted a different faith that didn't originate in India, feel the need to try and explain to us our religion is "foreign" too lol.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

It is your beggar country

You will find India is the biggest beggar in the world. It ought be named beggardesh.

At $65 bn, India biggest recipient of US economic aid over 1946-2012 period: USAID

https://www.financialexpress.com/economy/at-65-bn-india-biggest-recipient-of-us-economic-aid-over-1946-2012-period-usaid/100848/

 

[Maira La]

We gave birth to 4 of the world's religions,we have our own philosophies,own artforms, architecture, classical music, dance,mathematics,epics,languages, literature,sculpture,sciences -I know its difficult to swallow since all you have is resort to aping arabs.All the great bengalis were hindu bengalis.

You did not give birth to anything, the invading Indo-Aryans did as I said in my last post. You simply follow their religion and caste that was imposed on you. However the dance or architecture or epics that you speak of are ancient and have no relevance today. They have no use in the everyday life of a western cloth wearing burger eating Indian. 'Sciences'... pffft.

The great Bengalis you speak of received Western education which started the Bengal renaissance. The spark was British rule and the Western civilization it brought along with it.

As for parasite.If all you can show for the massive blood and tears inflicted on indian civilization by barbarians is taj mahal(built with indian blood and treasure) and some kebabs i will gladly exchange it all,lol.Monuments wer built for their personal glory,cuisine was for their personal luxury ,they never did anything for the people of india except taxation, destruction,rape and slaughter- alien language,alien civilization and alien faith.Nothing to do with us.

Of course nothing to do with you. I'd be happiest if you started distancing yourselves from Muslim history and culture.

unglee kala bangali isn't that what your pakistani arya biradari called you when they genocided and mass raped your lot in 1971 and we had to go in and save you from extinction?Pakistanis sanskrit?HAHAHA.They have a bastardized form of hindustani derived from prakrit mixed with persian as their language.I doubt even a single pakistani knows sanskrit.Sanskrit is preserve and legacy of vedic civilization.

I don't think Indian historians disagree that Vedas was written in Pakistan. Originally the Aryans came from Central Asia before settling in Pakistan. Brahmin Y-dna, which is passed down the male line, is largely R1a, which is the dominant Y-dna of Pakistani males. Brahmins being genetically halfway between Eastern Pakistanis and black Indian adivasis also makes sense, since the proto-brahmin men who brought Vedas married local adivasi women along the Ganges and started the caste based religion you practice today. Basically your top caste is a result of Pakistani sperm donation.