IRIAF | News and Discussions

[aryobarzan]

Algeria, UAE, Qatar.

Putin will tell the Arabs if you don’t buy it, I’ll sell it to Iran. And they will buy it just so Iran doesn’t get it.

Or it will be retrofitted to Russian standard and added to Russian Air Force.

You are right..and I have no regret if Iran does not get them...spend the money and fix the aviation infrastructure of Iran while at the same time designing your own engine and airframe ...Yes things can be done concurrently.... Buy them and you will be begging Ruskis for parts and maintenance every other day..

 

[Sineva]

May be

But historically,Arabs are great warriors.underestimating them can be a serious mistake in military conflict.

Historically that certainly was true.However,when one looks back over the last 70 years of arab military history,well frankly,there is precious little to be proud of,and this is true regardless of whether it was a soviet trained vassal military or a western trained vassal military.
The problem is systemic,so long as one has weak despotic arab vassal regimes [yes saudi arabia and the gulf states I`m looking at you] that fear their own militaries as much,or even more,than the militaries of other nations,and as a result prefer commanders and officer corps that they consider to be politically reliable,usually to the exclusion of any and all other qualities,including military competence,well,sadly the end result is rather predictable.
On the other hand tho` we saw what a well lead,well trained,well equipped force fighting in defence of its own country could achieve back in 2006,and even more impressively this was not a national arab army but a nominal militia.
So I agree that the arabs certainly have a great deal of military potential.The current problem tho is realizing that potential,and since this would require huge change in the arab world politically,which I dont really see happening anytime soon sadly,I imagine that the arab vassal regimes will continue to squander hundreds of billions on weapons that they dont need and cant use,in the [erroneous] belief that this will give them strong and capable armies [on paper at least].

 

[Stryker1982]

Algeria, UAE, Qatar.

Putin will tell the Arabs if you don’t buy it, I’ll sell it to Iran. And they will buy it just so Iran doesn’t get it.

Or it will be retrofitted to Russian standard and added to Russian Air Force.

If they do give it to Iran, they'll probably replace the radar with a garbage one, downgrade the avionics, and probably add a kill switch too if they could.

No wonder IRAIF keep rejecting their offers, probably because they are offering nothing that can compete with a F-15E, or Eurofighter. Not to mention, future Rafale.

This might sound crazy, but even doing a joint project with Turkey would yield much better results, but I'm sure their access to electronics from NATO would be rejected even if they would be hypothetically interested because they don't want NATO equipment in Iranian hands, but my point essentially is that IRAIF can't trust them not to give useless aircraft for billions.

 

[925boy]

This might sound crazy, but even doing a joint project with Turkey would yield much better results, but I'm sure their access to electronics from NATO would be rejected even if they would be hypothetically interested because they don't want NATO equipment in Iranian hands, but my point essentially is that IRAIF can't trust them not to give useless aircraft for billions.

Iran would end up regretting this.

 

[Mr Iran Eye]

do U have a link to this report...

I spoke on the phone with Ayatollah Khamenei and this plane will be presented to the public soon

 

[aryobarzan]

I spoke on the phone with Ayatollah Khamenei and this plane will be presented to the public soon

Ok...send my regards next time you talk to him and do not forget to take your pills.

 

[drmeson]

May be

But historically,Arabs are great warriors.underestimating them can be a serious mistake in military conflict.

What have Arabs achieved in last 3500 years after Iranic emergence ? They only had control over 70% of Iran for like 100 odd years that is like flash in a pan. They were under the control of the Persian and Medes Empires for literally like a Millenia and then they were colonized subjects of my kind ... the Turks ... that too for centuries. Now they act as Vassals of regional and western powers. Every war they fight they lose.

 

[SalarHaqq]

Algeria, UAE, Qatar.

Putin will tell the Arabs if you don’t buy it, I’ll sell it to Iran. And they will buy it just so Iran doesn’t get it.

Algeria has no issues with Iran. They're a major customer of up-to-date Russian defence products, however if they buy up those Su-35's, it will not be with the aim of preventing Iran from obtaining them. As for the other states mentioned, well, they're a different matter.

 

[Dariush the Great]

If they do give it to Iran, they'll probably replace the radar with a garbage one, downgrade the avionics, and probably add a kill switch too if they could.

No wonder IRAIF keep rejecting their offers, probably because they are offering nothing that can compete with a F-15E, or Eurofighter. Not to mention, future Rafale.

This might sound crazy, but even doing a joint project with Turkey would yield much better results, but I'm sure their access to electronics from NATO would be rejected even if they would be hypothetically interested because they don't want NATO equipment in Iranian hands, but my point essentially is that IRAIF can't trust them not to give useless aircraft for billions.

We have to make it simple for the wider audience to understand. All of these issues about the IRIAF receiving new technology or not comes down to one thing : Iran's refusal to be a puppet. All those countries around us and basically all other nations in the world except for maybe China, they are all US vassals, one has a bit more control over their policies while the other is a full sock puppet. Only way Iran can have some acces to tech is through China, in full secrecy.

 

[sha ah]

But Arabs can't buy it because of US sanctions and pressure

Also Russia is badly in need of funds for its new weapons systems.

Regardless it's going to depend on upcoming negotiations between Russia and NATO regarding Ukraine, which don't appear too promising.

In any case there's a good chance that Russia won't let a large multi billion dollar arms deal pass them by as Iran will not buy anything if it doesn't get everything it wants.

Keep in mind Russias arms exports are currently being squeezed. If the Arabs and countries like Indonesia can't buy from Russia and China is shifting away, then what does that leave Russia ? India ? Yes but even India is being pressured by the west and are now moving towards western options.

Algeria, UAE, Qatar.

Putin will tell the Arabs if you don’t buy it, I’ll sell it to Iran. And they will buy it just so Iran doesn’t get it.

Or it will be retrofitted to Russian standard and added to Russian Air Force.

 

[sha ah]

When it comes to Russian arms, the Russians have decent hardware. Allegedly a Russia SU-30 recently snuck up on a F-35 by using it's Khibiny electronic warfare suite to jam the F-35s sensors. The F-35 allegedly left the area after being confronted.

Specifically the Russians use of IR sensors actually allow a jet like the SU-30 to spot, track and target stealth jets from long distances with relative ease.

On the other hand, the Egyptians recently conducted an exercise where they had one of their SU-35s go head to head against a Rafale. The Rafales electronic warfare capabilities were too much for the SU-35

"Word is the Egyptians tested an Irbis-E radar (from the Su-35) against Rafale’s ECM-system, and the latter easily overpowered the former."

Here’s why Egypt will never receive Sukhoi Su-35 fighter jets (and why there's no confirmation for any of reports about Algeria or Iran "taking them instead") - The Aviation Geek Club

Here’s why Egypt will never receive Sukhoi Su-35 fighter jets (and why there's no confirmation for any of reports about Algeria or Iran)

theaviationgeekclub.com

The Rafale is quite formidable though. I believe it was last year, an Egyptian Rafale snuck up on and destroyed 3 Turkish HAWK batteries at Watiya airbase, Libya. Turkey had spent millions modernizing their HAWK batteries yet they had no clue the Rafale was coming.

Anyways my point is that Russia possesses and produces good hardware. The question is what are they willing to sell on the export market ?

Regardless, Iran will not accept anything less than the best export variant Russia has to offer. They're very picky about specifics and will not accept an inferior product.

Iran is also looking for technology transfers, production license and software codes are mandatory for Iran.

This is one of the reasons why Iran said no to the S-400 when the S-300 deal finally went through. Look at how Turkey is stuck now, with Russia refusing to hand over the software codes.

Iran working with Turkey to build a jet ? I'm sorry but is this some kind of a joke ? LOL

If they do give it to Iran, they'll probably replace the radar with a garbage one, downgrade the avionics, and probably add a kill switch too if they could.

No wonder IRAIF keep rejecting their offers, probably because they are offering nothing that can compete with a F-15E, or Eurofighter. Not to mention, future Rafale.

This might sound crazy, but even doing a joint project with Turkey would yield much better results, but I'm sure their access to electronics from NATO would be rejected even if they would be hypothetically interested because they don't want NATO equipment in Iranian hands, but my point essentially is that IRAIF can't trust them not to give useless aircraft for billions.

 

[Mr Iran Eye]

Ok...send my regards next time you talk to him and do not forget to take your pills.

The problem is, you are bad analysis and bad researchers and you don't understand Iran's announcement process. They are always ahead of what they present publicly. A good idea of this is the generation of the new radar count. Iran produces radars as no country has the background, we are having difficulty keeping track of their novelty counts. For the Kowsar it's the same, they also produce the single-seater version and there have been some statements on this subject.

A year after the official release of the Kowsar, they said it had technological advances. I have been following the Iranian army for years and they don't always unveil their new products and follow their own schedule. By March, April they should have new announcements on the subject. So keep your pills to yourself and learn to observe and read between the lines

 

[Muhammed45]

But Arabs can't buy it because of US sanctions and pressure

Also Russia is badly in need of funds for its new weapons systems.

Regardless it's going to depend on upcoming negotiations between Russia and NATO regarding Ukraine, which don't appear too promising.

In any case there's a good chance that Russia won't let a large multi billion dollar arms deal pass them by as Iran will not buy anything if it doesn't get everything it wants.

Keep in mind Russias arms exports are currently being squeezed. If the Arabs and countries like Indonesia can't buy from Russia and China is shifting away, then what does that leave Russia ? India ? Yes but even India is being pressured by the west and are now moving towards western options.

Arabs can surely buy it as SU-35s were present in Dubai airshow. And Russians are more than willing to sell them a dumb version of it.

Point is, if Russia goes that way then USA would be able to put its hands on technology of downgraded Sukhois, despite that, still it worth it. Something is better than nothing and US airforce can practice against Sukhois knowing the fact that Su 27 and its latest 30,35 versions are backbone of Russian interceptors and bombers, specially in the far east.

It makes Russians hesitant and sensitive about this issue and the possible leakage of technology. On the other hand, it allows them to play the Arab card with USA something that Chinese has also tried to do in this region with this mental background that we can separate USA's traditional allies or at the very least try to reduce the trust between traditional allies (you read USA and its regional dogs).

So it will be done at an Slow pace and gradually with political assurance.

On this side, we have Iran a techinlogical power compared to Arabs. Iran wants some sort of transfer of technology something like the Indian case with Su30 MKI. Iran won't buy huge number of fighter jets compared to Arabs since Iran military doctorine wants fighter jets only as an airdefense Layer not for air superiority purposes considering the fact that we have USAF threatening us in Persian Gulf. So we still have the issue of money, Arabs can offer much more than what Iran would suggest to Russians.

I think that Iran will buy few squadrons of SU-35 to solve that issue, a complement.

All in all, Russians seem willing to sell fighters to both Iran and Arabs under some conditions.

The goodness of it, Iran will use them to remove techinlogical barriers, Arabs will remain Arabs.

 

[thesaint]

When is president Raesi's supposed trip to Russia ?

 

[drmeson]

Despite all the discussions we used to have during IMF times or here, people need to understand something now after all these years. IRIAF is just not on the agenda of the people who actually runs Iran. You get Rouhani, Raisi or whatever faces but IRIAF is not going to go anywhere. They get less money or attention which makes sense because battleground is in constant evolution and our priority is BM/CM + UCAV strike packages for attack and SAMs for air defense. With the budget we have, we will barely get four squadrons of some totally new Russian fighter like Sukhoi-35 at best which will just be another maintenance mess unless they get it in high numbers like 7-8 squadrons replacing all the F-4E/D/RF, MF-1 EQ, F-5E, F-7N with one multirole platform performing all the duties. That is not easy considering thatwe have zero infrastructure for Sukhoi Flanker family. That is like daydreaming considering that IRIAF planners are cash-strapped dumb propagandists and nothing more. We have seen that with Azarakhsh, Saeghe, Kowsar, Qaher dramas. They give moderate levels upgrades to a 3rd generation fighter jet and start calling it new. Compare that to our naval or aerospace program.

IRIAF's only solution is to be merged with IRGC-AF, IRGC makes things happen, they have shown that with missiles, AD programs, and unmanned aerial platforms. They will do the same with IRIAF as well. Maybe we will finally see the retirement of Shahi relics and Saddams legacies being replaced with single multi-role platforms like Su-35S. A more realistic composition of IRIAF+IRGCAF will be something like (new procurement is underlined):

Interceptors (72 x 4th gen)
- 4-5 squadrons x F-14 AM (3.5-4 squadrons are currently operational, 1 more can be refurbished to AM standard)
- 2 squadrons x Mig-29 SMT (5 new airframes required and rest upgraded by Mikyon itself with R-77/RVV-AE to SMT standards)

Multirole (108 x half 4++ and half 3.5-4.0 gen)
- 4 Squadrons x Su-35S (Some level local assembly with TOT should be procured)
- 5 Squadrons x F-4 E/D (Project "Dowran" upgraded with Chinese 4th generation combat suite upto JH-7A standards with JL-10A radars, minimum upto J-8IIM standards)

Attack (60 + mass produced UCAVs)
- 3 squadrons x Su-24M2 (equipped with KH-31, domestic long range ALCM)
- 2 Squadrons x IRGC upgraded Su-22 (1 already exists, another one can be raised with domestic long range ALCM packages)
- 50 x Shahed-129/Gaza
- 50 x Simorgh Flying Wings with Naval Strike capability
- 100 x Mohajer-6 with Naval Strike capability
- 100 x Karrars

AEW
5 x local IrAn-140 platforms with 600-800 km tracking ranges, something on lines of Israeli EITAM.


Retirement: F-5 family (Saeghe, Kowsar), Qaher , Mirages, F-7, Su-25

... Now this is an airforce to be feared by regional adversaries atleast and if combined with our level missile power, it can be lethal. It is realistic and may save IRIAF in less money then we would have wasted on mass producing some local F-5 copy just for the sake of having a local fighter.