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I fully agree that the cost of ballistic missiles is too high.
And what Iran needs more than anything else is UAV.
The recent bombing of Sevastopol, Russia was reportedly done by a Chinese-made civilian UAV, the mugin-5.
The mugin-5 is said to have a carbon fiber body, can carry 20 kg of bombs, and can fly hundreds of kilometers for a price of only $10,000.
It is a game changer, capable of flying hundreds of kilometers and supporting VTOL.
It should cost only a few thousand dollars to produce.
If Iran had the capability to produce similar drones, it could acquire tens of thousands of kamikaze drones every year.
It would clearly be more effective in deterring the US than a few ballistic bombs.
 
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Yes because if you saturate the airspace & keep trying, eventually drones will get through & when we're talking about oil refineries, all it takes is one hit. In the last few weeks & days especially, Ukraine has launched dozens of drones, including Mugin-5s & unmanned speed boats rigged with explosives at Sevastopol. The Russians have shot down something like 90%, but the one got through. The oil refinery was right on the coast as well, so it was an easy target.

That $5000, plus shipping + handling, exchange rates, export fees, etc will end up costing perhaps even up to double. Believe me I used to import electronic components from China, the shipping & other expenses can easily double the cost of the item and today shipping from China is much more expensive than previously.

But even at $10,000, Iran is likely producing one Shahed for less. Most of these Mugin-5s get shot down but eventually one will get through.

Ballistic missiles are for higher priority targets. Iran's Shahed drones, at their extremely low price point can even be used to deplete air defense missiles. Think about it, each Patriot missile costs $3 million a piece. Each Nasam $300,000 - $1 million depending. Sure Gepards are effective but you have to deploy a large quantity of them & they can't be everywhere at once, it's impossible, not to mention the fact that they can be jammed as well. Manpads even, NATO variants still cost $80,000 or more average ? So Shaheds are extremely cost effective even at $20,000 each. I'm guessing Iran's cost is $5000-$10,000 realistically.

I hear that the Russians are using Shahed drones to deplete Ukraine's air defense missiles. Ukraine allegedly has no access to more S-300 missiles. So what Russia does is launch Shahed drones to hit various targets. If they get there great and hit the target great. If they're shot down, they not only deplete Ukraine's limited stockpile for pennies on the dollar, but they allow Russia to identify where Ukrainian air defenses are stationed. That's when Russia sends cruise/ballistic missiles or as we saw 2 days ago Lancets, which Ukraine's older S-300s seem to have trouble picking up. The Gepard was supposed to protect S-300s from Lancets but we all saw how that ended.

Ukraine sent their air defense systems closer to the front to give cover to their troops who crossed the Dnieper & setup base on the islands between the Russian & Ukranian controlled mainland. The problem is that these islands are what is referred to as wetlands, marshes. Extremely muddy, lots of vegetation & during high tide the entire area can flood, not to mention you can't dig trenches because a few feet below there's water. I don't know what the Ukrainians were thinking but their tanks & armored vehicles got stuck & Russia drooped several FAB-500 gliding bomb on them. It's not going too well.


It's hard to believe how arrogant & cocky Ukrainians have become



I fully agree that the cost of ballistic missiles is too high.
And what Iran needs more than anything else is UAV.
The recent bombing of Sevastopol, Russia was reportedly done by a Chinese-made civilian UAV, the mugin-5.
The mugin-5 is said to have a carbon fiber body, can carry 20 kg of bombs, and can fly hundreds of kilometers for a price of only $10,000.
It is a game changer, capable of flying hundreds of kilometers and supporting VTOL.
It should cost only a few thousand dollars to produce.
If Iran had the capability to produce similar drones, it could acquire tens of thousands of kamikaze drones every year.
It would clearly be more effective in deterring the US than a few ballistic bombs.
 
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Yes because if you saturate the airspace & keep trying, eventually drones will get through & when we're talking about oil refineries, all it takes is one hit. In the last few weeks & days especially, Ukraine has launched dozens of drones, including Mugin-5s & unmanned speed boats rigged with explosives at Sevastopol. The Russians have shot down something like 90%, but the one got through. The oil refinery was right on the coast as well, so it was an easy target.

That $5000, plus shipping + handling, exchange rates, export fees, etc will end up costing perhaps even up to double. Believe me I used to import electronic components from China, the shipping & other expenses can easily double the cost of the item and today shipping from China is much more expensive than previously.

But even at $10,000, Iran is likely producing one Shahed for less. Most of these Mugin-5s get shot down but eventually one will get through.

Ballistic missiles are for higher priority targets. Iran's Shahed drones, at their extremely low price point can even be used to deplete air defense missiles. Think about it, each Patriot missile costs $3 million a piece. Each Nasam $300,000 - $1 million depending. Sure Gepards are effective but you have to deploy a large quantity of them & they can't be everywhere at once, it's impossible, not to mention the fact that they can be jammed as well. Manpads even, NATO variants still cost $80,000 or more average ? So Shaheds are extremely cost effective even at $20,000 each. I'm guessing Iran's cost is $5000-$10,000 realistically.

I hear that the Russians are using Shahed drones to deplete Ukraine's air defense missiles. Ukraine allegedly has no access to more S-300 missiles. So what Russia does is launch Shahed drones to hit various targets. If they get there great and hit the target great. If they're shot down, they not only deplete Ukraine's limited stockpile for pennies on the dollar, but they allow Russia to identify where Ukrainian air defenses are stationed. That's when Russia sends cruise/ballistic missiles or as we saw 2 days ago Lancets, which Ukraine's older S-300s seem to have trouble picking up. The Gepard was supposed to protect S-300s from Lancets but we all saw how that ended.

Ukraine sent their air defense systems closer to the front to give cover to their troops who crossed the Dnieper & setup base on the islands between the Russian & Ukranian controlled mainland. The problem is that these islands are what is referred to as wetlands, marshes. Extremely muddy, lots of vegetation & during high tide the entire area can flood, not to mention you can't dig trenches because a few feet below there's water. I don't know what the Ukrainians were thinking but their tanks & armored vehicles got stuck & Russia drooped several FAB-500 gliding bomb on them. It's not going too well.


It's hard to believe how arrogant & cocky Ukrainians have become


Ukraine is now acting big, i really hate these insignificant states acting like they are superpowers or whatever, it reminds me of South Korea

While their army and people they are conscripting are getting killed and torn into pieces, they are provoking China, taking credit for terrorist attacks inside Iran (even if its false), and threatening just everyone that isn't sending them weapons. At some point i was more with Ukraine, now they are just disgusting and the only responsible of that much deaths or if worse happens, it will be their responsibility.

I don't know how much Ukraine is corrupted from the inside and outside, but it seems they want to "hold" until the last Ukrainian and eventually doing everything possible of provoking to get China in.

I am pretty sure they are begging and dreaming that Russia uses nuclear weapons, these guys aren't in Ukraine, it reminds me of the Iranian opposition asking for Iran to get bombed by foreign forces, everything for their personal interests, nothing else.
 
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Keep in mind that those reports about Ukraine S300 loses are completly wrong,and result of people just cant make difference between 1 S300 System which include 4 x TELs ,and 1 battery which is something different,and depending on deployment and variant, include 12-16 TELs...
 
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1 - Kowsar version, much improved F-5 with new wings and more?

2 - Version with and without pilot of the F313?

3 - New heavy fighter officially started in 2020?

4 - Shafaq edit back?

5 - Su-35 I.R
the fifth need condolences
the best would be the first
4th another project to consume the limited amount of budget available
 
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1 - Kowsar version, much improved F-5 with new wings and more?

2 - Version with and without pilot of the F313?

3 - New heavy fighter officially started in 2020?

4 - Shafaq edit back?

5 - Su-35 I.R
Could not resist:

Regarding a Kowsar version, a much-improved F-5.

From the front.

A single seater, retaining the length of Saeqeh II. The second seat is removed to make way for the carriage of more fuel, electronics, etc.

New ‘Stealthified’ radome and forward avionics bay.

ASEA radar. Hopefully 200/150km.

MiG-29 type IRST – local - TIC-S-2 IIR.

IFR Probe (per Silk Road 2).

Single 20 - 30mm cannon sensibly dropped to a cheek position.

Windshield & canopy - Indium Tin Oxide coated.

Air intakes: Square with DSI.

CFT’s – see photoshopped images at https://www.key.aero/forum/modern-military-aviation/75991-f-5em-br-with-cft.

Wings - Cranked delta wings, such as those intended for Project Shahid Erfanian. Think F-16XL & Cheetah C. Mid-fuselage mounted.

V – stabilizers.

Single exhaust reflecting carriage of an RD-33 turbofan.
 
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I had a crazy idea back in 2016s.

We all know that Grumman was facing multiple financial problems in their program of developing a futuristic interceptor platform which ended up as F-14 Tomcats. The financial issue was so serious that they had to bribe Shah's agent to convince Shah about dropping of F-15 purchase and invest in F-14. In fact Iran saved Grumman's ambitious plan.

Russian Sukhoi company had a similar problem when they developed SU-47 Berkut. They left the program, produced only one jet of that class and introduced it as a tech demonstrator and a test bed for future experiments. I wonder if there was any possibility to cooperate with Russia for a TOT of SU-47 and develop a 5th generation fighter based upon its platform.

Is that even possible? Or its just a crazy idea of past?
 
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I had a crazy idea back in 2016s.

We all know that Grumman was facing multiple financial problems in their program of developing a futuristic interceptor platform which ended up as F-14 Tomcats. The financial issue was so serious that they had to bribe Shah's agent to convince Shah about dropping of F-15 purchase and invest in F-14. In fact Iran saved Grumman's ambitious plan.

Russian Sukhoi company had a similar problem when they developed SU-47 Berkut. They left the program, produced only one jet of that class and introduced it as a tech demonstrator and a test bed for future experiments. I wonder if there was any possibility to cooperate with Russia for a TOT of SU-47 and develop a 5th generation fighter based upon its platform.

Is that even possible? Or its just a crazy idea of past?
well that design have its own limitation , if you want to participate in a joint venture why not Su-57 or Su-75.
at least they are based on a proven concept, su-47 forward swept wing while beneficial at low speed very fast loose its advantage and loose to a more traditional looking wing as soon as you increase the speed
 
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I had a crazy idea back in 2016s.

We all know that Grumman was facing multiple financial problems in their program of developing a futuristic interceptor platform which ended up as F-14 Tomcats. The financial issue was so serious that they had to bribe Shah's agent to convince Shah about dropping of F-15 purchase and invest in F-14. In fact Iran saved Grumman's ambitious plan.

Russian Sukhoi company had a similar problem when they developed SU-47 Berkut. They left the program, produced only one jet of that class and introduced it as a tech demonstrator and a test bed for future experiments. I wonder if there was any possibility to cooperate with Russia for a TOT of SU-47 and develop a 5th generation fighter based upon its platform.

Is that even possible? Or its just a crazy idea of past?

well that design have its own limitation , if you want to participate in a joint venture why not Su-57 or Su-75.
at least they are based on a proven concept, su-47 forward swept wing while beneficial at low speed very fast loose its advantage and loose to a more traditional looking wing as soon as you increase the speed

Russia is not giving Iran D-30 or AL-41 tech. Both of you are way to optimistic. Iran would be lucky to get RD-33 level engine ToT.
 
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Iran is producing more and more components from CFM-56 high bypass turbofan engine that is derivative of low bypass F-101 used in B-1 Lancer strategic bomber.
RD-33 is a notch below F-101 in terms of thrust and Iran could go for F110 equivalent that is used on F-16 and F-15 along F118 on B-2 Spirit bomber.
Only country that Iran could consider as partner is North Korea due to joint research and development of military and civilian technologies.
 
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Iran is producing more and more components from CFM-56 high bypass turbofan engine that is derivative of low bypass F-101 used in B-1 Lancer strategic bomber.
RD-33 is a notch below F-101 in terms of thrust and Iran could go for F110 equivalent that is used on F-16 and F-15 along F118 on B-2 Spirit bomber.
Only country that Iran could consider as partner is North Korea due to joint research and development of military and civilian technologies.

Iran is many many years away from producing CFM-56 from scratch, let’s be realistic. And there would need to be considerable additional development to arrive at its more sensitive father the F-101.
 
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