IRIAF | News and Discussions

[sanel1412]

Well,they can upgrade F-5 to Kowsar standard easily but we can see that they build new airframes with one Gun,now upgrade process would probably require to take out one Gun from F-5,to make room for new radar and also they need new electric generators probably, new powerful radar always require more power and also there are new electronic components but only radar is heavy consumer... So,we can expect to see new airframes but also upgraded F-5 probably... We will see..

 

[skyshadow]

The original picture you gave of Kosar you can clearly see the interior is worn, the metal is more fatigued/worn, and paint along the console is chipped and faded.

How can a “brand new” cockpit have that happen?

And that propaganda video is nice and all, but straight from Iran’s mouth via news releases is that 15 kosar will be built in next 3 or so years. Yet that propaganda video shows at least 7 in an So called “assembly line”.

So something about this program doesn’t add up.

https://www.tehrantimes.com/news/431501/Iran-Air-Force-to-receive-15-Kowsar-fighter-jets

i agree with you this is nothing more than an test bed for (advance electronics and radar and ....) Iran fighter jet industry they said they do not want to stay on it if its new than good for us, but if its a upgraded F_5 still it need to be almost rebuilded entirely so i will say its nothing short of building a new one but i think Kowsar is Iranian built and this one maybe looks old but its still in making so its not final maybe they clean it after its done. do not forget that it can fire Fakour 90 missile now.

 

[Deino]

do not forget that it can fire Fakour 90 missile now.

No, it can not ! Did you ever checked, what was the weight of the original AIM-54 (463 kg) and even if the Fakour might be lighter it is well beyond the load capability of the F-5/Kowsar ... let alone in aerial combat. Just to add, name me any fighter, besides the F-14, which was able to carry that monster?

By the way, the Kowsar does not even have a decent radar ...

So either give proof that a Kowsar can carry the Fakour 90 missile or otherwise stop posting stupid propaganda.

 

[Mithridates]

No, it can not ! Did you ever checked, what was the weight of the original AIM-54 (463 kg) and even if the Fakour might be lighter it is well beyond the load capability of the F-5/Kowsar ... let alone in aerial combat. Just to add, name me any fighter, besides the F-14, which was able to carry that monster?

By the way, the Kowsar does not even have a decent radar ...

So either give proof that a Kowsar can carry the Fakour 90 missile or otherwise stop posting stupid propaganda.

f-4 and f-5 can carry AIM-54 but they will not in real world cause their radar range is limited.

 

[Deino]

f-4 and f-5 can carry AIM-54 but they will not in real world cause their radar range is limited.

Show me please one single image of a F-4 or F-5 - let even a Kowsar - carrying an AIM-54! There is none, since it is impossible.

 

[Mithridates]

Show me please one single image of a F-4 or F-5 - let even a Kowsar - carrying an AIM-54! There is none, since it is impossible.

it is not impossible weight wise but yes it is not possible to use them as a BVR missile with these planes (at least without upgrading them).

 

[Caspian Parsi]

Show me please one single image of a F-4 or F-5 - let even a Kowsar - carrying an AIM-54! There is none, since it is impossible.

Is not impossible but there is no need for it and doesn't make sense since F5 and F4 were build for different purpose , otherwise Iran Air force has done some similar work before in the 80s ,Like fitting AGM65 Maverick From F4 which is as big and heavy as AIM54 to AH-1 SuperCobra, !
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bell_AH-1_SuperCobra

Is not impossible but there is no need for it and doesn't make sense since F5 and F4 were build for different purpose , otherwise Iran Air force has done some similar work before in the 80s ,Like fitting AGM65 Maverick From F4 which is as big and heavy as AIM54 to AH-1 SuperCobra, !
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bell_AH-1_SuperCobra

Just read the section for IRAN

 

[Hack-Hook]

No, it can not ! Did you ever checked, what was the weight of the original AIM-54 (463 kg) and even if the Fakour might be lighter it is well beyond the load capability of the F-5/Kowsar ... let alone in aerial combat. Just to add, name me any fighter, besides the F-14, which was able to carry that monster?

By the way, the Kowsar does not even have a decent radar ...

So either give proof that a Kowsar can carry the Fakour 90 missile or otherwise stop posting stupid propaganda.

well on F-5 pylon 3-4-5 have the capability to carry 463kg weight of Fakour , but the question is what for ? the radar don't have the range ,even the upgraded radar on Kowsar have less range than the missile.

Show me please one single image of a F-4 or F-5 - let even a Kowsar - carrying an AIM-54! There is none, since it is impossible.

yes t's impossible because AIM-54 is not a missile alone , it's a missile bundled with AN/AWG-9 or AN/APG-71 . and for the record Fakour don't need those radars because the internal is different from AIM-54

 

[Hezbollahi]

Very impressive. Hopefully Iran can export these domestically made products.

 

[Deino]

well on F-5 pylon 3-4-5 have the capability to carry 463kg weight of Fakour , but the question is what for ? the radar don't have the range ,even the upgraded radar on Kowsar have less range than the missile.


yes t's impossible because AIM-54 is not a missile alone , it's a missile bundled with AN/AWG-9 or AN/APG-71 . and for the record Fakour don't need those radars because the internal is different from AIM-54

Exactly my points !

 

[sanel1412]

Show me please one single image of a F-4 or F-5 - let even a Kowsar - carrying an AIM-54! There is none, since it is impossible.

Radar used to upgrade F-4 and Kowsar are very similar,one used for Kowsar is probably smaller and considering that I saw MFDs and radar on F-4 I know for sure that they can integrate Fakour and PL-12 or any other modern missile,new multipurpose radars are digital and there is no limits in terms of integration.From F-4 MFD I saw it is clear what capability radar have but unfortunately I think Kowsar would be limited to only one such heavy missile to carry under fuselage but that would mean it had to fly without external fuel tank...I didn't check,but I'm not sure can F-5 carry 500kg under wings....Total payload of F-5 is not issue,but I don't know max weight it can carry on wings...Any way, when it comes to new radar,they can integrate any missile...that is why only modernized F-4 carry anti-ship missile...like noor or qadr,these missile have similar guidance as active guided a2a missiles,active radar + mid curse correction/ins but aircraft needs multipurpose radar like we saw on upgraded F-4 and Kowsar...So,they can put one Fakour under fuselage but range would be restricted to Kowsar radar range+active seeker on missile...I'm not sure is one long range missile worth to produce adapter and external fuel tank...It is more effective to just add 2 F-14 to fly in same formation...So yes it looks like impossible for someone who doesn't know anything about...Reason why F-14 was only capable fire aim54 in that time was because F-14 was only aircraft with sami-digital radar and what AWG-9 gives capability to simultaneously fire to 6 targets is TWS ,today every multipurpose radar(including one we saw on F-4)is capable for different mode of operations, that is why we can see RWR,CV,T-Pulse ..etc in MFD of F4...and that is why these radars are multipurpose... With standardized signal processing...there are no limits...that is why you can see 3th of khordar fire Sayyad missile...and that is why old air defense systems are digitalized...for easy integration, better resistance, multi channels
I checked F-5 wing payload ,it is 650kg/sq meter so it has sufficient payload to carry 2 Fakour 90 on wings + more weapons or fuel and just because there is no picture it doesn't mean anything, we didn't see picture of Kowsar armed with anything....But there would be more effective to add PL-12...we will see,truth is Iran has F-14,MiG29,F-4,F-1 and Kowsar would be more effective for R-73,short range interception and for CAS missions

 

[Hack-Hook]

I checked F-5 wing payload ,it is 650kg/sq meter so it has sufficient payload to carry 2 Fakour 90 on wings + more weapons or fuel and just because there is no picture it doesn't mean anything, we didn't see picture of Kowsar armed with anything....

you see only Pylon 3-4-5 can carry that weight and those pylon are the ones that have plumbing for fuel tanks so its either missile or extra fuel for F-5 or Kowsar by the way pylon 1-2-6-7 only can carry light missiles
look at this picture and you see the difference in size on what those pylon can carry

for example those pylon 1-7 can only carry small short range heat seeking missiles or rockets

 

[skyshadow]

Radar used to upgrade F-4 and Kowsar are very similar,one used for Kowsar is probably smaller and considering that I saw MFDs and radar on F-4 I know for sure that they can integrate Fakour and PL-12 or any other modern missile,new multipurpose radars are digital and there is no limits in terms of integration.From F-4 MFD I saw it is clear what capability radar have but unfortunately I think Kowsar would be limited to only one such heavy missile to carry under fuselage but that would mean it had to fly without external fuel tank...I didn't check,but I'm not sure can F-5 carry 500kg under wings....Total payload of F-5 is not issue,but I don't know max weight it can carry on wings...Any way, when it comes to new radar,they can integrate any missile...that is why only modernized F-4 carry anti-ship missile...like noor or qadr,these missile have similar guidance as active guided a2a missiles,active radar + mid curse correction/ins but aircraft needs multipurpose radar like we saw on upgraded F-4 and Kowsar...So,they can put one Fakour under fuselage but range would be restricted to Kowsar radar range+active seeker on missile...I'm not sure is one long range missile worth to produce adapter and external fuel tank...It is more effective to just add 2 F-14 to fly in same formation...So yes it looks like impossible for someone who doesn't know anything about...Reason why F-14 was only capable fire aim54 in that time was because F-14 was only aircraft with sami-digital radar and what AWG-9 gives capability to simultaneously fire to 6 targets is RWR/RWS ,today every multipurpose radar(including one we saw on F-4)is capable for different mode of operations, that is why we can see RWR,CV,T-Pulse ..etc in MFD of F4...and that is why these radars are multipurpose... With standardized signal processing...there are no limits...that is why you can see 3th of khordar fire Sayyad missile...and that is why old air defense systems are digitalized...for easy integration, better resistance, multi channels
I checked F-5 wing payload ,it is 650kg/sq meter so it has sufficient payload to carry 2 Fakour 90 on wings + more weapons or fuel and just because there is no picture it doesn't mean anything, we didn't see picture of Kowsar armed with anything....But there would be more effective to add PL-12...we will see,truth is Iran has F-14,MiG29,F-4,F-1 and Kowsar would be more effective for R-73,short range interception and for CAS missions

 

[Mithridates]

The original picture you gave of Kosar you can clearly see the interior is worn, the metal is more fatigued/worn, and paint along the console is chipped and faded.

How can a “brand new” cockpit have that happen?

And that propaganda video is nice and all, but straight from Iran’s mouth via news releases is that 15 kosar will be built in next 3 or so years. Yet that propaganda video shows at least 7 in an So called “assembly line”.

So something about this program doesn’t add up.

https://www.tehrantimes.com/news/431501/Iran-Air-Force-to-receive-15-Kowsar-fighter-jets

i found something from f-35 regarding the issue you said

brigader general zare nedjad that in a historical event hit an iraqi mig-25 foxbat over urmia lake with his 20 mm cannons after his both AIM-9 sidewinders failed. mig-25s were most sophisticated soviet planes and in iraqi fleet and f-5 was the simplest light fighter in IRIAF inventory. according BG zare nedjad after he hit the foxbat with a burst of several rounds the aggressor plane started to flaming so he approached it and sided with it and signed the iraqi pilot to eject but he refused and crashed in iraqi soil and died.
images of mohammad reza zare nedjad: during war and present time.

images recorded by f-5E gunsight of burning mig-25.

 

[Sineva]

i found something from f-35 regarding the issue you said
View attachment 564784

Now THAT is one really SH!TTY paint job,I `d want my money back[LOL!]