IRGC missile attack on ISIS in Deir ez-Zor Syria

[Cell_DbZ]

Assad and Russia did nothing against ISIS until 2017. Once ISIS became weak because of US strikes, SDF and Turkey, Assad and Russia came in and started collecting territories.

I agree that ISIS might not always have been the main focus of the Russians, but they did fight them (Palmyra, Aleppo,...) Russia also has been heavily fighting Al-Nursa (Al-Qaeda).
To say that they weren't always focusing on ISIS is one thing, but to say that they haven't been fighting ISIS (or even worse, supporting them) is completely untrue and very biased. Media at home have often reported Russian fights against ISIS in my country.
I really hate to break it to you, but every country has it's own interests, Usa wants a foothold in Syria via Kurds and 'moderate' SDF, Turkey is heaviliy fighting the Kurds and wants to prevent a Kurdish state at all costs and Assad wants survival, in this regard, the SDF is the biggest threat to him.

What is Israel's contribution in the fight against ISIS/Al-Qaeda I might ask?

 

[Kastor]

Their contribution is millions in salary payments to them, weapons and free health care. All courtesy of us the U.S. taxpayers.

 

[500]

I agree that ISIS might not always have been the main focus of the Russians, but they did fight them (Palmyra, Aleppo,...) Russia also has been heavily fighting Al-Nursa (Al-Qaeda).

All Assad and Russia did prior 2017 is taking small desert town of Palmyra (looting and ethnically cleaning all its civilians) and then giving it back to ISIS.

In Aleppo Russia provided close air support to ISIS when they attacked rebels.

Only in spring 2017 when ISIS became collapsing all over Assad forces started collecting its territories (again ethnically cleansing civilians).

What is Israel's contribution in the fight against ISIS/Al-Qaeda I might ask?

Israel is not involved in civil war in Syria. Half of the world is bombing there, we should stay away from that mess.

Israel is making strikes against ISIS in Sinai however. Also Israel arrests ISIS cells in Israel itself. Also we provide intelligence against ISIS.

 

[Cell_DbZ]

All Assad and Russia did prior 2017 is taking small desert town of Palmyra (looting and ethnically cleaning all its civilians) and then giving it back to ISIS.

Lol, Isis had a big presence in Aleppo, not anymore and that's not thanks to the 'moderate' FSA (in reality led by Al-Nursa and other Salafists). Assad is a bastard, but the FSA is not a hair better.
I really recommend you watch these videos:

In Aleppo Russia provided close air support to ISIS when they attacked rebels.

Yeah, sure. Israel has been paying, supporting and bombing Assad to help ISIS, right? Usa has done the same thing, right?
I am afraid you have to prove that Russia support ISIS and no, Al-Jazeera or Ynet news is not a reliable source.

Israel is making strikes against ISIS in Sinai however. Also Israel arrests ISIS cells in Israel itself. Also we provide intelligence against ISIS.

Wow, thank you for the massive contribution you have given, also thanks for pointing that out, because I never knew.
I find the Israel-ISIS relation very weard indeed, Israel is more interested in bombing Assad than bombing ISIS.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...-defense-minister-moshe-ya-alon-a7700616.html

 

[PeeD]

I don't expect the Israelis to have such low skills to mistake the booster stage of the Zolfaghar for the real missile.

There is a chance that an officer leaked information about the booster landing in Iraq after he saw that the (super-) green pine radar failed to detect the re-entry glide vehicle. Well possible that the leak source was not part of the knowledgeable intelligence assessment group able to interpret such things. Possible that this was done on purpose to create a safe atmosphere for the Israeli public.

There is another thing:

Its much interpretation to know which building was intended to be hit, based on this we can calculate the CEP (the distance to the target in which 50% of the missiles would impact).

Based on this interpreted targets, western sources have calculated a distance of 50m and 150m for the two attacks shown.
CEP is a statistic method but with some tolerance we can say that the CEP of the missiles were about 50m and 150m.

Now comes the question why two attacks were shown and I have a interesting answer to that:
The IRGC-ASF wanted to show the enemies analysts the accuracy of the Zolfaghar and the Qiam with one example each.

The 50m CEP missile is certainly a Zolfaghar with its glide RV coming at a shallow angle.

The 150m CEP missile however is coming at a steep angle, almost vertically and with higher speed. It does not look like the Zolfaghar attack, but would be a ideal example for the 800km range Qiam. Btw, there is no doubt that at least one Qiam was launched too.

Both CEPs are consistent with what was previously estimated for those missiles:
A 50m CEP requires an aerodynamic terminal steering system and is generally the minimum CEP deemed possible by western and eastern state of the art for ballistic missiles without terminal guidance. Its just Iranians and Russians (Iskander-M) which have claimed CEPs below this and this is almost certainly for active terminal guided missiles.

So Irans demonstration for the capabilities of the Zolfaghar was a good one and can be considered whats feasible with current state of the art. An operational demonstration of such a accuracy was never before displayed in world history.

For the Qiam, the results look less impressive: The presumed target remained undamaged. Hence a 50m CEP is the upper limit for a warhead of 500-750kg. At 150m CEP such a warhead is not sufficient anymore for single shot assured destruction.
However, I'm quite sure the IRGC-ASF just wanted to display the CEP of the Qiam by using a single HE warhead. I expect most Qiams in the arsenal to have submunition warheads. The Qiam has no aerodynamic terminal steering system like the Zolfaghar and for such missiles a CEP of 150m is really the minimum. So if the IRGC-ASF would not have had the aim of displaying the CEPs of both missiles to the enemies, at least the Qiam would have used a submunition warhead for such a attack task.

It's well possible that all Zolfaghars had unitary HE warhead because the destructive power against non-hardened targets with a ~600kg warhead and a 50m CEP is deemed sufficient. But if 4 Zolfaghars were launched and two Qiams, the second Qiam (not the one for CEP demonstration) could have used a submunition warhead for better operational effectiveness.

 

[500]

Lol, Isis had a big presence in Aleppo, not anymore and that's not thanks to the 'moderate' FSA (in reality led by Al-Nursa and other Salafists).

ISIS was kicked from Aleppo by SDF and Turkey. Assadists collected deserted areas after ISIS was weakened.

Assad and Russia provided close air support to ISIS in Aleppo, when they attacked Marea town for example.

Yeah, sure. Israel has been paying, supporting and bombing Assad to help ISIS, right? Usa has done the same thing, right?
I am afraid you have to prove that Russia support ISIS and no, Al-Jazeera or Ynet news is not a reliable source.

Assad and ISIS are two sides of same shitty coin. Both belong to Baath party. Assad attacked rebels when they fought ISIS.

 

[yavar]

 

[Cell_DbZ]

Assad and Russia provided close air support to ISIS in Aleppo, when they attacked Marea town for example.

I haven't been able to find any proof that Russia supported ISIS in Marea, they were aiding Assad (and even the Kurds) in taking several towns, the Russians also have delivered air support for the Turks against ISIS. Since 2015 Russian have been fighting ISIS. So it is safe to say that Russia helping ISIS is bullsh1t.

Assad and ISIS are two sides of same shitty coin. Both belong to Baath party. Assad attacked rebels when they fought ISIS.

Assad is attacking anyone, ISIS and the extremist Jihadi groups you call rebels. The 'moderate' rebels are just as bad as Assad. The rebels have also been attacking Assad when he was fighting Assad.
You say that Assad is taking as much ground as he can, do you honestly think the rebels aren't doing the same?

While I have not been able to find much about Russia supporting ISIS, I have been able to find reports of Israel supporting or at least turning a blind eye to ISIS. I am not saying these report are true.
The point I am making is that there are more report of Israel supporting ISIS/Al-Nursa than there are reports of Russia doing the same. You seem to believe that Russia does support ISIS, but when Israel gets (perhaps falsely) accused, it is somehow not okay.
Here are some reports of Israel supporting ISIS/extremists. It is up to you to rate the trustworthyness.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...-defense-minister-moshe-ya-alon-a7700616.html
https://theinternationalreporter.org/2017/04/29/alliance-of-convenience-why-israel-supports-isis/

I have asked you for proof for Russian support to ISIS, you didn't give much.

 

[500]

I haven't been able to find any proof that Russia supported ISIS in Marea, they were aiding Assad (and even the Kurds) in taking several towns, the Russians also have delivered air support for the Turks against ISIS. Since 2015 Russian have been fighting ISIS. So it is safe to say that Russia helping ISIS is bullsh1t.

When ISIS attacked Marea Russians bombed Marea. What other proof do u need? Fortunately their air support is incompetent AF so they failed.

Assad is attacking anyone, ISIS and the extremist Jihadi groups you call rebels. The 'moderate' rebels are just as bad as Assad. The rebels have also been attacking Assad when he was fighting Assad.
You say that Assad is taking as much ground as he can, do you honestly think the rebels aren't doing the same?

Assad did virtually nothing against ISIS until 2017. Thats fact. But unleashed hell fire on rebels.

 

[Cell_DbZ]

When ISIS attacked Marea Russians bombed Marea. What other proof do u need? Fortunately their air support is incompetent AF so they failed.

Haven't found proof of that. Russia supporting ISIS is bullsh1t. If you feel better, keep telling yourself that.

Assad did virtually nothing against ISIS until 2017. Thats fact. But unleashed hell fire on rebels.

Assad indeed focused more on the rebels, because they were a bigger threat the rebels focused more on Assad than on ISIS.

I am afraid you're the one who has to give proof, it's easy to accuse and then not back it up. I haven't found anything of Russia 'helping' ISIS.

I have shown Israel 'supporting' ISIS, I even gave some sources, what do you have to say about that?

 

[VEVAK]

When ISIS attacked Marea Russians bombed Marea. What other proof do u need? Fortunately their air support is incompetent AF so they failed.


Assad did virtually nothing against ISIS until 2017. Thats fact. But unleashed hell fire on rebels.

How delusional do you have to be to believe that????

If there was a single shred of proof that Assad supported ISIS then Iran would have completely pulled off it's support for Assad!

FACTS are FACTS!

In Iraq when Iranian backed PMU forces had ISIS on the run towards Mosel an entire American trained Iraqi Brigade instead of calling in Air Strikes and Artillery strikes and trapping them between 2 forces before they got close to the city choose to pack up and run! WHY? Because they were ordered to do so because their top commander was clearly getting his orders from somewhere else other than Baghdad!

Iraq's own prime minister states that if it wasn't for IRAN's support, ISIS would have taken control of Iraq!

And now you want people to believe that Assad was helping ISIS! Only a delusional person would believe such absurd statements!

And there are plenty of video's of Russia Air Force taking out ISIS columns and oil trucks and facilities!

And the Russian Air Force could easily demolish the entire Israeli Air Force in a single day if they wanted too!

 

[500]

Haven't found proof of that. Russia supporting ISIS is bullsh1t. If you feel better, keep telling yourself that.

Here example Russia cluster bomb dropped on Rebels in Marea area:

That happened in same time when they were attacked by ISIS. Such bombings happened regularly.

Right now while rebels are fighting ISIS in Daraa, Assad is bombing only rebels and never ISIS.

Assad indeed focused more on the rebels, because they were a bigger threat the rebels focused more on Assad than on ISIS.

I am afraid you're the one who has to give proof, it's easy to accuse and then not back it up. I haven't found anything of Russia 'helping' ISIS.

Assad did virtually nothing against ISIS till 2017. Only when ISIS was weakened by US, SDF and Turks he started grab their land.

I have shown Israel 'supporting' ISIS, I even gave some sources, what do you have to say about that?

U showed nothing. There is ZERO evidence of any Israel support to ISIS.

Iraq's own prime minister states that if it wasn't for IRAN's support, ISIS would have taken control of Iraq!

What do u expect from Iran's stooge?

And now you want people to believe that Assad was helping ISIS! Only a delusional person would believe such absurd statements!

Rebels are a threat to Assad regime, ISIS is not, because ISIS will be never recognized by anyone.

And there are plenty of video's of Russia Air Force taking out ISIS columns and oil trucks and facilities!

Most of videos where Russia claim the bomb ISIS are actually against rebels. or some empty ground.

And the Russian Air Force could easily demolish the entire Israeli Air Force in a single day if they wanted too!

LOL no. Russian air force is outdated and does not have experience in air combat.

 

[Cell_DbZ]

Here example Russia cluster bomb dropped on Rebels in Marea area:



That happened in same time when they were attacked by ISIS. Such bombings happened regularly.

Right now while rebels are fighting ISIS in Daraa, Assad is bombing only rebels and never ISIS.

The 'rebels' were not only fighting ISIS, they were fighting Assad too. Those bombs were never meant to 'help' ISIS. The only thing you have proven is that Russia happened to bomb at the same time ISIS was fighting the rebels and Assad, Russia in this case was aiding Assad against the rebels, they were not aiding ISIS. In fact the main goal of the 'rebels' is not to fight ISIS, but Assad, hence it is called a civil war.
The rebels have been assaulting Assad too, without ISIS presence. Keep in mind , the rebels are dominated by Jihadi/salafist groups, they are not much better than ISIS.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_Idlib_offensive

The rebels were the ones starting the Daraa offensive in 2017.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daraa_offensive_(February–June_2017)
Then Assad striked back.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daraa_offensive_(June_2017)

Can I ask who is fighting ISIS in Deir-ez-Zor? Or is it also a 'little town'?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deir_ez-Zor_offensive_(January_2016)
But hey if it keeps you asleep at night by accusing Russia of supporting ISIS, feel free to do just that.

Assad did virtually nothing against ISIS till 2017. Only when ISIS was weakened by US, SDF and Turks he started grab their land.

here are some examples of Russia (and Assad) fighting ISIS before 2017:
https://www.rferl.org/a/syria-russia-air-strikes-target-al-bab-turkey/28205470.html
http://en.reseauinternational.net/r...om-sub-in-mediterranean-for-first-time-video/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/East_Aleppo_offensive_(2015–16)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homs_offensive_(November–December_2015)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palmyra_offensive_(March_2016)
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/russia-kills-150-isis-fighters-8650767

I stand by it, Russia supporting ISIS is absolute bullsh1t.

'Their' land? As much I hate to say it to you, Assad is the most legitimate entity in Syria, not the salafist rebels or the Kurds.
You say Assad is beign a monster to innocent people, so are the 'rebels', so is PKK,YPG.

U showed nothing. There is ZERO evidence of any Israel support to ISIS

I'm not saying that Israel, Usa or the west is supporting ISIS, I am not going to stoop that low. But there are some shady reports about Israel/ISIS relations, however. Perhaps you have missed the links I have cited earlier? You be the judge, the point I was making is that there are more reports of Israel supporting ISIS than Russia supporting ISIS.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...-defense-minister-moshe-ya-alon-a7700616.html
https://theinternationalreporter.org/2017/04/29/alliance-of-convenience-why-israel-supports-isis/

This is also suspicious (this is from Sputnik news, so I question the truthfulness a little)
https://sputniknews.com/middleeast/201706251054964212-syria-israel-attack-golan-heights/

 

[Parsipride]

The 'rebels' were not only fighting ISIS, they were fighting Assad too. Those bombs were never meant to 'help' ISIS. The only thing you have proven is that Russia happened to bomb at the same time ISIS was fighting the rebels and Assad, Russia in this case was aiding Assad against the rebels, they were not aiding ISIS. In fact the main goal of the 'rebels' is not to fight ISIS, but Assad, hence it is called a civil war.
The rebels have been assaulting Assad too, without ISIS presence. Keep in mind , the rebels are dominated by Jihadi/salafist groups, they are not much better than ISIS.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_Idlib_offensive

The rebels were the ones starting the Daraa offensive in 2017.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daraa_offensive_(February–June_2017)
Then Assad striked back.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daraa_offensive_(June_2017)

Can I ask who is fighting ISIS in Deir-ez-Zor? Or is it also a 'little town'?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deir_ez-Zor_offensive_(January_2016)
But hey if it keeps you asleep at night by accusing Russia of supporting ISIS, feel free to do just that.

here are some examples of Russia (and Assad) fighting ISIS before 2017:
https://www.rferl.org/a/syria-russia-air-strikes-target-al-bab-turkey/28205470.html
http://en.reseauinternational.net/r...om-sub-in-mediterranean-for-first-time-video/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/East_Aleppo_offensive_(2015–16)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homs_offensive_(November–December_2015)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palmyra_offensive_(March_2016)
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/russia-kills-150-isis-fighters-8650767

I stand by it, Russia supporting ISIS is absolute bullsh1t.

'Their' land? As much I hate to say it to you, Assad is the most legitimate entity in Syria, not the salafist rebels or the Kurds.
You say Assad is beign a monster to innocent people, so are the 'rebels', so is PKK,YPG.


I'm not saying that Israel, Usa or the west is supporting ISIS, I am not going to stoop that low. But there are some shady reports about Israel/ISIS relations, however. Perhaps you have missed the links I have cited earlier? You be the judge, the point I was making is that there are more reports of Israel supporting ISIS than Russia supporting ISIS.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...-defense-minister-moshe-ya-alon-a7700616.html
https://theinternationalreporter.org/2017/04/29/alliance-of-convenience-why-israel-supports-isis/

This is also suspicious (this is from Sputnik news, so I question the truthfulness a little)
https://sputniknews.com/middleeast/201706251054964212-syria-israel-attack-golan-heights/

You are spamming this thread with nonsense that is not related to the main topic of discussion .

Will one of the moderators delete this individuals posts and direct his views to the proper area for discussion.

 

[Cell_DbZ]

You are spamming this thread with nonsense that is not related to the main topic of discussion .

Will one of the moderators delete this individuals posts and direct his views to the proper area for discussion.

I am not the one accusing Russia of supporting ISIS, but I shall stop the debate.