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Iranian Chill Thread

Iran is in the midst of a major economic war. Cut off from the financial system. Cut off from foreign reserves. Oil tankers being attacked by Israel or seized by US or it’s puppets. Is this not a major war? This was not even happening in 1980.

Kinetic violence and economic sanctions are two different beasts. The appropriate answer to economic warfare almost never consists of military action.

And the reason they are resorting to economic warfare is precisely because they don't deem the military option to be affordable. Sanctions and actual war are on different levels.

And the war in 1980 was with Saddam not America in Lebanon/Saudi Arabia/etc

Saddam was the west's (and Soviet bloc's) proxy against Iran. If Iran resolved to strike them in Lebanon, it's precisely because of how massively they were supporting Iraq in the war.

Again missing the overarching point to stick to literal counterpoints. The factions in Iran have a lot more to “lose” financially then back in 1980. And 5th column would love for Iran to sit back and do nothing.

That some in the establishment have enriched themselves doesn't prove that the Islamic Republic's retaliation has been or will be softer.

Furthermore this accumulation of material wealth doesn't concern the IRGC brass nor the Leadership. And when it comes to most pressing issues of national security, it's the latter who get to decide, not the liberal fifth column.

You can be kinetically risk averse and still be anti America world order.

Powers-to-be will seek to destroy anyone brave enough to try and oppose the zio-American order. There's no riskier endeavour than this in contemporary politics.

agree with first half of your statement. Disagree with second half. What would you suggest in the face of ever increasing assassinations and sabotage on Iranian soil?

These actions aren't ever increasing, they're periodical. As long as they do not pose an actual threat to Iran's geopolitical standing and domestic stability, the proper answer consists in expanding the civilian nuclear program, cementing regional alliances, improving armament of partners in the Resistance Axis, maintaining military outposts in the vicinity of Occupied Palestine, as well as procuring ever increasing stockpiles of weaponry capable of striking the enemy.

The issue is “due” time is starting to look like “never”. Which again is “fine”. Just don’t announce it anymore.

Not really. When Iran obliterated the Mossad compound in northern Iraq, it didn't happen right on the next day of an assassination either.

Secondly, Suicides in military is nothing new. Just Google how many Suicides happened on a single US military base and a single US navy ship. It’s astounding how many are happening. Did Iran do these as well?

Except that the person in question was a military intelligence officer much like shahid Khodayari (considering that the mission of the Qods Force partly falls under military intelligence), that the timing may hint to Iranian retaliation and that given its population size, the zionist entity is far from recording daily cases of suicide within its armed forces.

We're not exactly talking about a country the size of the USA nor even about armed forces comparable in manpower to the US military. In fact in 2020, a mere 9 individuals took their own lives in the ranks of the zionist army.


I believe they said they would strike to prevent Iranian entrenchment. They have largely adhered to that and then some (moved into Iraq and Iran).

Wether they accomplish their goals (unlikely) is another story.

Zionists suggested they wouldn't allow Iran to entrench herself on Syrian territory and that they would do what's necessary to prevent it.

They failed miserably and their attempts have actually backfired since they've had the opposite effect of what they intended to achieve.
 
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Iran Hanged 26 People In 10 Days To Create Fear, Rights Group Says​




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More and more of these videos are surfacing everyday. Ukrainian conscripts complaining about minimal training, being given machine guns and sent to the front to fight tanks, artillery, jets. They claim that they were completely surrounded and therefore retreated, now they're being charged with desertion.


This is what the poor Ukranian conscripts with machine guns are up against. That artillery is awesome.

 
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Learn from us and keep your tired whiny ways to yourself and present viable solutions
Your solution is to just ignore the deaths as if those people were nothing.

While Stryker1982 opined Iran is desperate to have the JCPOA reinstated.
I'd prefer nuclear missiles, but it does not look like they want to do that,
 
The video on this site shows foreign mercenaries in Ukraine, coming out of a forest and launching an NLAW at what looks like a BTR type vehicle. During the video you can hear one of the combatants calling out to his comrade, saying "Brian" in an American accent. You can also hear some of the fighters speak in British accents.

An article recently published in the Telegraph describes how this group of American and British fighters had to flee when they got into a heated firefight. One of them seems to have stepped on a mine and consequently had his leg blown off.

They describe the fighting as "scary" and "the worst fighting I have ever experienced" Some of these men are veterans of Afghanistan and other conflicts. It appears that these guys are used to having every conceivable advantage on their side, including air support, artillery, drones, tanks, etc. However when they have to fight on an even playing field, they whine and complain more than anything.

Recently a Canadian sniper named Wally, also a veteran of Afghanistan, also made his way to Ukraine. However he left after a tank shell almost hit his position and the only shot he took was at the window of an empty house. He complained about a lack of weapons and air, artillery support.

This seems to be a common trend among western trained soldiers. They're used to having air support and artillery completely annihilate the enemy before going into battle and mopping up the remains. However when they have to fight against the odds, they simply give up and fold. So much for the stereotypical Hollywood image of the glorious American / western soldier

 
Your solution is to just ignore the deaths as if those people were nothing.


I'd prefer nuclear missiles, but it does not look like they want to do that,
My solution is to deeply understand the ramifications of these and attempt to present solutions rather than whining and throwing a tantrum like a child. So loosen up your pants and present options.
 
I'd prefer nuclear missiles, but it does not look like they want to do that,

I prefer preferences based off correct assessments of the ground reality, in particular with regards to Iran's stance and policies.
 
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The video on this site shows foreign mercenaries in Ukraine, coming out of a forest and launching an NLAW at what looks like a BTR type vehicle. During the video you can hear one of the combatants calling out to his comrade, saying "Brian" in an American accent. You can also hear some of the fighters speak in British accents.

An article recently published in the Telegraph describes how this group of American and British fighters had to flee when they got into a heated firefight. One of them seems to have stepped on a mine and consequently had his leg blown off.

They describe the fighting as "scary" and "the worst fighting I have ever experienced" Some of these men are veterans of Afghanistan and other conflicts. It appears that these guys are used to having every conceivable advantage on their side, including air support, artillery, drones, tanks, etc. However when they have to fight on an even playing field, they whine and complain more than anything.

Recently a Canadian sniper named Wally, also a veteran of Afghanistan, also made his way to Ukraine. However he left after a tank shell almost hit his position and the only shot he took was at the window of an empty house. He complained about a lack of weapons and air, artillery support.

This seems to be a common trend among western trained soldiers. They're used to having air support and artillery completely annihilate the enemy before going into battle and mopping up the remains. However when they have to fight against the odds, they simply give up and fold. So much for the stereotypical Hollywood image of the glorious American / western soldier

There’s truth to that and a great luxury to have if it can be sustained (unlikely). Note also the ‘combat training’ Israel gets fighting women and children.
 
Your solution is to just ignore the deaths as if those people were nothing.

Well actually, by your own logic this contention could just as well be directed at the previous statement of yours. Let me explain.

During the 1980's, the zio-Americans through their proxy Saddam martyred no less than 280.000 Iranians. Plus some 12.000 to 15.000 martyred in terrorist attacks by western-sponsored grouplets on Iranian soil. That's a total of nearly 300.000.

In response, how many of their forces were killed in operations credibly attributed to pro-Iranian fighters? 241 US Marines as well as 58 French troops at the Beirut barracks in 1983, and some 500 zionist occupation forces in south Lebanon (a total of 1050 zionist occupiers were eliminated from 1982 to 1999 according to Hezbollah). Add to it a number of individual cases, such as the CIA's regional station chief. In other words, the ratio is of about 850 to 300.000.

Now let's have a look at the contemporary period since 2000. According to US officials, local Iranian-backed Resistance forces killed over 600 G.I.'s after the 2003 invasion of Iraq. In 2006, 121 zionist military personnel perished against Hezbollah in merely one month of war waged on Lebanon (this is an official figure provided by the zionists and could thus be minimized but let's go by it for the sake of the argument). Not to mention dozens if not hundreds of Americans troops put to death in Afghanistan by Iranian-supplied elements of the Taleban from 2001 to 2021; again let's take a minimal figure, say only a hundred. In the meantime, the zionist and US regimes directly or indirectly caused the martyrdom of maybe 2500 Iranians advisers in Syria, and no more than a few dozen or a couple hundred in Iraq. Sabotage and assassinations in Iran killed less than 50 or so, less than 220 if we consider that the enemy had a hand in the downing of the Ukrainian airliner over Tehran. Total of the past 21 years, therefore: around 820 to 3000.

In other terms, if we base ourselves on "how many of were killed", the fact is that Islamic Iran's ratio against the US and Isra"el"i regimes has been a staggering hundred times more favorable in the 2000's than it used to be in the 1980's.

Conclusion: relative to casualties and material damage incurred, today Iran is retaliating against the US and the zionists much more forcefully than during the 1980's. So if we're going to imagine Iran is "ignoring" her martyrs today, then we would have to believe Iran was doing so to a far greater extent in the 1980's, considering the ratios cited above.

However, truth is that geopolitics is not a schoolyard brawl. And kill ratios onto themselves are irrelevant from a geopolitical perspective, what counts is the strategic outcome, where Iran has constantly stood her ground whether in the first decade of the Revolution or more recent ones.
 
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Well actually, by your own logic this contention could just as well be directed at the previous statement of yours. Let me explain.

During the 1980's, the zio-Americans through their proxy Saddam martyred no less than 280.000 Iranians. Plus some 12.000 to 15.000 martyred in terrorist attacks by western-sponsored grouplets on Iranian soil. That's a total of nearly 300.000.

In response, how many of their forces were killed in operations credibly attributed to pro-Iranian fighters? 241 US Marines as well as 58 French troops at the Beirut barracks in 1983, and some 500 zionist occupation forces in south Lebanon (a total of 1050 zionist occupiers were eliminated from 1982 to 1999 according to Hezbollah). Add to it a number of individual cases, such as the CIA's regional station chief. In other words, the ratio is of about 850 to 300.000.

Now let's have a look at the contemporary period since 2000. According to US officials, local Iranian-backed Resistance forces killed over 600 G.I.'s after the 2003 invasion of Iraq. In 2006, 121 zionist military personnel perished against Hezbollah in merely one month of war waged on Lebanon (this is an official figure provided by the zionists and could thus be minimized but let's go by it for the sake of the argument). Not to mention dozens if not hundreds of Americans troops put to death in Afghanistan by Iranian-supplied elements of the Taleban from 2001 to 2021; again let's take a minimal figure, say only a hundred. In the meantime, the zionist and US regimes directly or indirectly caused the martyrdom of maybe 2500 Iranians advisers in Syria, and no more than a few dozen or a couple hundred in Iraq. Sabotage and assassinations in Iran killed less than 50 or so, less than 220 if we consider that the enemy had a hand in the downing of the Ukrainian airliner over Tehran. Total of the past 21 years, therefore: around 820 to 3000.

In other terms, if we base ourselves on "how many of were killed", the fact is that Islamic Iran's ratio against the US and Isra"el"i regimes has been a staggering hundred times more favorable in the 2000's than it used to be in the 1980's.

Conclusion: relative to casualties and material damage incurred, today Iran is retaliating against the US and the zionists much more forcefully than during the 1980's. So if we're going to imagine Iran is "ignoring" her martyrs today, then we would have to believe Iran was doing so to a far greater extent in the 1980's, considering the ratios cited above.

However, truth is that geopolitics is not a schoolyard brawl. And kill ratios onto themselves are irrelevant from a geopolitical perspective, what counts is the strategic outcome, where Iran has constantly stood her ground whether in the first decade of the Revolution or more recent ones.

The issue here is you decide to take war deaths and attribute them ALL to Israel/US and mix it in with calendestine operations that Iran did against the US. Even though during the war both US and Israel supplied Iran with weapons. That’s a perfect way of producing misleading data.

Saddam invaded Iran on his own accord. Nobody pushed him or forced him. Disputes over the oil region were there under the Shah as well except Saddam knew he couldn’t compete toe to toe with that military. He sensed an opportunity to take advantage of Iran’s revolutionary upheaval and purging of armed forces and do a blitzkrieg.

Iran had largely pushed Iraq back to its borders in the beginning of the war and Saddam was ready to accept a ceasefire and original borders. Then Iran decided it was going to take Karbala and push the war deep into Iraq. That is when Arabs/US/NATO stepped up arms to Iraq to prevent Iran from controlling southern Iraq and potentially a Shiite revolutionary wave with its 10M man basij army.

So again many of those deaths could be attributed to Iran for extending the war past the initial goal which was recovering all Iranian land lost to Iraq and return of Iran’s territorial integrity. Hindsight is 20/20 but the decision to extend the war greatly lead to extensive casualties on both sides as it became a war of attrition.

There are many valid options available to Iran to punish Israel short of raining missiles on Israeli cities. But the IRGC and Hardline factions want higher retribution costs while the politicians want to be pragmatic.

No right or wrong answer here. Time will tell.

But at some point a “brown” life needs to be worth just as much as a “white” life. Even a “Russian” life isn’t worth as much as a European (NATO) life right now. Again Russia also failed at the escalatory deterrence ladder long ago.
 
The issue here is you decide to take war deaths and attribute them ALL to Israel/US and mix it in with calendestine operations that Iran did against the US. Even though during the war both US and Israel supplied Iran with weapons. That’s a perfect way of producing misleading data.

The US and zionists used Saddam as a proxy against Iran, not just that but they empowered him to be actually capable of waging war for 8 years against Iran, hence they're as guilty as the latter of the destruction and deaths suffered by Iran.

Iranian operations against the US, France etc were a reaction to this very fact. Denying it would be akin to missing out on Iran's own rationale.

As for weapons supplies to Iran:

1) As often mentioned already, it was not a deliberate, proactive choice by the US regime. Iran literally coerced Washington into this deal by escalating in Lebanon.
2) The zionist regime had no dealings with Iran in this regard. In one instance, when Iran noticed that some of the American weapons were being sourced from old zionist stocks, she instantly interrupted the transaction.

Saddam invaded Iran on his own accord. Nobody pushed him or forced him. Disputes over the oil region were there under the Shah as well except Saddam knew he couldn’t compete toe to toe with that military. He sensed an opportunity to take advantage of Iran’s revolutionary upheaval and purging of armed forces and do a blitzkrieg.

Saddam was encouraged to invade Iran not only because of the revolutionary turmoil prevailing in Iran, but also because he was encouraged to do so by his foreign backers, who assured him of their support. Not unlike the US ambassador to Kuwait who shortly prior to Saddam's invasion of that country in 1990, misled the Iraqi leader by falsely suggesting that Washington wouldn't react if he was to march his troops into Kuwait.

Iran had largely pushed Iraq back to its borders in the beginning of the war and Saddam was ready to accept a ceasefire and original borders. Then Iran decided it was going to take Karbala and push the war deep into Iraq. That is when Arabs/US/NATO stepped up arms to Iraq to prevent Iran from controlling southern Iraq and potentially a Shiite revolutionary wave with its 10M man basij army.
So again many of those deaths could be attributed to Iran for extending the war past the initial goal which was recovering all Iranian land lost to Iraq and return of Iran’s territorial integrity. Hindsight is 20/20 but the decision to extend the war greatly lead to extensive casualties on both sides as it became a war of attrition.

This statement is actually rehashing the western and PGCC narrative on the Imposed War.

The truth is that Iraq never offered Iran acceptable ceasefire terms. Namely, Saddam refused to recognize his responsibility in launching the war and several other such issues. Also, history proved what the Iraqi regime's word was worth: only six days after Iran accepted the UN-sponsored ceasefire in 1988, Iraq attacked Iran a second time via the MKO, with direct backing from the Iraqi air force. This was a war weary Iraq. In 1982, chances are that Saddam would have used any hypothetical ceasefire to regroup, rearm and have his actual military invade Iranian territory again.

And yes, both eastern and western support for Saddam began as early as 1980. It was stepped up later because Iran had meanwhile reorganized her military and her state institutions had stabilized, so additional backing was needed to keep Iraq afloat.

There are many valid options available to Iran to punish Israel short of raining missiles on Israeli cities. But the IRGC and Hardline factions want higher retribution costs while the politicians want to be pragmatic.

Decisions of such strategic gravity won't be taken by ordinary politicians, especially liberal appeasers.

But at some point a “brown” life needs to be worth just as much as a “white” life. Even a “Russian” life isn’t worth as much as a European (NATO) life right now. Again Russia also failed at the escalatory deterrence ladder long ago.

As I sometimes say, geopolitics is not a schoolyard brawl. Nor is it about kill ratios but about the outcome in the big picture. 27 million Soviets were killed in WW2 versus 6,3 million Germans on the eastern front and yet the Soviet Union came out on top and was victorious. And then, the USSR itself was defeated without having a direct war waged on it.

I showed how Iran has been responding to her enemies with greater strength in the 21st century compared to the 1980's, so nobody should dwell under the wrong impression that Iran has been backing off.
 
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The US and zionists used Saddam as a proxy against Iran, not just that but they empowered him to be actually capable of waging war for 8 years against Iran, hence they're as guilty as the latter of the destruction and deaths suffered by Iran.

Weird take considering most of Saddam’s military was in fact Russian supplied. Russia continued to supply Saddam thru the war and after.

Yet you attribute “0” deaths to Russia. Quite surprising. Like I said misleading data by you used to support your thesis.

Saddam was encouraged to invade Iran not only because of the revolutionary turmoil prevailing in Iran, but also because he was encouraged to do so by his foreign backers, who assured him of their support.

Incorrect. Saddam was thinking purely for his self interest of securing Iran’s most productive oil regions.

Not unlike the US ambassador to Kuwait who shortly prior to Saddam's invasion of that country in 1990, misled the Iraqi leader by falsely suggesting that Washington wouldn't react if he was to march his troops into Kuwait.

Again incorrect, Saddam was angry at Kuwait because they refused to wipe his 5B+ debt he owed them when they gave him funding (alongside Saudi Arabia’s much bigger amount) to continue his war with Iran. Saddam used the debt along with baseless lies of Kuwaiti oil disputes to justify his invasion.

Washington had been moving forces in place for months. Saddam himself ended the negotiations.


This was a war weary Iraq. In 1982, chances are that Saddam would have used any hypothetical ceasefire to regroup, rearm and have his actual military invade Iranian territory again.

No basis, just your conjecture. Violations of ceasefires happen shortly after wars end. Very common. But assuming that Saddam would try to attack again an Iranian army that had raised over 10M volunteers? Zero evidence Backed by zero facts.

Your claim of a War weary Iraq in 1988? Again incorrect. Is that why Iraq invaded Kuwait less than 2 years later? Is that why Saddam had one of the largest standing armies in the world at the end of 1988?

Saddam in no way was war weary in 1988, he began to turn his sights on weaker targets since he failed against Iran and underestimated national resistance.


And yes, both eastern and western support for Saddam began as early as 1980. It was stepped up later because Iran had meanwhile reorganized her military and her state institutions had stabilized, so additional backing was needed to keep Iraq afloat.

Russia was providing the most arms to Iraq and rebuilt their entire military. The PG Arabs bankrolled the war using more than 20B (1980’s dollars) alongside Iraqi own oil revenues. The West provided chemical precursors and intelligence targeting.

Yet despite all this you attribute ALL the deaths in the war to America and zero to Russia or anyone else. Probably because it doesn’t fit the narrative for Russia to be our enemy in current state of politics. We absolve Russia of all their past crimes. Very 1984ish of you.

Even if there wasn’t a war with Iraq, Iran was going to push the US out of the Middle East and Lebanon. That was its message as an anti-Imperial power.

Decisions of such strategic gravity won't be taken by ordinary politicians, especially liberal appeasers.

The SNSC is made up of politicians and Rahbar takes the view of the factions into account to formulate a consensus decision. Whatever IRGC recommends it is still up to the establishment to accept or deny. US military wanted to kill Solemani more than 10 years ago, it was political establishment that denied them.

I showed how Iran has been responding to her enemies with greater strength in the 21st century compared to the 1980's, so nobody should dwell under the wrong impression that Iran has been backing off.

What you showed is a warped view of history to justify your opinion.
 
Weird take considering most of Saddam’s military was in fact Russian supplied. Russia continued to supply Saddam thru the war and after.

1) Iraq used heavy weapons made in France and Brazil as well.
2) Support does not only take the form of weapons supplies. Iraq enjoyed live satellite imagery, supplies of precursors to manufacture chemical weapons, a US veto at the UNSC blocking a resolution meant to condemn Iraqi WMD use, and more courtesy of the west.

This should be common knowledge to Iranians.

_____

Arming Iraq: A Chronology of U.S. Involvement
By: John King, March 2003
https://www.iranchamber.com/history/articles/arming_iraq.php

The Iran-Iraq War: Serving American Interests
By: The Research Unit for Political Economy (R.U.P.E.), Mumbai (Bombay), India

saddam_2.jpg


Yet you attribute “0” deaths to Russia. Quite surprising. Like I said misleading data by you used to support your thesis.

Russia was not a sovereign state on the international stage. The USSR was. However, the Soviet Union wasn't part of the discussion at hand.

Incorrect. Saddam was thinking purely for his self interest of securing Iran’s most productive oil regions.

Doesn't mean he didn't receive assurances of support from his international backers.

Again incorrect, Saddam was angry at Kuwait because they refused to wipe his 5B+ debt he owed them when they gave him funding (alongside Saudi Arabia’s much bigger amount) to continue his war with Iran. Saddam used the debt along with baseless lies of Kuwaiti oil disputes to justify his invasion.

What I indicated does not contradict any of this. Saddam had his motivations, but the American ambassador to Kuwait misled him into believing the US would not react forcefully to an Iraqi occupation of Kuwait. This is a documented occurrence.

Washington had been moving forces in place for months. Saddam himself ended the negotiations.

Here you're mixing two different subjects. The US ambassador to Kuwait, April Glaspie explicitly assured Saddam that the US regime was not seeking to invest itself in his border dispute with Kuwait - a misleading, inaccurate statement. This she told Saddam prior to Iraq's invasion of Kuwait.

In a now famous interview with the Iraqi leader, U.S. Ambassador April Glaspie told Saddam, ‘[W]e have no opinion on the Arab-Arab conflicts, like your border disagreement with Kuwait.’ The U.S. State Department had earlier told Saddam that Washington had ‘no special defense or security commitments to Kuwait.’ The United States may not have intended to give Iraq a green light, but that is effectively what it did.”


US troop buildup in Saudi Arabia and subsequent talks you're referencing took place after the Iraqi invasion of Kuwait.

No basis, just your conjecture. Violations of ceasefires happen shortly after wars end. Very common. But assuming that Saddam would try to attack again an Iranian army that had raised over 10M volunteers? Zero evidence Backed by zero facts.

I cited facts but you skipped them.

1) Iraq attacked Iran a second time merely six days after the 1988 ceasefire which effectively ended the war. Not only did he unleash the MKO, equipped to the teeth with armor and trained by Iraq, but he ordered the Iraqi air force to trespass into Iranian airspace and provide cover to the terrorists in their so-called Foroughe Javedan operation on Iranian soil. Thence Iran was right to doubt Saddam's sincerity whenever he uttered the word "ceasefire".

m-jpg.843508


2) Iraq's 1982 ceasefire proposal was definitely sub-standard, did not conform to international norms and was therefore unacceptable for Iran. Namely, Saddam refused to acknowledge the fact that Iraq had been the aggressor, rejected having to pay reparations, did not agree to a prisoner swap, and if I'm not mistaken even fell short of recognizing the international bilateral border i.e. accepting a return to the Algiers Accord etc.

Your claim of a War weary Iraq in 1988? Again incorrect. Is that why Iraq invaded Kuwait less than 2 years later? Is that why Saddam had one of the largest standing armies in the world at the end of 1988?

Weary of a direct confrontation with an adversary as large and potent as Iran. Thought that would be self-explanatory. Hence why Iraq subscribed to the 1988 UN-brokered ceasefire.

And that in turn was due to Iran fighting them until 1988. In 1982, chances are Saddam had not gotten the lesson yet, and that instead of invading Iran a second time through the MKO like he did in 1988, he would have chosen to do so directly using his own forces. At any rate it was reasonable for Iranian authorities to calculate that he might be tempted by such a move.

Saddam in no way was war weary in 1988, he began to turn his sights on weaker targets since he failed against Iran and underestimated national resistance.

As just explained, this applied to Iraq being weary of continuing the direct large scale war with Iran specifically.

Russia was providing the most arms to Iraq and rebuilt their entire military. The PG Arabs bankrolled the war using more than 20B (1980’s dollars) alongside Iraqi own oil revenues. The West provided chemical precursors and intelligence targeting.

PGCC Arab regimes are western clients and vassals, their involvement was part and parcel of a broader policy of the west against Iran.

The French moreover provided top of the line, non-downgraded Super Etendard and Mirage F-1 fighter jets, as well as actual pilots to fly them on missions against Iran. The US regime entered the war directly on Iraq's side in the Persian Gulf, attacked the Iranian Navy, downed an Iranian civilian airliner.

Yet despite all this you attribute ALL the deaths in the war to America and zero to Russia or anyone else. Probably because it doesn’t fit the narrative for Russia to be our enemy in current state of politics. We absolve Russia of all their past crimes. Very 1984ish of you.

More like because it's unrelated to the contention I was addressing and also because it's quite impossible to attribute precisely quantified, distinct portions of Iranian casualties to each of the two hostile superpowers of the time.

But even if we include the Soviet factor into the analysis, my point will stand. For Iran retaliated against the USSR by backing Afghan Mojahedin fighting Soviet occupation of their land. You may add a couple of thousand of Soviet troops eliminated by Iranian-backed Afghan fighters to the previously determined total of 850. The number would still be vastly inferior to the 300.000 Iranian martyrs, and the obtained ratio would still be unfavorable compared to the 2000-2020 ratio calculated above.

And again, that's sort of proxy warfare is nothing the Iran of the 21st century would be reluctant to engage in because of some alleged risk-aversion.

Even if there wasn’t a war with Iraq, Iran was going to push the US out of the Middle East and Lebanon. That was its message as an anti-Imperial power.

Not using the same means. It's all a matter of adjusting the means to the political context.

And being subjected to direct military aggression systematically leads to radicalization, because it offers political justification both domestically and internationally for more drastic counter-measures.

The SNSC is made up of politicians and Rahbar takes the view of the factions into account to formulate a consensus decision. Whatever IRGC recommends it is still up to the establishment to accept or deny. US military wanted to kill Solemani more than 10 years ago, it was political establishment that denied them.

Random political factions do not get to decide on topics of extraordinary relevance to national security, including how Iran will respond to the martyrdom of shahid Soleimani. These are not ordinary, everyday matters of national security. A distinction has to be made here.

Liberals can incrementally try to weigh on the implementation of the policy at certain levels. But it won't change much at the end of the day.

Slightly more trivial security matters are another pair of shoes of course.

What you showed is a warped view of history to justify your opinion.

I reminded a number of historic facts and figures.

Whereas some of the assessments I just had to address, are echoing biased western narratives on recent Iranian history. Time to shed them off.
 
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My solution is to deeply understand the ramifications of these
Your solution is to ignore the assassinations and sabatoge like they are nothing as stated by previous posts. This is by your own admission.

My solution was to hit back to impose tit for tat costs.

Reality is that too many top people in Iran and comfortable with their position and wealth and do not want to risk anything. That's why they keep sending their money out of Iran and dropping them in European banks. Contrast with Revolutionary Iran which had nothing to lose and a motivated leadership.

Leadership in Iran don't want to confront Israel directly. Otherwise these deaths would not be occurring. This attack on Parchin would not be occurring. Directing a attack on an Israeli outpost in the Golan is not difficult. They are simply not willing to escalate to re-establish deterrence.

Why? That I guess is up for discussion.
 
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