Iran: Purchase of Russian Su-30 fighters on agenda

[Tokhme khar]

The Su-30 series is a strategic bomber! It can carry up to 15 tons of ordnance and deliver it precisely. With the Irbis E it assumes a mini AWACS role. In the air to air config, it can carry up to 10 air to air missiles. All this while it can loiter for hours and/ or a radius of action of 1500 km's, unrefuelled! The RIO/ weapons system operator is required in addition to the pilot in the front to balance the workload. This capability is somewhat matched only by the F-15E, in case you were wondering, although the Eagle is far less maneuverable and has a higher RCS than any of the Flanker series. The late model Aesa Flankers surpass anything the west has (capability wise), with the sole exception of the Raptor.

I still wonder two seat fighter , its not a strategic bomber that fly several hour . it want to fly at most 1 hour each time and the modern avionic is supposed to do must of the calculation and hard work so why two pilot per plane and not an airplane with one pilot .

 

[Hack-Hook]

The Su-30 series is a strategic bomber! It can carry up to 15 tons of ordnance and deliver it precisely. With the Irbis E it assumes a mini AWACS role. In the air to air config, it can carry up to 10 air to air missiles. All this while it can loiter for hours and/ or a radius of action of 1500 km's, unrefuelled! The RIO/ weapons system operator is required in addition to the pilot in the front to balance the workload. This capability is somewhat matched only by the F-15E, in case you were wondering, although the Eagle is far less maneuverable and has a higher RCS than any of the Flanker series. The late model Aesa Flankers surpass anything the west has (capability wise), with the sole exception of the Raptor.

well yes it can stay for hours but only if you forget about those ordnance and carry fuel tank instead of them.
and Su-35 range is 3600km while Su-30 is 3000 according to WIKI and also has a higher rate of climb also it only can carry 500kg less weapon and thats because it carry alot more fuel and its avionic is far more advanced also i doubt there is any bomb that SU-30 can carry that Su-35 can't use far more effectively and it only had one pilot.

 

[Muhammed45]

I still wonder two seat fighter , its not a strategic bomber that fly several hour . it want to fly at most 1 hour each time and the modern avionic is supposed to do must of the calculation and hard work so why two pilot per plane and not an airplane with one pilot .

When you want to have a bomber - multi role fighter jet, which is supposed to do ground attack operations, you have to choose the two seat version of that fighter jet. Resisting against and dodging of SAMs during ground attacks with two pilots is more successful for sure. In close dog fight i still prefer two seat fighter jets. I guess when Grumman was developing F-14 Tomcats, due to technological problems (Maybe the weaker computers of that time), an other pilot was needed to operate the long-range radar and other missions such as dog fight like a watchdog lol, or controlling the weapons, launching and other secondary missions that could be wasting first pilot's time. And nowadays we don't have second seat in F-22, F-35, Pak-FA and Chinese 5th gen fighters. Which means if you had better computers in your fighter jet, you wouldn't need second seat for second pilot in air-superiority field. It is bitter of truth, Iran cannot think about air superiority against 5th gen fighters as of now. But for ground attacks SU-30sm is still the best for us. Especially sm version has a bit more air superiority compared to others in it's own class, as the English-Russian website claimed

 

[OldTwilight]

well yes it can stay for hours but only if you forget about those ordnance and carry fuel tank instead of them.
and Su-35 range is 3600km while Su-30 is 3000 according to WIKI and also has a higher rate of climb also it only can carry 500kg less weapon and thats because it carry alot more fuel and its avionic is far more advanced also i doubt there is any bomb that SU-30 can carry that Su-35 can't use far more effectively and it only had one pilot.

one of main condition of this imaginary deal is to "license production" in Iran ....
I doubt Russia accept this for Su-35 .... but for Su-30 , they already did that for India ...

 

[Muhammed45]

one of main condition of this imaginary deal is to "license production" in Iran ....
I doubt Russia accept this for Su-35 .... but for Su-30 , they already did that for India ...

In case of Iran, it would be a better/different deal.

We have produced some fighter jets without their technological aid. Indians are using the little information that Russia decided to share in production of Tejas. But we did it before acquiring of a TOT from Russia.

Dehqan says that we can produce some parts locally, no need to Russian technology in those fields.

Iran lacks engine-tech and frame-tech which needs time and investment for years. The engines of SU-30 sm, AL-31 is good for TOT. We can reach a better version of it in 10-15 years R&D which can be at level of Al-41.

Russia has no reason to disagree, imagine if we buy 100 fighter directly from Russian company, assuming, 45 million $ per fighter as of 2018, they can make 4.5 bn $ with a single deal. Only an stupid would refute such a deal.

BTW, it's already signed, and i think that Russian company is acting in accordance with the contract waiting on JCPOA's 5 years self sanctions to end and then publicize it.

 

[Tokhme khar]

FYI, none of the Flanker series carry drop tanks! A typical load out for an Su-30SM on CAP is usually 4 R-73's and up to 4 R-27's. With that loadout, it can easily stay aloft for hrs at cruise on a 1500 km radius. No problems.

On strike/ interdiction missions the Su-30 series has a massive choice of ordnance. Typical quoted figures are that around 4 to 5 tons can be carried out to a 1000 km radius. No problems. Upto 12 tons on short missions, and by short I mean 500km's or so.

Try matching these figures with any other 4+ gen warplane in service today........The upgraded aesa Su-30's are the standard you compare to these days on combat endurance, range, performance, avionics, sensor fit and what not.

A good recent read is here, in case you are interested on the continuing evolution saga of the Flanker:

https://www.ausairpower.net/SP/DT-Rus-Fighter-Evolution-Jun-2008.pdf

well yes it can stay for hours but only if you forget about those ordnance and carry fuel tank instead of them.
and Su-35 range is 3600km while Su-30 is 3000 according to WIKI and also has a higher rate of climb also it only can carry 500kg less weapon and thats because it carry alot more fuel and its avionic is far more advanced also i doubt there is any bomb that SU-30 can carry that Su-35 can't use far more effectively and it only had one pilot.

 

[Hack-Hook]

FYI, none of the Flanker series carry drop tanks! A typical load out for an Su-30SM on CAP is usually 4 R-73's and up to 4 R-27's. With that loadout, it can easily stay aloft for hrs at cruise on a 1500 km radius. No problems.

On strike/ interdiction missions the Su-30 series has a massive choice of ordnance. Typical quoted figures are that around 4 to 5 tons can be carried out to a 1000 km radius. No problems. Upto 12 tons on short missions, and by short I mean 500km's or so.

Try matching these figures with any other 4+ gen warplane in service today........The upgraded aesa Su-30's are the standard you compare to these days on combat endurance, range, performance, avionics, sensor fit and what not.

A good recent read is here, in case you are interested on the continuing evolution saga of the Flanker:

https://www.ausairpower.net/SP/DT-Rus-Fighter-Evolution-Jun-2008.pdf

its from somewhere they compared china Su-35 with India Su-30mki

The similarities between the present Su-30 MKI and the Su-35 are they carry 12 hard-points, besides 8,000 kgs of external ordnance, pulling a maximum of 9G. They have the same air-to-air and air-to-ground weapons package; have thrust vectoring engines and can house external jammers of all varieties and all kinds of pods.

This is where the similarities end and the differences begin. The Su-35 carries maximum internal fuel capacity of 11,500 kgs, while the Su-30 MKI has 9,640 kgs. In terms of operating range, there is a difference of a mere 600 kms: Su-35 with 3,600 kms and Su-30 MKI with 3,000 kms. The max altitude they could climb is 17.3 kms (Su-30 MKI) and 18 kms (Su-35); and max speed (Su-30 MKI) – 1.9 Mach and Su-35 – 2.25 Mach (this is a crucial difference in case of a dog fight on after-burners).

http://www.defenseworld.net/news/14...n_Su_35_nearly_on_par__Indian_Aviation_Expert


and are you sure they don't carry drop tank ? again from Su-35 Wikki
Ferry range: 4,500 km (2,800 mi; 2,430 nmi) with 2 external fuel tanks

also Su-27SMK have external fuel tank
https://www.milavia.net/aircraft/su-27/su-27_variants.htm

and Su-32/27Ib/34 however you like to call it can carry 3 drop tank
https://www.milavia.net/aircraft/su-27/su-27_variants.htm

 

[AmirPatriot]

its from somewhere they compared china Su-35 with India Su-30mki


http://www.defenseworld.net/news/14...n_Su_35_nearly_on_par__Indian_Aviation_Expert


and are you sure they don't carry drop tank ? again from Su-35 Wikki
Ferry range: 4,500 km (2,800 mi; 2,430 nmi) with 2 external fuel tanks

also Su-27SMK have external fuel tank
https://www.milavia.net/aircraft/su-27/su-27_variants.htm

and Su-32/27Ib/34 however you like to call it can carry 3 drop tank
https://www.milavia.net/aircraft/su-27/su-27_variants.htm

To be fair the Flanker series may be capable of carrying drop tanks but with their enormous internal fuel volume they very very very rarely ever use them in combat.

 

[Tokhme khar]

Never seen or heard a Flanker carrying drop tanks. They don't need them. If you have pictures, please share. It would be a revelation......lol

its from somewhere they compared china Su-35 with India Su-30mki


http://www.defenseworld.net/news/14...n_Su_35_nearly_on_par__Indian_Aviation_Expert


and are you sure they don't carry drop tank ? again from Su-35 Wikki
Ferry range: 4,500 km (2,800 mi; 2,430 nmi) with 2 external fuel tanks

also Su-27SMK have external fuel tank
https://www.milavia.net/aircraft/su-27/su-27_variants.htm

and Su-32/27Ib/34 however you like to call it can carry 3 drop tank
https://www.milavia.net/aircraft/su-27/su-27_variants.htm

 

[Hack-Hook]

Never seen or heard a Flanker carrying drop tanks. They don't need them. If you have pictures, please share. It would be a revelation......lol

Another article that newer variant can carry ptb-3000 drop tank
http://www.ausairpower.net/APA-Fullback.html


And this is a picture of some su-34 or more properly named su27ib

 

[Tokhme khar]

Show me a pic of the regular Su-30 series carrying them, not these strike Fullbacks.

'Flanker'.........not 'Fullback'

 

[Hack-Hook]

Show me a pic of the regular Su-30 series carrying them, not these strike Fullbacks.

'Flanker'.........not 'Fullback'

I said three version of the family which are the newer evolution of the platform carry them . su-27ib, su-35, su-27smk

If you want to stay in air for several hours you'll need them .by the way here the discussion was not about if the plane can carry drop tank or not .
The talks is why you go after two sit airplane while a single sit airplane is superior to that and we all knew Russia won't allow us to produce even su-30 locally . they even won't let us produce mug-29 locally .
And more importantly there is not a single mission situation that Su-35 can't do it better than Su-30.

The question is why kidding ourselves in believing Russia will give us a license for even producing Su-17?
Why not go after the best available option ?

 

[Tokhme khar]

In 2020, your questions will be answered. The S-300 was delivered, was it not? The Tor system was delivered, yes?

Iran has no other option but Russia to procure new warplanes. The domestic industry will produce another F-5 with three tails and two kir next time. You want to see it?

Just sit back and relax. Only 2 years to go now.

I said three version of the family which are the newer evolution of the platform carry them . su-27ib, su-35, su-27smk

If you want to stay in air for several hours you'll need them .by the way here the discussion was not about if the plane can carry drop tank or not .
The talks is why you go after two sit airplane while a single sit airplane is superior to that and we all knew Russia won't allow us to produce even su-30 locally . they even won't let us produce mug-29 locally .
And more importantly there is not a single mission situation that Su-35 can't do it better than Su-30.

The question is why kidding ourselves in believing Russia will give us a license for even producing Su-17?
Why not go after the best available option ?

 

[Hack-Hook]

In 2020, your questions will be answered. The S-300 was delivered, was it not? The Tor system was delivered, yes?

Iran has no other option but Russia to procure new warplanes. The domestic industry will produce another F-5 with three tails and two kir next time. You want to see it?

Just sit back and relax. Only 2 years to go now.

Russia gave us license for producing which weapon ? we sooner can get license for producing F-22 from USA than getting license for producing SU-30 from Russia .

Russia didn't gave us any license for any weapon except a limited license for T-72 or perhaps T-52 i don't recall which one . but I'm sure they'll be happy to sell us Su-30 at the time that sanction are lifted if by the time the deal wont be changed to mig-35.

I tell you we won't get the license so why not go after SU-35 instead

 

[Tokhme khar]

just nitpicking for the sake of it are we? You should be glad whether the Su-30sm gets delivered, or the su-35 or the Mig-29SMT or Mig-35, with or without TOT! Iran desperately needs a new AF. Domestic industry is not cutting it, in case you haven't noticed. None else will supply to Iran, other than Russia.

I don't believe Putin will hold back deliveries of warplanes, after 2020.

Russia gave us license for producing which weapon ? we sooner can get license for producing F-22 from USA than getting license for producing SU-30 from Russia .

Russia didn't gave us any license for any weapon except a limited license for T-72 or perhaps T-52 i don't recall which one . but I'm sure they'll be happy to sell us Su-30 at the time that sanction are lifted if by the time the deal wont be changed to mig-35.

I tell you we won't get the license so why not go after SU-35 instead