Iran issues ultimatum to Pakistan on IP gas pipeline

[ArsalanKhan21]

you don't put $500 million in a suit case and bring to Pakistan.

India is importing 3.84 million barrels of oil monthly from Iran. They dont have fear of sanctions. Why is Pakistan shuddering in fear ? Probably Indians are stuffing suitcases with dollars and sending them to Iran as payment for oil !!!

India oil imports from Iran jump sharply in 2014 - Economic Times

 

[FaujHistorian]

Your post is factually incorrect.

1. Pakistan signed the deal when the sanctions were already in effect. That means the last Pakistani government still wanted to go ahead with the deal despite the sanctions.

2. Both India and China are trading with Iran apart from purchasing oil from them despite the sanctions.

Its not the Iranians fault, blaming the sanctions and Iran is lying. Pakistan has made a conscious decision not to go ahead with the Iranian deal because of pressure from US and Saudi Arabia.

Most of Indian Chinese trade is not done through international banking channels. They have been using gold and some barter trading.

These are one at a time deals like buying a ship load of petroleum through 3rd country flagged vessels.

Such trade is less vulnerable as the maximum loss is just one shipload of stuff.


pipelines on the other hand are multi-billion dollar fixed place projects. They should not be compared with one at a time ship trade.

please update your understanding.

we are not talking about 2 anna mooli gajar trade here.


Thank you

India is importing 3.84 million barrels of oil monthly from Iran. They dont have fear of sanctions. Why is Pakistan shuddering in fear ? Probably Indians are stuffing suitcases with dollars and sending them to Iran as payment for oil !!!

India oil imports from Iran jump sharply in 2014 - Economic Times

Oh bhai jaaan

They buy one ship at a time petroleum. So the total amount involved at one time is not billions

Pakistan can do the same if Iran was selling ships of LNG.

Then you just buy one ship at a time.

If that ship gets impounded, you only loose few millions.

try to understand that we don't have 300 billion dollars cash sitting in state bank like India, or 4000 billion cash in case of China.

Don't be a monkey-see-monkey-do.

our trade is highly dependent on international banks.

 

[Folkindia]

You ought to take the time to think through what you type, your comments are ill-advised and poorly grounded with reference to the pipeline deal. .. "Pakistan is building a pipeline in its own territory does not contravene sanctions".

'The US says the project would enable Iran to sell more of its gas, undermining efforts to step up pressure over Tehran's nuclear activities.

"If this deal is finalised for a proposed Iran-Pakistan pipeline, it would raise serious concerns under our Iran Sanctions Act. We've made that absolutely clear to our Pakistani counterparts," State Department spokesperson Victoria Nuland told reporters last week'.

It's perfectly clear Pakistan does not want to antagonise the US when it is undertaking stringent measures to stabilise the country and economy.

(Wont allow me to post the BBC link. Just type in 'Pakistan-Iran gas pipeline defies US' in Google).

I guess you forgot about Pakistan trading with Afghanistan when it was ruled by Talibans 1996-2001.


Pakistan is building a pipeline in its own territory does not contravene sanctions. India increased oil purchases from Iran by 60% from previous year in 2014. How about India avoiding sanctions ? Only Pakistan is obliged to respect the sanctions but not India !!!

 

[Screambowl]

India too buckled under the threat of sanctions.

Sanctions does not affect a country with 1.2 billion population. We still by oil from them.

 

[ArsalanKhan21]

They buy one ship at a time petroleum. So the total amount involved at one time is not billions.

Pakistan can at least build the gas pipeline and don't buy the gas. The day sanctions are lifted you can open tap and gas flows to homes and industries. But Pakistan is not even building the pipeline on its territory !!

 

[Judge]

Pakistan can at least build the gas pipeline and don't buy the gas. The day sanctions are lifted you can open tap and gas flows to homes and industries. But Pakistan is not even building the pipeline on its territory !!

Most of Indian Chinese trade is not done through international banking channels. They have been using gold and some barter trading.

These are one at a time deals like buying a ship load of petroleum through 3rd country flagged vessels.

Such trade is less vulnerable as the maximum loss is just one shipload of stuff.


pipelines on the other hand are multi-billion dollar fixed place projects. They should not be compared with one at a time ship trade.

please update your understanding.

we are not talking about 2 anna mooli gajar trade here.


Thank you



Oh bhai jaaan

They buy one ship at a time petroleum. So the total amount involved at one time is not billions

Pakistan can do the same if Iran was selling ships of LNG.

Then you just buy one ship at a time.

If that ship gets impounded, you only loose few millions.

try to understand that we don't have 300 billion dollars cash sitting in state bank like India, or 4000 billion cash in case of China.

Don't be a monkey-see-monkey-do.

our trade is highly dependent on international banks.

"ship gets impounded"

What in Gods name are you talking about? Impounded by whom? No country or consortium has the legal authority to impound an Iranian ship or Indian ship carrying Iranian oil as long as these ships traverse the International waters and stay away from the coastal waters of other countries. India and Iranian trade is conducted using ships registered within our countries as foreign flagged merchants do not want to trade with Iran.

Secondly, India buys Iranian oil worth billions of dollars each year. We buy more in a year from Iran than what Pakistan would spend on the gas pipeline in several years put together.

India and China are doing exactly opposite of the reasons you mention to be responsible for Pakistan not going ahead with the deal. And guess what? No sanctions on us.

 

[Daneshmand]

Most of Indian Chinese trade is not done through international banking channels. They have been using gold and some barter trading.

These are one at a time deals like buying a ship load of petroleum through 3rd country flagged vessels.

Such trade is less vulnerable as the maximum loss is just one shipload of stuff.


pipelines on the other hand are multi-billion dollar fixed place projects. They should not be compared with one at a time ship trade.

please update your understanding.

we are not talking about 2 anna mooli gajar trade here.


Thank you



Oh bhai jaaan

They buy one ship at a time petroleum. So the total amount involved at one time is not billions

Pakistan can do the same if Iran was selling ships of LNG.

Then you just buy one ship at a time.

If that ship gets impounded, you only loose few millions.

try to understand that we don't have 300 billion dollars cash sitting in state bank like India, or 4000 billion cash in case of China.

Don't be a monkey-see-monkey-do.

our trade is highly dependent on international banks.

Your pipeline argument does not stand since Turkey is buying Iranian gas via a pipeline.

There is no need to make excuses, Iran knows that Pakistan can not come up with political courage necessary for this deal. Pakistan could go through with this if it had pushed for a diplomatic waiver on this from US arguing that Pakistan needs energy for 190 million people suffering from chronic energy shortages and its disastrous effects on its economy. After all US needs Pakistan on its side in Afghanistan, the same way Turkey got a waiver for its gas import.

At any rate, a few billion dollars of gas sale, won't change economic situation of Iran. If there is any long term loss, it is going to be Pakistan's. How is the gas/electricity/fuel situation in Pakistan? Any improvement lately or expected in this decade?

 

[ArsalanKhan21]

-India and China are doing exactly opposite of the reasons you mention to be responsible for Pakistan not going ahead with the deal. And guess what? No sanctions on us.

Exactly ! Pakistan government lame excuses of not building the pipeline are just lies !

 

[slapshot]

Pakistan can at least build the gas pipeline and don't buy the gas. The day sanctions are lifted you can open tap and gas flows to homes and industries. But Pakistan is not even building the pipeline on its territory !!

yar kia fazool taqreer kar rha hay. Soo jaa morning min school bhe jana ho ga .

 

[ArsalanKhan21]

yar kia fazool taqreer kar rha hay. Soo jaa morning min school bhe jana ho ga .

Yaar, fazool batain nahin hain yey. Mulk main load shedding ho rahi hay na gas na bijli na pani. Abh Lahore main petrol bhi nahi hay. Kya muzlum aadami apni kahani bhi na sunayee

 

[Folkindia]

Have you been on a fact- finding mission up your own backside? Do you actually believe the nonsense being spewed from between your lips? india and China are enormous countries, both with the largest populations and economy worth in the trillions.. Pakistan does not hold the same economic/political weight under present times. Iran aren't to be blamed here with regards to the pipeline deal, it just so happens that the US is 'arm twisting' Pakistan given the current political-scenario. Pakistan should always look to maintain friendly ties with neighbouring countries, Iran being one of them, however at a later date. Perhaps then we'll see the pipeline-deal come to fruition and pay dividends.

Exactly ! Pakistan government lame excuses of not building the pipeline are just lies !

 

[FaujHistorian]

Sanctions does not affect a country with 1.2 billion population. We still by oil from them.

yep. but pipeline is a long term investment compared to buying one at a time ship of oil

....
At any rate, a few billion dollars of gas sale, won't change economic situation of Iran. If there is any long term loss, it is going to be Pakistan's.

LNG is a natural choice a better one compared to pipeline.

"ship gets impounded".

Oh bhai,

loss of one ship / loss of payment for one ship load of oil is not a big deal compared to sanctions on the whole pipeline.

 

[ArsalanKhan21]

Iran aren't to be blamed here with regards to the pipeline deal, it just so happens that the US is 'arm twisting' Pakistan given the current political-scenario.

So you admit that US and Saudi Arabia are arm twisting Pakistan on this pipeline. We cannot even build a pipeline in our territory ? While India, China and Turkey buys billions of dollars of energy from Iran.

LNG is a natural choice a better one compared to pipeline.

"Natural Choice" !!! Keystone pipeline is being built to carry Canadian oil to US. Its more cost effective than tankers. US will build a pipeline for its own benefit but deny to Pakistan. Atleast Pakistan should build the pipeline its long term project. Sanctions may be lifted this year.

 

[Daneshmand]

yep. but pipeline is a long term investment compared to buying one at a time ship of oil



LNG is a natural choice a better one compared to pipeline.

Not really. LNG becomes cost effective if the distance between supplier and consumer market is around 8000 kilometers. Unless Pakistan wants to import gas from Indonesia or United States, the pipeline is the best medium.

Take the example of a nearby gas supplier Qatar, a supplier of gas to Japan, India and South Korea. When you are buying gas from Qatar, you are competing with countries whose economies are much larger and higher tech than yours. Countries who have invested money and technology in Qatar to get cheap gas. In fact Qatar had offered gas to Pakistan at a rate of 19 dollars per MMBTU (without transportation costs) way above Iranian offer of 11 dollars (including pipeline cost). Then add in the transportation cost (Pakistan does not own any LNG tankers) of around 2-3 dollars per MMBTU for LNG, plus the evaporation losses during transport of LNG (it is a boiling liquid continuously evaporating while in ship tankers), you will end up paying more than twice the rate of a pipeline (which is a closed circuit system with no losses).

But yes. LNG has other benefits. Short term contracts, that can bring in huge commissions and kickbacks for the negotiating parties. Pipeline can not provide that since it is a long term contract that is negotiated once.

 

[Screambowl]

yep. but pipeline is a long term investment compared to buying one at a time ship of oil

Let Pakistan complete it on time first, then it won't take India more than 13 months to build a pipeline.