Interesting observations from senator Lindsay Graham

[PakFactor]

It’s not just folk here on PDF. Even the idiots on media, so call journalists suffer from same mental illness. Blaming dead General’s Cold War policy, some even blame the First PM of Pakistan for their tilt towards US. They analyze challenge and difficult of past, living in the comfort of present without realizing, at that time, those who were responsible, took the best course of action. Now Every layman can draw random conclusion in 20/20 hindsight.

Let's be honest things could've been managed much better during this War on Terror non-sense. My issue isn’t the tilt but the total jump into one boat from Pakistan into American camp — should’ve played it smart and kept relations between both USSR and US, without poking one on behalf of the other. We provided U-2 bases and everything what did we get out of it? A Russian threat to Nuke us, and what did U.S. do nothing, packed up and left making Pakistan again looking stupid. Our generals are useless when they need to extract any sort of advantage, and I'm not saying this lightly. Why risk becoming an outright target of one powers wrath when he lives in your backyard, it's stupidity. India regardless what we say about them, played it smart with both sides during the Cold War and their diplomacy is what we should've replicated.

When two tigers fight one gets killed, the other is maimed. What Pakistani's ended up doing is getting one tiger killed and let the other go scotch free. Now face the blow back -- 70K+ Pakistani's killed, about to have your *** sanctioned down the road, crying over FATF listing.

 

[Basel]

This is good move by the Senator in favor of Pakistan view points.
Hopefully our PM IK will hold firm in his actions.
Pakistan needs a lobbyist in D.C. to counter any move in Congress.

Rumors are circulating that IK stance may led him loose power, as CIA is now at work as usual and they have plenty traitors available in Pakistan.

No one had a clue in the days after 9/11 on what the death toll was. I thought 10,000-20,000 people perished in the collapse of the WTC

It would have suicidal for Musharraf to confront USA

True, after 9/11 the whole world was with USA and none in Pakistan could have said no to US, Mush did well in getting benefits for Pakistan which other political people would have not gained due to their personal interest.

 

[PakFactor]

Rumors are circulating that IK stance may led him loose power, as CIA is now at work as usual and they have plenty traitors available in Pakistan.


True, after 9/11 the whole world was with USA and none in Pakistan could have said no to US, Mush did well in getting benefits for Pakistan which other political people would have not gained due to their personal interest.

What benefits did Musharraf in return received for Pakistan? Besides a couple of F-16 and handing over citizens to the West?

 

[Imran Khan]

USA dont care they came for revenge they took revenge and they left

 

[Vapour]

Why should he?

1. To begin a working partnership with Biden admin.
2. Opportune time to be proactive with IK's "geo-economic" focus and upcoming US withdrawal from AFG in September.
3. Worth trying, as if there's a snub, IK can then say he tried and point out why, justifiably Pakistan is ignoring American concerns vis-a-vis its relations with China.

 

[Mav3rick]

Musharraf was a big MF coward, who couldn't handle the pressure and intimidation. He was a disgrace to the ssg uniform.

Hmmm, he did capitulate when the US threatened to bomb him and his family back to the stone age.....oh wait, they did not do that. They actually threatened Pakistan and not Musharraf. So I wonder what gives the keyboard warriors the nerve to call a soldier who had actually fought 3 wars for Pakistan, a coward!

 

[waz]

Agreed. My sense is the Biden folks are cold shouldering PMIK. They are sending lower level folks or are trying to work through PA or ISI......kind of funny for the champion of democracy. GOP has rejected talking to lower level officials......and should continue to do so. PA and ISI should also make clear that nothing is agreed until civilian government concurs.

Spot on bro. No need to pay attention to Biden and his minions rehashed ‘Pakistan doesn’t matter policy’.

 

[VCheng]

Spot on bro. No need to pay attention to Biden and his minions rehashed ‘Pakistan doesn’t matter policy’.

There is no such policy. It is just that what Pakistan can offer in return for what it wants to get from USA has to be a workable scenario. That is all.

 

[waz]

There is no such policy. It is just that what Pakistan can offer in return for what it wants to get from USA has to be a workable scenario. That is all.

Skipping Pakistan is pretty indicative of such a policy.

 

[VCheng]

Skipping Pakistan is pretty indicative of such a policy.

That may just be a negotiating tactic, just like PMIK's refusal to meet US personnel. Both sides are trying to get the most for the least, nothing else.

 

[Genghis khan1]

Let's be honest things could've been managed much better during this War on Terror non-sense. My issue isn’t the tilt but the total jump into one boat from Pakistan into American camp — should’ve played it smart and kept relations between both USSR and US, without poking one on behalf of the other. We provided U-2 bases and everything what did we get out of it? A Russian threat to Nuke us, and what did U.S. do nothing, packed up and left making Pakistan again looking stupid. Our generals are useless when they need to extract any sort of advantage, and I'm not saying this lightly. Why risk becoming an outright target of one powers wrath when he lives in your backyard, it's stupidity. India regardless what we say about them, played it smart with both sides during the Cold War and their diplomacy is what we should've replicated.

When two tigers fight one gets killed, the other is maimed. What Pakistani's ended up doing is getting one tiger killed and let the other go scotch free. Now face the blow back -- 70K+ Pakistani's killed, about to have your *** sanctioned down the road, crying over FATF listing.

Where Pakistan failed is mitigating the risk and properly capitalizing on the decisions.

 

[FuturePAF]

I personally don’t think anything has been decided through back channels. If Biden hasn’t talked to Imran then there isn’t anything that will happen. The CIA was the back channel and they were told to go away.

As for being clueless that’s actually a tame word, they’re outright incompetent. I mean asking for bases in Central Asia, ignoring Pakistan etc.

Agreed about the elections.

I’ll have to give you that. Ignoring Pakistan while trying to work through the central Asian states after just having antagonized Putin was just dumb.

we’ll see what the US priorities look like once the defense budget comes out around June 28th, if I remember correctly. Their taking testimony right now from Miley.

 

[nahtanbob]

I’ll have to give you that. Ignoring Pakistan while trying to work through the central Asian states after just having antagonized Putin was just dumb.

we’ll see what the US priorities look like once the defense budget comes out around June 28th, if I remember. Their taking testimony right now from Miley.

If Putin was antagonized he still made it a point to meet Biden in a summit

 

[Deltadart]

I hope not, Musharraf was a commando coward.

Musharraf was a mother F****** coward, who couldn't handle the pressure and intimidation. He was a disgrace

Hmmm, he did capitulate when the US threatened to bomb him and his family back to the stone age.....oh wait, they did not do that. They actually threatened Pakistan and not Musharraf. So I wonder what gives the keyboard warriors the nerve to call a soldier who had actually fought 3 wars for Pakistan, a coward!

According to some reports he didn't even consult with the corp commanders before agreeing to collaborate with the US, and according to some American officials, musharraf offered way more than what they ever imagined would be offered by him. He literally handed over the control of the nation to a foreign power without any resistance. Pakistan was not responsible for 9/11, thus the often quoted threat of being bombed to stone age never makes any sense to me. Perhaps someone mistook the Pakistanis for Saudis. The people responsible for that evil act were SAUDIS, and not us.

Don't forget he is also the father of the cancer of NROs, and the rise of the sharif clan as a result of it. Musharraf also gave a free hand to the mqm thugs to do what they wanted to do in Karachi. It will take Karachi decades to recover from what they did to this city. He murdered Nawab Akbar Bugti, and Balochistan hasn't been the same since that day. He is directly responsible for the Baloch insurgency, that got a new life after the murder of nawab sahib. His personal wisdom, or lack of it, has cost Pakistan dearly in every conceivable way.

Perhaps one of his former colleagues can lift the veil from his army career. Kargil fiasco was his shining moment in the sun....and look how it turned out. I hold him responsible for abandoning our brave soldiers to be killed by the filthy pajeets in Kargil.

 

[Basel]

What benefits did Musharraf in return received for Pakistan? Besides a couple of F-16 and handing over citizens to the West?

Are you dumb or posing to be one??

If Mush had not got loans reschedule and repaid then Pakistan had bankrupted even in PPP government. He got Pakistan out of IMF by repayment of their loans.

Today all advance military capabilities are due to his work.