Population dont decide the size of the Country ! Its the Land mass will decide
I do not see how that is relevant in our present debate, even so in population takes precedence over landmass. For example, Egypt's population is centered around the Nile near about 90% and the number of people are taken into account not the mass it owns. For example, throughout history Egypt has had trouble defending the Nile peninsula from North and the source from the South.
Again I do not see the relevance of 'size' in your argument. Please elaborate, thank you.
Even now Indian Armed Forces are many fold larger and greater than PAF . When if u dont like it u need to take the facts ! Many examples can be given from men and Machines
I think you misunderstood, no one was comparing the rough size of the militaries, it is natural that with a billion people India would have a larger armed force. My original post was to illuminate to you that Pakistani defence thinking is to have 'enough' capabilities to be able to match India and that does not mean 'conquer' as I think you have inferred it. It means that in case of an Indo-Pak war, Pakistan can defend itself to Indian incursion by land, air and water. That was the thinking behind acquiring a nuclear weapon, Pakistan is seen as a 'fortified' nation as many scholars have pointed out; strategically, Pakistan knows that she will be on the defence in terms of manpower and resources and has historically focused on two broad strategic premises:
a) Act first, strike against India in order to deter them this is also known as aggressive-defence.
b) Inflict a heavy war of attrition on Indian forces that intrude into Pakistani territory in order to dissuade them for further occupation.
If so India wont be trading with Pakistan . Stable and Rich Pakistan in the intrest of India . India spend lots of money in counter terrorism and other threats created by pakistan . And terrorism by Pakistan is hurting india too .
I think you misunderstood my point, the this premise is not independent of my entire paragraph, it hints at India's strategy regarding the military angle in Indo-Pak relations, I used an example from history to show that. There was no point at trading. Yes, terrorism hurts everyone. When did I say anything to the contrary?
Pakistan cannot be stable atleast for the next century . Pakistan already had lots of terror activities from soviet era to Terrorism on India . Now it even went further to facilitate Talibans and now operate as terror hub for global terrorism . Even breading terrorism in Chinese provinces too . Which is a only ally for Pakistan in case of AID and Weapon system ! Not to hurt u or something but is nt the facts ? Since u want to write a article am explaining indian point of view . Its more like global point of view as am a NRI too ...
A very strong assumption by you, sir. I would reccomend that you search online for news articles about Pakistan since the 90s: repeatedly we have thought to just die and be on the verge of collapse and we have defied that. You might be an NRI but I live here, in her own way there is stability over here. Again, I pointed out that Pakistan needs to be analysed on its own terms as well. It is ironic that you would state that Pakistani military supports terrorists who kill the Pakistani military, the picture has changed a lot, sir, read on the academic literature and then decide. Secondly, China is Pakistan's greatest provider it is not possible that Pakistan is supporting terrorists in China and then Pakistan hands over Gawadar to them. I assure you that game is not being played. If so please post credible proofs of such. The Talibs are seen as enemy no. 1, in fact the military training that our cadets receive at PMA has them fight against terrorists. Most platoon commanders take command against terrorists, not Kashmir as had been tradition.
So there are diffrence between What we want and What we can Pakistan will have to spend less in future incase if its political situation is stable . Pakistan yet to go thru democratic . Lots of problems in democracy than controled by ARMY regime
Again, sir, your point is refuted by empirical data. Yes, we have flaws, yes the army exerts
influence (not control) over some aspects of our political economy yet Pakistan is finally democratic. Just take the trouble of looking at our recent elections, the PPP has been totally defeated and marginally became the opposition party with MQM (the traditional no. 3 of our politics since 1988) has also been removed from that seat by the PTI. The ANP has single figure seats and so does the PML-Q. What is that if not democracy? Also the president has left his seat, did not meddle in the PM's office, our army chief has categorically said that he is
not looking for an extension, seems odd if his institution is
controlling the political life as you have asserted and yes, let me tell you another thing: Gen. Kiyani is
loved by the people and the soldiers for his fight against the terrorists.
You are welcome ! I will also answer in detail .
Its not true . PA against terrorist who want to kill Pakistani Army Men . But PA is Breading many other Terror organisation internationally . Hope you dont disagree with it .
Yes ! Check my above comment. Its selective approach
Again, sir, not supported by the data. Firstly, the Taliban or TTP as they are known in Pakistan are an umbrella organisation the only other faction is of Afghani Taliban. Secondly, it is the TTP that has attacked our military in the tribal areas, it is the TTP that is fighting our military in the Tirah valley and it was the TTP that attacked the Naval base in Karachi. So if you think that the Pakistani military is supporting them, you are wrong. What you might be thinking is a common mistake many people who do not know about the Pakhtuns make: the Lashkars, in the FATA the Pakistani military has supported indiginously run Lashkars, these are armies of tribesmen who are constructed by negotiation between various tribes and act as the police force of the area. They are not terrorists, for example the Afridi tribe which respects the Sufi traditions has been target of the TTP and was instrumental in disarming the Uzbeki militants that ran to Pakistan after the US operation. If you click on a picture of an Afridi tribesman you would perhaps mistake him as a TTP soldier: do not judge a book by its cover, it is frankly racist.
You are missing a BIH PICTURE HERE ! ISI and PA wont have support from pak people for their Lion's Share of your GDP if India and Pakistan are friends . They wont let it happen . PEACE wont be there between both countries altall . Unless pak is controlled by people's power not as Puppet Govt .
The
lion's share of our GDP actually goes to pay off our loans. Secondly, the military is paid at par with governmental officer's pay by scale a lieutenant's salary is the same as a civil servants. The military does facilitate her men but that is supported by commercial miliary projects such as the Fauji Foundation. I would reccommend that you read around on PDF there are detailed analyses of our annual military GDP shares and spending and as I pointed out, sir, we are in a state of war. That requires us to put in money to fight enemy combatants.
Brother as i mentioned u are missing a big picture on Indo Pak Ties . This realationship cannot be normalised atall . Untill Pakistan give back *** or Untill India Give away Kashmir . But Even then Terrorism wont stop . PA will try to get more land as possible as it serves it cause . $$$ of ur GDP . And no way China will be mute spectator if indo pak ties grows . Has Pak Army has roped in China in all its front . Chinese wont go from the land given to them by PAK from *** ! ! ! And they are not fool to give u aids and weapons So we can be friends ... NEVER WILL HAPPEN in our life time . unless after a full blown war .
History will disagree with you on that. The rivalry of the British and the French and the French and the German and the British and the Americans is nothing compared to ours. For example, the British ruled parts of France for over 250 years and claimed it as their territory up until Napoleon (reminds you of Kashmir?) in just about 90 years the French and the British bled together against the German might. Then Germany claimed the French territories that bordered it, they even spoke a dialect of German there! (Reminds you of Punjab?) in the Fanco-Prussian wars and then both World Wars these regions were a point of contestation between the countries yet right after WWII, thetow nations were allies against the USSR and continue to remain so. The Americans gained freedom from the British and since the Spanish war consider them their closest allies. I would remind you that these developments took on average 90-100 years and China, India and Pakistan have not completed 100 years as nation states.
If you get a AID for infra its not bad thing atall ... Even now India get Aid and Loans for infre . But the problem is when these money goes to ur PA ... More than 60% of ur GDP goes to Army Gen . If am not exact with the numbers but more or less ... Yet its very few in terms of $$$ when compared with Indian GDP and Defence Budget . You also made the same point in pakistan's angl . But ur army has the lions Share . isnt it ? Now u can get some clue why indo pak ties wont be normal any time soon ... It in the intrest of many parties and Govt Structures which include PA and Corruptions
We actually get most of aid to continue to fight the War on terror. In fact we get very little for our infrastructure. The PA is not corrupting the money it is bleeding on the front lines, sir.
http://faculty.maxwell.syr.edu/rdenever/NatlSecurity2008_docs/Cohen_10Billion.pdf
Brother did anything happend till now ? Trust me it wont even in future ! System is collasped in Pakistan . Its going from bad to worst each days . Tell me how can you clean up Taliban Mess ( Leave home grown terrorism for a while ) You cannot chase them out . They are already calling the Shots on Pak Forign policies . Wait for some more time for Sharia law be impossed on pak. If so it will take another 50 years for pakistan even to realise its mistake . So its all about Money but more over its about system . Even if Pakistan put all its resources it can manufacture or Buy high Tech weapon system . Not possible its the only reason it keep buying or getting Chinese weapons for free or at low cost .. Isnt it true ?
Again, sir, the aim of the Pakistani military is not to drive the Talibs out but it is to completely destroy them the only thing that is impeding them is the civilian input needed which due to dire resources and bureaucratic intertia has not been able to put in. I would refer you to a detailed discussion on it.
Here is a concise version of it by my own post on PDF:
http://www.defence.pk/forums/pakist...stan-army-s-experience-counterinsurgency.html
Brother let me tell u one thing . Its not about some one agreeing that Pakistan is Middle power or Not ... But the truth is there to see for all . If you think Pakistan is middle power its ok ... its ur point of View ... India is a middle Power China is upper middle class USA is a upper class . To give you a comparison of $$$ powers . And yes Pakistan need to pump up its economy . Many problem will be solved . Terrorist who give their life for few 10000s rupees will stop working for this less budget atleast .. Why any one want to die if they can live king size life with wife and Kids ? But Talibans and PA will not allow it to happen .
You seem to have mistaken, 'middle power' is a term used by political scientists to classify countries by their development and capabilites and projective capabilities they can develop. The problem of terrorism is very complex my post will not allow me to fully engage you on it but your version of it is not accurate it is paramount to understand that there are brands of terrorism, it is not a single entity, they even fight one another. It should also be noted that Pakhtun culture also needs to be understood. I would welcome you to read further with an academic interest in the subject and then make your opinions.
Brother it can be patriotic to say want you just mentioned above . Even North Korea said It will wipe out USA . How can Pakistan win a battle with a army which is many folds larger ? And the war will be for pride not for money or Land .. like other nations Fight . Eg : indo China war is more like for LAND and Economy supermacy ... But Indo Pak war will be very diffrent and very agressive . It will be like last man standing . Pakistan has only one trump card to use against india and to stop india from attacking it ... its NUCLEAR WEAPON ! ! ! But it will be end of Pakistan if it even launched Nuke of any kind against any enemy . Because India will lauch the momment it detects a missile BEEP sound and *** on it RADAR . If pak is successfull India will loss atleast 30-40% of it landmass But 100% distruction for pakistan . There will be no pakistan ! Its not herotic but the facts ! ! !
Thank you .
Again, brother, you have misunderstood by the 21st century conflict I meant the War on Terror which is Pakistan's War, not any conventional war with any nation.
Regards
