Indonesia Leaders : We Stand With The People of Palestine

[Song Hong]

PDF admin has changed color. This guy will be intermittently banned 8 years ago for supporting zionism

 

[antonius123]

PDF admin has changed color. This guy will be intermittently banned 8 years ago for supporting zionism

Supporting humanity and UN you called as supporting zionism? So you mean UN supporting zionism? And based on what zionism is wrong? where is UN resolution against it? why UN support Partition Plan and recognize Israel?

Stop slendering as usual please. Your arguments are always clouded by biases + you are kind of person who like opressing different/opposite opinions, if US is not supporting Israel I believe your view will be TOTALLY different

 

[Respect4Respect01]

Which HRW or UN report that I reject?

I've told you many times:

1. Amnesty International accusation is not a verdict, it is being investigated by UN/ICJ, Amnesty International is just an NGO just like HRW, you ignoring my past evidence and argument again.

2. I dont deny cruelty/atrocities happened during the war both from Hamas side or Israel site, but that doesnt necessarily means as "genocide", atrocities is atrocities, happen in many wars. Genocide mean the government has intention to eradicate the nation/group of people, not the same as fighting enemy/terrorism. You are twisting fact again.

This prove how ignorant and twisting fact you are

no you denied cruelties many times so don't change your stance, why do you forget your own arguments? you always claimed that it was Hamas to be blamed and Israel was so peaceful and blah blah blah.

i thought i was debating with someone sensible, but after reading your comment i don't think you did any research like you claim.
Genocide, apartheid, controlling borders, are not just accusations but it doesn't matter if you want to close your eyes to whatever is happening there.

I could write a very long essay on Israeli atrocities but there is no point if you are not going to believe me, so its better if I post some evidence to prove my claims. I hope you trust reputable international organizations.

Amnesty International :https://www.amnesty.org/en/countrie...-israel-and-occupied-palestinian-territories/

UN claims its genocide : https://www.un.org/unispal/document/auto-insert-186897/


AP : ICC launches war crimes probe into Israeli practices : https://apnews.com/article/israel-w...courts-crime-19117d4265f5d564256ea7fe75854aa6

ICC : https://www.icc-cpi.int/Pages/item.aspx?name=210303-prosecutor-statement-investigation-palestine

BC: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-56898864

Human Rights Watch : https://www.hrw.org/news/2017/06/04/israel-50-years-occupation-abuses

Here is my comment #52 where i presented many links to reputable sources like UN and HRW.

Yes, you are discussing with a sensible and critical guy.
You can't just throw what you believe without evidence, and thinking you are a sensible and other are insensible because of not believing what you believe.



So you mean the ICJ (International Court Justice) has declared that Israel did genocide, apartheid?

Controlling border is not against human right, it is right of every country.



These all are reports that Amnesty International received from an NGO. How come you say the NGO report is evidence if you are sensible enough. NGO could be subjective/bias and has political motive too. FYI, there is NGO pro Israel too

I quote this statement from your link:

Israel’s aggression against the Palestinian people of Gaza – Human Rights Council 9th special session – NGO statement (North-South XXI)

Written statement*
submitted by Nord-Sud XXI, a non-governmental organization in special consultative status

The Secretary-General has received the following written statement which is circulated in accordance with Economic and Social Council resolution 1996/31.



This is "PROBE" launched by ICC, not an Evidence or Decision by ICC!

Do you understand what "PROBE" is? Probe is an effort to investigate and find evidence. The genocide of Israel status is still "allegedly".

The prosecutor of the International Criminal Court said Wednesday she has launched an investigation into alleged Israeli crimes in the Palestinian territories, plunging the court into the midst of one of the most fraught conflicts of the past half century.

ICC launches war crimes probe into Israeli practices

THE HAGUE, Netherlands (AP) — The prosecutor of the International Criminal Court said Wednesday she has launched an investigation into alleged Israeli crimes in the Palestinian territories, plunging the court into the midst of one of the most fraught conflicts of the past half century.

apnews.com

This is also an accusation from an NGO named "Human Right Watch", not a decision from ICC.

If you think accusations are evidence, then that means you are BIAS and not sensible.

Accusation need to be investigated and be trial before ICC with defender from the defendant. Prosecutor/Accuser need to show evidence for their accusation, the defendant has right to show evidence saying otherwise for ICC review. Once ICC determined that the accusation is right, then you can claim the decision as evidence, although defendant still can appeal.

@Globenim @kuge @Viet @tower9 @Whizzack @Indos

and this was your reply, you refused to accept every single one of them without any evidence to backup instead your claim is that these are wrong because NGO's compiled them? I am pretty sure HRW and UN stands behind every single word that is published on their websites.

This prove how ignorant and twisting fact you are

i don't wanna use harsh language, but you are more than ignorant.
You are a coward who doesn't have to courage to tell his religion lol, you must be ashamed of your religion.

 

[antonius123]

no you denied cruelties many times so don't change your stance, why do you forget your own arguments? you always claimed that it was Hamas to be blamed and Israel was so peaceful and blah blah blah.

Which cruelty I deny? I just deny your accusation regarding Israel' genocide and your comprehension problem, not the existence of Israel's atrocity.
Did you read my post #54? Why so ignorant?

This not only prove your ignorance, but also prove that you always throw false claim/accusation.

Now show me which post of mine that I deny existence of Israel atrocity? can you?

Here is my comment #52 where i presented many links to reputable sources like UN and HRW.

LOL. The article you bragged is talking about accusation that UN received, and UN (ICJ) decision to make investigation. Can't you read English? or having comprehension problem?

Did you read my reply on post #53? I've explained it to you so crystal clear, thats why I said you are so ignorant or perhaps has comprehension problem.

and this was your reply, you refused to accept every single one of them without any evidence to backup instead your claim is that these are wrong because NGO's compiled them? I am pretty sure HRW and UN stands behind every single word that is published on their websites.

Just show me: which post of mine where I reject any possible Israel atrocities?

i don't wanna use harsh language, but you are more than ignorant.
You are a coward who doesn't have to courage to tell his religion lol, you must be ashamed of your religion.

You are talking about yourself again; the evidences of your ignorance and cognitive problem are presented above so palpably.

 

[antonius123]

Your comment #52 where you presented many links to reputable sources like UN and HRW, has been answered here,

Yes, you are discussing with a sensible and critical guy.
You can't just throw what you believe without evidence, and thinking you are a sensible and other are insensible because of not believing what you believe.



So you mean the ICJ (International Court Justice) has declared that Israel did genocide, apartheid?

Controlling border is not against human right, it is right of every country.



These all are reports that Amnesty International received from an NGO. How come you say the NGO report is evidence if you are sensible enough. NGO could be subjective/bias and has political motive too. FYI, there is NGO pro Israel too

I quote this statement from your link:

Israel’s aggression against the Palestinian people of Gaza – Human Rights Council 9th special session – NGO statement (North-South XXI)

Written statement*
submitted by Nord-Sud XXI, a non-governmental organization in special consultative status

The Secretary-General has received the following written statement which is circulated in accordance with Economic and Social Council resolution 1996/31.​

This is "PROBE" launched by ICC, not an Evidence or Decision by ICC!

Do you understand what "PROBE" is? Probe is an effort to investigate and find evidence. The genocide of Israel status is still "allegedly".

The prosecutor of the International Criminal Court said Wednesday she has launched an investigation into alleged Israeli crimes in the Palestinian territories, plunging the court into the midst of one of the most fraught conflicts of the past half century.

ICC launches war crimes probe into Israeli practices

THE HAGUE, Netherlands (AP) — The prosecutor of the International Criminal Court said Wednesday she has launched an investigation into alleged Israeli crimes in the Palestinian territories, plunging the court into the midst of one of the most fraught conflicts of the past half century.

apnews.com

This is also an accusation from an NGO named "Human Right Watch", not a decision from ICC.

If you think accusations are evidence, then that means you are BIAS and not sensible.

Accusation need to be investigated and be trial before ICC with defender from the defendant. Prosecutor/Accuser need to show evidence for their accusation, the defendant has right to show evidence saying otherwise for ICC review. Once ICC determined that the accusation is right, then you can claim the decision as evidence, although defendant still can appeal.

@Globenim @kuge @Viet @tower9 @Whizzack @Indos

So please stop ignoring my argument to you.

@Respect4Respect01

 

[Respect4Respect01]

Your comment #52 where you presented many links to reputable sources like UN and HRW, has been answered here,



So please stop ignoring my argument to you.

@Respect4Respect01

lol you talking about ignoring arguements who can't even answer one question which i asked you like 12 times already...and you ignored it from previous post too.

 

[Respect4Respect01]

Which cruelty I deny? I just deny your accusation regarding Israel' genocide and your comprehension problem, not the existence of Israel's atrocity.
Did you read my post #54? Why so ignorant?
View attachment 757497

This not only prove your ignorance, but also prove that you always throw false claim/accusation.

Now show me which post of mine that I deny existence of Israel atrocity? can you?




LOL. The article you bragged is talking about accusation that UN received, and UN (ICJ) decision to make investigation. Can't you read English? or having comprehension problem?

Did you read my reply on post #53? I've explained it to you so crystal clear, thats why I said you are so ignorant or perhaps has comprehension problem.




Just show me: which post of mine where I reject any possible Israel atrocities?



You are talking about yourself again; the evidences of your ignorance and cognitive problem are presented above so palpably.

you need to read the articles before posting crap, its same like you posted UN article thinking it was against Hamas but turned out to be against the Israelis lol.

secondly you are ignoring my posts, you didn't reply to the videos i posted above about the Israeli soldiers accepting their atrocities. You always change the topic when proof is presented to you.

 

[Respect4Respect01]

you claimed these people don't hate arabs lol

she is their politician

This is the best clip btw

 

[antonius123]

lol you talking about ignoring arguements who can't even answer one question which i asked you like 12 times already...and you ignored it from previous post too.

I've answered you many times even had to repeat it several times above. If you are ignorant or having comprehension problem it is your fault, not mine

you claimed these people don't hate arabs lol

she is their politician

This is the best clip btw

Some people hate, some people dont. Why so narrow minded?
Unlike you, I see facts not propaganda video, pallywood, etc.

you need to read the articles before posting crap, its same like you posted UN article thinking it was against Hamas but turned out to be against the Israelis lol.

If I didn't read nor missreading, then show me which statement of your article saying that these all are already UN verdict, instead of NGO's accusation.

secondly you are ignoring my posts, you didn't reply to the videos i posted above about the Israeli soldiers accepting their atrocities. You always change the topic when proof is presented to you.

Your videos has been answered many times.

This is the answer, and I have repeated many times.

Besides, video could be propaganda. You can pay someone to make a false witness and take video, and make narattion according to your interest. Video can help to understand but it is not a credible citation. Learn to bring credible citation instead of naration of a video.

Why repeated same questions that has been answered many times?
So, does it prove your ignorance?

 

[antonius123]

@Respect4Respect01

You haven't answer my questions:
1. Which land that Israel occupy illegally (based on international law).
2. Evidence that Israel intend to eliminate Palestine state / any arab nation?
3. Evidence of UN/ICJ verdict on Israel genocide.

 

[Respect4Respect01]

I've answered you many times even had to repeat it several times above. If you are ignorant or having comprehension problem it is your fault, not mine

look who is talking

Some people hate, some people dont. Why so narrow minded?
Unlike you, I see facts not propaganda video, pallywood, etc.

lol so its propaganda now?

Your videos has been answered many times.

This is the answer, and I have repeated many times.

show me where you answered the videos of soldiers i posted above?

Besides, video could be propaganda. You can pay someone to make a false witness and take video, and make narattion according to your interest. Video can help to understand but it is not a credible citation. Learn to bring credible citation instead of naration of a video.

Why repeated same questions that has been answered many times?
So, does it prove your ignorance?

lol you are too funny, so all videos are fake now, i see, a cheap way to deflect.

 

[Respect4Respect01]

1. Which land that Israel occupy illegally (based on international law).

Israel's Occupation: 50 Years of Dispossession

Mass human rights violations during the 50-year occupation of the West Bank and Gaza Strip have devastated the lives of millions of Palestinians.

www.amnesty.org

here is a map from 1940's video, it doesn't have Israel on it, it says Palestine. Jews at that time were represented by the "Jewish Agency for Palestine"

Evidence that Israel intend to eliminate Palestine state / any arab nation?

their plan is not just to occupy Palestine but create greater Israel, look at the map above and you will see who is the aggressor. Their new prime minister is also against two state solution that you also support...

3.Evidence of UN/ICJ verdict on Israel genocide.

https://ccrjustice.org/sites/default/files/attach/2016/10/Background%20on%20the%20term%20genocide%20in%20Israel%20Palestine%20Context.pdf

"Our sons are plundered of their organs"

Palestinians accuse the Israel Defense Forces of taking organs from their victims. Donald Boström writes about an international organ trafficking scandal – and

www.aftonbladet.se

btw im planning to travel in few days so i might not be able to reply back for few months but i will make sure to reply when im back....

I answered all your questions, i have only one question for the 15th time....what is your religion? are you ashamed of your religion?

 

[antonius123]

look who is talking

lol so its propaganda now?

Just a denial

show me where you answered the videos of soldiers i posted above?

Look at my post above, it already answered your video.
You have send similar video before, and I've told you cruelness can happen during war (assuming your video is correct); your video can't prove genocide that I've request.

lol you are too funny, so all videos are fake now, i see, a cheap way to deflect.

I am not saying ALL are fake, dont twist my argument.
They are all not necessarily fake, but subject to the narrator and compiler, thats why could be subjective.

 

[antonius123]

Israel's Occupation: 50 Years of Dispossession

Mass human rights violations during the 50-year occupation of the West Bank and Gaza Strip have devastated the lives of millions of Palestinians.

www.amnesty.org

I've told you the Israel occupation on West Bank has been settled through OSLO Accord.
According to the OSLO accord: Israel occupation on region C is as legal as Palestinian occupation on region A + B.

In the past, West Bank was annexed illegally by Jordan in 1948 when Arab nations attack Israel after Israel declare independence in 1948 (and Jordan never given it to Palestinian); then after Jordan attack Israel on 1967 Israel annexed it from Jordan and occupied it until OSLO Accord.

According to Israel, there is no forced migration/settlement of Israel people to the west bank, they move by their own intention/willingness hence not violate Geneva Convention.

Amnesty International's accusation has been received by UN and was investigated by ICC under UN, but no verdict from the ICC/UN that support these accusation.

here is a map from 1940's video, it doesn't have Israel on it, it says Palestine. Jews at that time were represented by the "Jewish Agency for Palestine"

LOL. What a twisted map from Palestinian's side

Who made this map? based on what?
Can you show me the "international law / UN resolution" that support your first map (red circle) as belong to Palestine State which had not existed yet in 1947?

their plan is not just to occupy Palestine but create greater Israel, look at the map above and you will see who is the aggressor. Their new prime minister is also against two state solution that you also support...

You quote aspiration of the zealot, not of Israel Government.
Show me any statement from Israel Government that saying that they intend to expand Israel region according such a map.

"Our sons are plundered of their organs"

Palestinians accuse the Israel Defense Forces of taking organs from their victims. Donald Boström writes about an international organ trafficking scandal – and

www.aftonbladet.se

btw im planning to travel in few days so i might not be able to reply back for few months but i will make sure to reply when im back....

Same like your videos above.
If it is real, then bring this with the evidence to the UN / ICC for their investigation; this will support Hamas fighting effort. Otherwise maybe it is another pallywood.

I answered all your questions, i have only one question for the 15th time....what is your religion? are you ashamed of your religion?

Again, evidence of your ignorance and stubborness.
I have answered you: I dont need to answer such an irrelevant question, because you need to focus on the object of the debate, not the subject. Otherwise (and this is also why) you keep failing grab my points.

 

[Respect4Respect01]

Just a denial

well of course you had no other way to deflect because its the ex Israeli soldiers themselves admitting.

Look at my post above, it already answered your video.
You have send similar video before, and I've told you cruelness can happen during war (assuming your video is correct); your video can't prove genocide that I've request.

you tell me then, why are these videos not correct?
secondly even if i go by your logic that "cruelness" can happen during war, then do you know that its called war crimes? Secondly some of those video are not from war times, one or two of those soldiers clearly mention that they were sent to take over land for the settlers.

I am not saying ALL are fake, dont twist my argument.
They are all not necessarily fake, but subject to the narrator and compiler, that's why could be subjective.

lol, but those videos are mostly from "Break the silence" which is an organization of ex Israeli soldiers who participated in crimes against civilians and now regret that and want to make a difference by raising their voices, and they are not against Israel btw, they just want equality for Palestinians.