Indonesia-China Navy To Hold Joint Military Exercise In South China Sea !

[Indos]

Let me bring back some history of our 1998 time (particularly after the shooting of Trisakti Students (around Mei).... There was an organized attacked to some building according to some witnesses....(newspaper gave this story...I dont know the truth either )...actually...there were 2 different troops at that time...one loyal to Soeharto....who wanted to make the situation under control....and there was another troops who were lead by some generals...who were quite ambitious....There was general that was sacked several days (or weeks) after Soeharto surrendered (and gave the power to Habibie (Vice President at that time).........

For I remembered during 1998......we all hated Soeharto...and wanted him to step down....The situation just like in Syria...or Libya......(after the shooting of Trisakti Students) If Indonesian were allowed to have guns...just like in USA, Syria, or Libya....You know what will be like in my country during that time....Emotion were at high after seeing university students being shoot and several died....This event that burned Jakarta...but only few days....

The hate is not for Indonesian Chinese ........Many burning building are an accumulation of frustrated Indonesian under Dictatorial rezime for so long.....(and some ...according to witnesses are an organized conduct....done by some people whose physical are more like Army than Normal People ( I read in Newspaper...and maybe some rumors around my place ( I dont really remember though).

Many victims were Native Indonesian...around 100 something...when they trapped in a firing building....

Almost (if not All) RECORDED Victims Are Native Indonesian Normal People.....And some guy in this forum gave the photo about conflict in "Sampit".....some pictures of 1999 Pamswakarsa versus university Students (Forum Kota)....some pictures of Ambon conflict........

We Indonesian, majority are moslem....if we killed a person without Justice (not a criminals)...it is as if we killed entire world....it is what is said in Quran. We regreted if there are some Chinese ethnic who are of course an Indonesian like we do that we should have protected...who become victims. For Me...as a person...I was trying to protect any body during that Time....protecting building from people wanting to burn it....I was using my university jacket with other university friends since university students were so respected during that time...(but I dont see any killing....or raping....just like an Independent investigation set up after that tragedy cannot also verified those accusation..)

If there are criminals in our country wanting to benefit from any chaotic situation....and tried to do something bad to our Chinese ethnic people...... we do hate them as like you hated them.....These criminals (if true) make something bad to our Chinese Brothers and Sisters.....brings bad name to Native Indonesian Normal guys...and to Islam as well...although not only Muslim who live in Jakarta....

 

[rott]

Whatever happened was in the past. You can learn and forgive the dark past and you can correct the future. Let us all learn from the past and correct our future. We Chinese are friends with the Indonesian NOW! So let's act now and construct a better future. I hope the Indonesian and Chinese members agree.

 

[armchairPrivate]

Fro sure every country acts on its own interest so would China. There are times that integrity is as important if not more, as making money, getting rich, being powerful.
China has a long history of advance culture and Confucism is a major pillar of that Chinese culture, a social philosophy that carried China through all these years. Confucius preached individuals, families, countries to having integrity.
If there is any indication of China being a country of integrity, I don't see it here judging from what I read by the Chinese posters. Was it because integrity has been destroyed by cultural revolution? I don't know.
When a state sponsored atrocity committed against ethnic Chinese just 15 years ago, no Chinese posters here brought up this subject for discussion. It took a foreigner to bring it up.

May be it is true that Chinese blood is cheap.

 

[cnleio]

Fro sure every country acts on its own interest so would China. There are times that integrity is as important if not more, as making money, getting rich, being powerful.
China has a long history of advance culture and Confucism is a major pillar of that Chinese culture, a social philosophy that carried China through all these years. Confucius preached individuals, families, countries to having integrity.
If there is any indication of China being a country of integrity, I don't see it here judging from what I read by the Chinese posters. Was it because integrity has been destroyed by cultural revolution? I don't know.
When a state sponsored atrocity committed against ethnic Chinese just 15 years ago, no Chinese posters here brought up this subject for discussion. It took a foreigner to bring it up.

May be it is true that Chinese blood is cheap.

Come on, man. How can u say Chinese blood cheap? The life is priceless for everyone !

Yes China has N-bomb and strong military force, but we are not American. Without diplomacy allows, it's inappropriate for China to intervene foreign incident or send out PLA Army to a foreign nation.

As i said first they r Indonesian-Chinese, Indonesian citizens, China government can help them through diplomatic channels and send planes/ships to take them back to China (It means their family
voluntarily give up Indonesian citizenship). Except sending PLA Army/Navy, China can do everything to help our overseas Chinese brothers and sistiers. Anyway 1998 riot is the PAIN for Indonesia and their ethnic Chinese, I hope Indonesians & ethnic Chinese had learnt from it.

The riots can not help ur economy development, only make ur country more backward.

 

[katarabhumi]

When a state sponsored atrocity committed against ethnic Chinese just 15 years ago, no Chinese posters here brought up this subject for discussion. It took a foreigner to bring it up.

May be it is true that Chinese blood is cheap.

There was NO state sponsored atrocity 15 years ago against ethnic chinese... The country was in chaos... Suharto had lost his grip on power... Indonesia was practically leaderless... people killing people regardless ethnic and religion... in fact, more native Indonesian died than Indonesian-chinese.

My father, like many civil servants at the time, was member of the Suharto's ruling party that hated communist.. not just a regular member but an active party official who tenaciously campaign for the party... however, I never see nor heard he condemned and preach hate against chinese/tionghoa.

No chinese-indonesian in my -majority muslim- home city was harmed in any kind.

.

 

[BoQ77]

Who grow to much better level after funding by China ?
North Korea ? Khmer Rouge ? African poor countries ?

 

[Nike]

Who grow to much better level after funding by China ?
North Korea ? Khmer Rouge ? African poor countries ?

at least right now, Angola and northern Sudan level income per capita right now is much better than you guys

 

[sweetgrape]

Have to say, I always associate 1998 massacre on Chinese with Indonesia, I don't want deceive myself, It is said that about 10 thousand chinese was victim of the atrocity, I don't know whether the number is right? but the massacre must exist.

Even now, reading the report that China export weapon to indonesia make feel bad, even in the Indonesia Megatsunami in 2004, I also protest China government donate about 60 million dollars to them, all because of 1998 massacre, although many of these chinese don't have Chinese Nationality, but they are Chinese, I also had seen some pictures that victim in that massacre, My feeling is the same with that while seems the picture of victime in Nanjing Massacre, till now, I still don't like indonesia.

If the Massacre is not caused by indonesian other enthic, not supported by your government, and you government do something in protecting Chinese, I don't believe there would be such huge victims, Indonesia must be responsible for the massacre, even if partly.

China government do too little to help ethnic Chinese in such kind of massacre on Chinese, Chinese are smart, always be rich in other place, also always be envied, if such massacre happened again, help China government can do more, even war with that country, I support it!

As to 1998 massacre, if indonesia are really responsible for it, you owe us a sorry, introspect it, and don't let it happened again, being forgave is not hard, if it is not your fault, show it!

 

[Nike]

Have to say, I always associate 1998 massacre on Chinese with Indonesia, I don't want deceive myself, It is said that about 100 thousand chinese was victim of the atrocity, I don't know whether the number is right? but the massacre must exist.

Even now, reading the report that China export weapon to indonesia make feel bad, even in the Indonesia Megatsunami in 2004, I also protest China government donate about 60 million dollars to them, all because of 1998 massacre, although many of these chinese don't have Chinese Nationality, but they are Chinese, I also had seen some pictures that victim in that massacre, My feeling is the same with that while seems the picture of victime in Nanjing Massacre, till now, I still don't like indonesia.

If the Massacre is not caused by indonesian other enthic, not supported by your government, and you government do something in protecting Chinese, I don't believe there would be such huge victims, Indonesia must be responsible for the massacre, even if partly.

China government do too little to help ethnic Chinese in such kind of massacre on Chinese, Chinese are smart, always be rich in other place, also always be envied, if such massacre happened again, help China government can do more, even war with that country, I support it!

As to 1998 massacre, if indonesia are really responsible for it, you owe us a sorry, introspect it, and don't let it happened again, being forgave is not hard, if it is not your fault, show it!

As it had been stated by other Indonesian member here, not many of Indonesian-Chinese descent dies in 1998 riot, much more of Indonesian javanese ethnicity has been dies in those events if you wanna to studying about it carefully and comprehensively. The regular Chinese people in Indonesia in Soeharto era long has been prosecuted and discriminated against. But in all, every discriminated laws has been abolished by our former President Abdurrahman Wahid and Megawati, even Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono extend those recognitions for Indonesian-Chinese ethnic by giving them the same opportunity in all level of society environment and even giving them National Holiday for their New Years and recognize Kong Hu Chu as our state recognized Religions, in the same level as Islam, Christian, Catholic, Buddhist and Hindu. Beforehand, Abdurrahman Wahid has formally request formal apology from our Indonesian-Chinese ethnic brother and sister for all of misconduct and abuse done by our government and other Indonesian people, even Abdurrahman Wahid doing that by bowing his head in front of National media as a deep regret for everything had been done against our Indonesian-Chinese brother and sister. Right now, there is no reasons for Indonesian-Chinese ethnics to living in regret and fear in Indonesia.

 

[sweetgrape]

As it had been stated by other Indonesian member here, not many of Indonesian-Chinese descent dies in 1998 riot, much more of Indonesian javanese ethnicity has been dies in those events if you wanna to studying about it carefully and comprehensively. The regular Chinese people in Indonesia in Soeharto era long has been prosecuted and discriminated against. But in all, every discriminated laws has been abolished by our former President Abdurrahman Wahid and Megawati, even Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono extend those recognitions for Indonesian-Chinese ethnic by giving them the same opportunity in all level of society environment and even giving them National Holiday for their New Years and recognize Kong Hu Chu as our state recognized Religions, in the same level as Islam, Christian, Catholic, Buddhist and Hindu. Beforehand, Abdurrahman Wahid has formally request formal apology from our Indonesian-Chinese ethnic brother and sister for all of misconduct and abuse done by our government and other Indonesian people, even Abdurrahman Wahid doing that by bowing his head in front of National media as a deep regret for everything had been done against our Indonesian-Chinese brother and sister. Right now, there is no reasons for Indonesian-Chinese ethnics to living in regret and fear in Indonesia.

From the media, I know that about 1 thousand Chinese have been killed, don't know how many other enthic suffer, whill I am seeing the picture of victim, I ask myself, why are these criminal such brutal?! from that time, I hate indonesian very much, Maybe I don't know too much the detail of the affair, hope you indonesian really introspect the atrocity, and don't let these happen again, protect anyone in your land, Chinese always will forgive you, if you admit your fault and correct it.

The end, still hope indonesia will develop well, not only chinese live well, all can, and be equal, I know China Zhenghe had gone to indonesia, don't damage the about 500 years relationship between you and us again.

 

[Viet]

Win-to-Win corporation for both Indonesia and China.

For China's national interest and energy security, i believe China will support Indonesia to develop as the N.o1 regional power country in SCS and Malacca Strait. China and Indonesia will be reliable partners + military alliance.

Good news for Indonesia and ur military force.

two losers want to conquer the world. You are more than delusional.

 

[cnleio]

two losers want to conquer the world. You are more than delusional.

Right now we feel GOOD !

 

[Viet]

Fro sure every country acts on its own interest so would China. There are times that integrity is as important if not more, as making money, getting rich, being powerful.
China has a long history of advance culture and Confucism is a major pillar of that Chinese culture, a social philosophy that carried China through all these years. Confucius preached individuals, families, countries to having integrity.
If there is any indication of China being a country of integrity, I don't see it here judging from what I read by the Chinese posters. Was it because integrity has been destroyed by cultural revolution? I don't know.
When a state sponsored atrocity committed against ethnic Chinese just 15 years ago, no Chinese posters here brought up this subject for discussion. It took a foreigner to bring it up.

May be it is true that Chinese blood is cheap.

Chinese lives are cheap. That is a fact, not only in China but also elsewhere. Look at her history!
As for Confucism, it is dead in China. You will find Confucism rather in Vietnam and Taiwan.

 

[Snomannen]

Chinese lives are cheap. That is a fact, not only in China but also elsewhere. Look at her history!
As for Confucism, it is dead in China. You will find Confucism rather in Vietnam and Taiwan.

Do you know that in Chinese history, when everyone is talking about, emphasizing and worshiping Confucism, it means that the end of the dynasty is near?

 

[cnleio]

Chinese lives are cheap. That is a fact, not only in China but also elsewhere. Look at her history!
As for Confucism, it is dead in China. You will find Confucism rather in Vietnam and Taiwan.

Chinese setup the Confucism College in Vietnam (Confucism project supported by China government ), Hanoi National University

Read ur Vietnamese newspager, 2013.10.17 China government signed with Vietnam government to setup China Confucism College in Hanoi National University.

The China governmen provide Confucism funds and GuangXi Normal University provide Chinese teachers and Vietnamese foreign students training, ur Vietnam Hanoi National University provide classrooms.

Here a Chinese news link:李克强总理见证我校越南孔子学院协议签订仪式

BTW what's the University Ranks in Vietnam? Is Hanoi National University the best school in Vietnam ?