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[Tridibans]

Hello bhai log kya haal hai? Swagat nahi karoge humara?

Tum aaye to @Star Wars wars banned ho gaya!!!

Are you two playing some sort of a game ?

 

[SarthakGanguly]

Why did people vote for BJP in 2014 then?

Hindutva in the cow belt. Progress and development in the rest of India.

 

[Tridibans]

They were not corrupt. Great injustice has been done to Sonia and Rahul Gandhi and company. Hopefully India will rectify its folly next time.

Well jokes aside, it is really mind boggling that Indians are so naive they still vote for a party because of which we are still a third world shithole !!!!

 

[JanjaWeed]

Tum aaye to @Star Wars wars banned ho gaya!!!

Are you two playing some sort of a game ?

What? No way...I thought @Star Wars was a better one...

 

[LaBong]

They were not corrupt. Great injustice has been done to Sonia and Rahul Gandhi and company. Hopefully India will rectify its folly next time.

People generally resort to sarcasm when they have no substantial answer.

 

[Tridibans]

https://twitter.com/x/status/665922664221962240

 

[SarthakGanguly]

Maybe GST or some other Bill.

Politics is the art of the Possible.

And you think this way they will behave? What good will come of India?

People generally resort to sarcasm when they have no substantial answer.

As always, you are right.

 

[LaBong]

For once, nobody voted because of Modi's caste or Beef ban.

Apart from the hardcore Hindutvadis, most of the youth voted against Corrupt and shameless dynasty of Congress. Add to that Modi had the Gujarat Model as an live example. It was a no brainier really for majority of voters (not counting self declared intellectuals like you or leftists) whom to choose . (40% voted NDA whose PM candidate was Modi).

But congress was not a factor in Bihar, so let me ask you again and hopefully you won't pussyfoot this time by usual ad hominem which comes to you guys naturally - Why did people in Bihar not vote as per their caste in 2014?

 

[Tridibans]

https://twitter.com/x/status/665916013205041153

Read the replies

No wonder all these Jihadi daughters get easy recruitment in NDTV. ISIS would be so proud !!!!

 

[SarthakGanguly]

Well jokes aside, it is really mind boggling that Indians are so naive they still vote for a party because of which we are still a third world shithole !!!!

Slap your nearest 'secular' in public places. Indians dig that. When you hit someone in a public place, people will look at you with rapt attention. Some may even beat up the guy without knowing. Not one will come forward.

Just make sure you are not up against women.

But congress was not a factor in Bihar, so let me ask you again and hopefully you won't pussyfoot this time by usual ad homain which comes to you guys naturally - Why did people in Bihar not vote as per their caste in 2014?

Because there was Hindu Muslim tension. We failed to bring that up.

How Modi set up a true role model for Muslims

"It is the non-Muslims who are the field of this Tabligh (propagation and conversion) of Islam and form the raw material for this splendid activity. We are opposed to Islam's right to missionary activity to a particular area," thus spoke Deobandi leader Maulana Hussain Ahmed Madani while opposing the formation of Pakistan in his speech before the 1945 Jamiat-e-Ulema-Hind conference in Delhi as quoted by author ZH Faruqi in his book The Deoband School and the Demand for Pakistan and later by reformist leader Hamid Dalwai in his book Muslim Politics in Secular India. On another occasion, Madani was even more unabashed in airing his views when he said: "If Dara Shikoh would have triumphed over Aurangzeb, Muslims would have stayed in India, but not Islam. Since Aurangzeb triumphed, both Muslims and Islam were here to stay."

As indicated by his above statements, Madani, a Deobandi preacher and Jamiat-e-Ulema-e-Hind leader, was a pan-Islamist. But since a significant section of the Deoband movement opposed the partition and took part in the Congress-led freedom movement as part of its long-term religious strategy to safeguard the interests of puritanical Islam, Madani figures as a nationalist in history books written during the Congress period. This was one of the main tragedies that India’s post-partition history saw. It prevented true Muslim role models for the community from emerging and encouraged the projection of pan-Islamists as role models, thus hindering the integration of the Muslim community with the Indian nation.

Had it not been so, true Muslim heroes instead of pan-Islamists would have figured in our history and been role models – like Ibrahim Khan Gardi, hero of the Third Battle of Panipat in 1761 who as the artillery in-charge of the Marathas refused to join the Muslim coalition of Afghan invader Ahmed Shah Abdali and had to pay with his life as a result, or Brig Usman who died fighting against the Pakistanis in 1948 in Kashmir and is the only Brigadier to be decorated with Param Vir Chakra, or Havaldar Hamid of the 1965 Indo-Pakistan war fame and scores of others including Rana Khan, another Muslim hero who emerged out of the Panipat battle and became the life-long friend of the great Maratha general Mahadji Scindia. Even during the action against terrorists at Gandhinagar's Akshardham temple in 2002, one of the jawans of the Gujarat State Reserve Police (SRP) who died after killing the two Pakistani terrorists was a Muslim.

It is in the light of this that Prime Minister Narendra Modi's appointment of former Intelligence Bureau (IB) chief Syed Asif Ibrahim as his special envoy on counter-terrorism should be seen. Ibrahim’s track record makes him a role model at a time when some leaders of the Wahabi stream want Indian Muslims to get sucked into the vortex of pan-Islamism: they want to do so by maintaining a separatist streak and raising special demands in the name of minorityism.

Interestingly, Ibrahim was made IB chief by the United Progressive Alliance (UPA) government in 2012 as part of its political strategy with an eye on Muslim votes. He, in fact, superseded four IB officials to get that post and the then Union home minister Sushil Kumar Shinde had even boasted that the UPA government was the first to ever appoint a Muslim IB chief in India's history. The UPA game plan was to use the IB to trap Modi and his aide Amit Shah in the Ishrat Jahan case to prevent the then Gujarat chief minister from emerging as the prime ministerial candidate for the 2014 polls. For this reason, a number of pliant officers had been inducted in the Central Bureau of Investigation (CBI), which was investigating the alleged fake encounter cases in Gujarat, including the one relating to Ishrat Jahan. But Asif Ibrahim became the stumbling block for the UPA designs at great personal risk.

The CBI was reportedly directed in the middle of 2013 by the home ministry to prosecute an IB officer, Rajendra Kumar, who as a Gujarat IB unit chief had given the Ishrat Jahan tip off to the Gujarat Police in 2004. He was to be booked on the charge that he was hand-in-glove with Gujarat government and had given a false tip off. But Ibrahim put his foot down and strongly protested before the home ministry saying that it would demoralise the IB and severely affect its intelligence network. He reportedly argued that the sanctity of India’s premier intelligence agency had to be maintained at all costs by not dragging it into a political battle.

The Hindu-Muslim wrangling is one of the major hurdles today in India’s true progress. The fundamentalism of pan-Islamists, who oppose a uniform civil code and removal of Article 370 of the Constitution, giving special status to Jammu and Kashmir, is one of the causes that prevents the integration of Muslims in the Indian society and sows seeds of hatred for Muslims in Hindu minds. Ibrahim’s liberal and patriotic credentials make him an apt model for creating a moderate class of Muslims willing to become equal partners with Hindus in India’s progress.

Ibrahim, who is from the Madhya Pradesh cadre, has a commendable track record. He was private secretary to the late Madhavrao Scindia when he became Union minister of state for Railways in 1984. This was after Scindia saw his calibre and integrity during his stint in Gwalior as a police officer. Later, he joined the IB and performed very well in the area of counter-terrorism in various capacities. Modi’s riposte to pan-Islamists by appointing Ibrahim to the prime minister's office (PMO) is a significant development in his year-long tenure and for the emergence of a truly secular India.

@fsayed @SarthakGanguly

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https://twitter.com/x/status/665912724300271616

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https://twitter.com/x/status/665917679270653957

My personal view is perhaps similar. I am not sure if it does align with any other. Islam is incompatible with India and must be resisted in its entirety. Muslims should be welcomed with open arms and treated as equal human beings. Indeed, Indian Muslims must be treated ONLY as Indians and nothing else. Muslims are not the problem. Islam is.

Dara Shikoh may have realized it in the 17th century. Akbar may have realized it in the 17th century.

Islam, as we know today, must go.

Some NGOs Work on an Agenda: Satyarthi -The New Indian Express

Oooops!!!

Latest Nobel winner bhakt on the stage.

 

[Tridibans]

But congress was not a factor in Bihar, so let me ask you again and hopefully you won't pussyfoot this time by usual ad hominem which comes to you guys naturally - Why did people in Bihar not vote as per their caste in 2014?

Did you not read my reply earlier?

Ok. So Again I will simplify it to you.

1) In 2014, it was Modi's election. He got approx. 35% votes in Bihar. You see.... a simple maths of JDU + Cong + RJD was close to 50 %. No rocket science. Now in 2015, Modi was not the candidate. So all the floating votes again voted as per Bihari tradition.... i.e caste and religion.

2) Traditionally (google 2010, 2005 elections) BJP's VS in Bihar hovers around 22-24 %. This time also it got 25%. NDA got 35%. So BJP in itself didn't lose any votes. It simply failed to break the MGB's Vote share.

3) All things aside, just take the cotre vote share of the MGB. Muslims will never vote for NDA. So automatically 17-18% shifts to MGB. Same goes for Yadav's (which the BJP tried to woo unsucessfully). Kurmis were behind their own leader Nitish. Here goes 40% of the Bihari population.

 

[Eminent Mainstream Media]

NDA l;ost 5 % vote share "COMPARED TO 2014"!!!

This is an important point everybody is missing out. Traditionally, BJP's hardcore VS + other small parties equals approx. 30% in Bihar.

In 2014, it was National Election and Modi was the PM candidate. Here, it was Nitish vs BJP (Modi was the campaigner but even a illeterate villager knew he was not to be Bihar CM).

EBC votes didnt get divided to that extent. It was mostly towards BJP+. Otherwise there is no chance in hell BJP+ would have got 35% VS.

To win Bihar, Yadav + Kurmis +Kushwahas' +OBC's were to be taken away from MGB where BJP failed miserably. All the Lalu votes got transferred to Nitish and Congress.

NDA with LJP and RSLP was there from 2014 only hence its only natural for that election to be taken as base in calculation- earlier It was with JDU sweeping Bihar with 45%++ RJD Congress nowhere to be seen-

True 2014 was a National election- however last election was Modi vs Lalu and Nitish make no doubt about that-majority of votes 25% or so out of 40% of MGB was AGAINST Modi for several reasons based on caste and communities-

EBC votes were divided- when you have 80% polarization among rest of the casts and communities 50-40% division either ways is divided vote- which happened with EBCs- and Dalits- Bihar will and always have the ground for BJP- 25++% votes It always had even when JDU was aligned to It with Modi and central Govt- they were expected to do better- Nitish was only the face real muscle was BJP in that NDA- like wise in MGB he will remain the face RJD will be the muscle- you can safely assume 30% of the votes in that 40% of MGB are RJD vote bank which will always be there with RJD irrespective of win or loss-

Now coming to your last part If BJP can't divide Yadav votes with NandKishor, RamKripal, HukumDev, Shatish Kumar in Its fold and Pappu as a proxy It should rethink its policy-

 

[SanjeevaniButi]

And you think this way they will behave? What good will come of India?

They are not required to behave but work on the principle of Give and Take.

It's a Trade Off. Some bad for the Greater good. That is what Politics is all about. That is what "Art of the Possible" means.

 

[Tridibans]

NDA with LJP and RSLP was there from 2014 only hence its only natural for that election to be taken as base in calculation- earlier It was with JDU sweeping Bihar with 45%++ RJD Congress nowhere to be seen-

True 2014 was a National election- however last election was Modi vs Lalu and Nitish make no doubt about that-majority of votes 25% or so out of 40% of MGB was AGAINST Modi for several reasons based on caste and communities-

EBC votes were divided- when you have 80% polarization among rest of the casts and communities 50-40% division either ways is divided vote- which happened with EBCs- and Dalits- Bihar will and always have the ground for BJP- 25++% votes It always had even when JDU was aligned to It with Modi and central Govt- they were expected to do better- Nitish was only the face real muscle was BJP in that NDA- like wise in MGB he will remain the face RJD will be the muscle- you can safely assume 30% of the votes in that 40% of MGB are RJD vote bank which will always be there with RJD irrespective of win or loss-

Now coming to your last part If BJP can't divide Yadav votes with NandKishor, RamKripal, HukumDev, Shatish Kumar in Its fold and Pappu as a proxy It should rethink its policy-

Well I am off to dinner will reply to you in detail in sometime.

But 2 quick points...

1) Yes BJP failed miserably in breaking the MGB caste voters. that is my point. BJP's own vote share of Brahmins, Baniyas and EBC were more or less intact.

2) Look at it this way. Muslims (18%), Yadavs (16%) Kurmis + OBC who generally vote for Nitish (15 %) Congress core voters (5-10%) all these adds up to 52-53%. No chance in hell for BJP without getting Yadav / Kurmi votes (Muslims are nbot even a question).

Now tell what was the final VS of MGB again? Around 40%. So they had a decrese of close to 10% of their VS . Almost same as 2014.

Only difference is, they were united this time so every seat it was BJP vs 3 parties. How on earth was BJP supposed to win?

 

[Eminent Mainstream Media]

But congress was not a factor in Bihar, so let me ask you again and hopefully you won't pussyfoot this time by usual ad hominem which comes to you guys naturally - Why did people in Bihar not vote as per their caste in 2014?

Look Up the pie-chart of 2014 election from Bihar- people voted on cast lines even then- only leaderless castes in the EBC tilted towards NDA and UCs united since they were fedup with UPA-

Here's the priority table- cancel out the one which does not apply depending on caste and religion- and you'll get the picture-

Hindus-

1- Caste factor
2- Development
3- Religion
4- Region

Muslims-

1- Religion
2- Religion
3- Religion
4- Religion
-------------
-------------
1000000000- Development

This case applies for Bihar and most cow belt-

Make no mistake in every major communal riot in Bihar the main fight has always been Yadavs vs Muslims but in voting they are united as an army behind Lalu-

Well I am off to dinner will reply to you in detail in sometime.

But 2 quick points...

1) Yes BJP failed miserably in breaking the MGB caste voters. that is my point. BJP's own vote share of Brahmins, Baniyas and EBC were more or less intact.

2) Look at it this way. Muslims (18%), Yadavs (16%) Kurmis + OBC who generally vote for Nitish (15 %) Congress core voters (5-10%) all these adds up to 52-53%. No chance in hell for BJP without getting Yadav / Kurmi votes (Muslims are nbot even a question).

Now tell what was the final VS of MGB again? Around 40%. So they had a decrese of close to 10% of their VS . Almost same as 2014.

Only difference is, they were united this time so every seat it was BJP vs 3 parties. How on earth was BJP supposed to win?

If I get the gist of you post correct yes NDA was unable to stop the expected- But with Modi and prominent leaders of the Yadav community like I mentioned before It was expected to do much better- let me remind you MGB only had there Yadav leaders- Lalu, Sharad and JPN while NDA had four+Pappu-

There has been some blunders and It needs to look into it- arithmetic will not be in favor always as was the case in 2014 with UP and Bihar- to control the cow belt in long run- BJP will have to get Yadavs to vote for them- There's no passing around it- Its too strong a community to ignore-