Indian Muslims on the creation of Pakistan

[ice_man]

pakistani muslims have faced hardship in the last decade before that the state of pakistani muslims was way ahead of indians! even our economy was way ahead....but in the last decade inida has really moved forward

 

[Feisal]

Appears Pakistan's pre-mature birth was undemocratic if not unpatriotic to the sub-continent. No wonder we have glorified a loser army (recall 1971) and encourage the judiciary to give us the law!
Historically, we Pakistanis (non-nation state) encouraged tangent of judiciary and military to have some quick-fix governance instead of strengthening institutions through grass-root level democracy.

 

[Feisal]

Forbes List of Billionaires has an Bharti Muslim, Azeem Premji. Bharat may be more secular than we'd like to believe!

 

[SQ8]

Appears Pakistan's pre-mature birth was undemocratic if not unpatriotic to the sub-continent. No wonder we have glorified a loser army (recall 1971) and encourage the judiciary to give us the law!
Historically, we Pakistanis (non-nation state) encouraged tangent of judiciary and military to have some quick-fix governance instead of strengthening institutions through grass-root level democracy.

So what in your view.. would be a fully grown birth of Pakistan?

 

[jbond197]

So what in your view.. would be a fully grown birth of Pakistan?

I think what he meant by "premature" is - that in Pakistan, democratic machinery/Institutions were not given a chance to develop at all..

Healthy working institutions is the sign of healthy nation..

But anyways, he made a good point!!

 

[Jango]

I think what he meant by "premature" is - that in Pakistan, democratic machinery/Institutions were not given a chance to develop at all..

More like post-delivery complications!!!

As I always say, Zia ruined the society, Musharraf ruined the state/system.

We cannot expect that all the civil institutions magically perform at full efficiency after 9 odd years of a one man show.

 

[cloud]

I dont think they got equal opportunities..'
Affluent..no..
But comfortable..very much.
Living in cramped potholed streets...
Still musing about their future..
They cant compete in their neighborhood..
their education level is lower..
And the saddest part of it..they are forgetting their own culture..
They speak a hodgepodge of half sanskrit and half urdu..

Their parents..
some of their cousins here are millionaires...and all of them had the same opportunity..the same start..
Each have struggled..
But the reward for that struggle has been contrastingly different.
Those people.. whose father was supposedly a close friend of Jawaharlal nehru.. on a first name basis..are still lower middle class..
On the opposite site..
their cousins....even the worst off..are better than the best they have there.
The only Indian cousin who has a good life is one who sold his stakes in India and moved to Dubai.. his hard work of twenty years paid off for him.

How come Pakistani Muslims are more poor?

pakistani muslims have faced hardship in the last decade before that the state of pakistani muslims was way ahead of indians! even our economy was way ahead....but in the last decade inida has really moved forward

that was the advantage of already available resources? What pakistan did it to improve?

what is worth of indians' views on creation of Pakistan in the first place? they are indians hence their bad mouthing aganist Pakistan is nothing to be debated.

they sided with inida hence they opposed Pakistan so thats not a big deal , the real point to ponder is how they feel in india today ? what is their condition there today

better then your people in your country..

As a naturalized American Pakistani, born to Indian born parents (who became Pakistanis in 1947); I recently went to see my ancestral home 4 years ago, to see where my parents lived. My mother's place of birth is Ranchi, & my dad's is Patna; and their parents in a village of Khujwan. It was fascinating to see, but extremely sad at the same time. I realized how much pain the partition of 1947 had caused to India. The prosperous state of UP, the cradle of Muslim culture & development before 1947 became, along with Bihar, the poorest states of India; with frequent communal riots between the Hindus & the Muslims left behind. Many people in UP & Bihar had to leave their homes & settle in other cities in other states.

My maternal and paternal grandmothers migrated to Pakistan, but their siblings didn't; & my grandmothers couldn't talk to their siblings in India for years, because even getting in touch would mean trouble for those left behind. Delhi, which was once famous for its Muslim culture, completely lost its stong Muslim culture. After 1947 unfortunately, slowly the condition of Indian Muslims started getting worse & worse. Even though the new generation of Indian Muslims is defiant against Pakistan, they haven't seen the pain their grandparents faced immediately after 1947.

My cousins in Delhi (whose parents migrated from Bihar to Delhi) told me about the relationship of Indian Muslims with Pakistan: "the rich Indians hate Pakistan, while the poor Indians love Pakistan." I believe there is a lot of truth in this statement: unfortunately, it is common to see the rich elite minority Indian Muslims on TV, when the majority are living in deprived conditions, and that is the reality of the situation in India.

So you mean to say they would have been better off living in your poor terrorist country? where daily hundreds of them die not because of poverty but your mullah Islami nature..

 

[Bhairava]

I dont think they got equal opportunities..'
Affluent..no..
But comfortable..very much.
Living in cramped potholed streets...
Still musing about their future..
They cant compete in their neighborhood..
their education level is lower..
And the saddest part of it..they are forgetting their own culture..
They speak a hodgepodge of half sanskrit and half urdu..

Their parents..
some of their cousins here are millionaires...and all of them had the same opportunity..the same start..
Each have struggled..
But the reward for that struggle has been contrastingly different.
Those people.. whose father was supposedly a close friend of Jawaharlal nehru.. on a first name basis..are still lower middle class..
On the opposite site..
their cousins....even the worst off..are better than the best they have there.
The only Indian cousin who has a good life is one who sold his stakes in India and moved to Dubai.. his hard work of twenty years paid off for him.

So you think whose fault was it ?

 

[killerx]

indain muslim have played an imprtant role in pakistan creation long live pakistan

 

[faizahmad]

Jinnah said that the muslims under indian rule would drop to the lowest class in india......it turned out to be true.
I bet if pakistan opened its border the muslims from india would rush into pakistan.

Ps was there a referendum in india asking if all the people wanted the india we have today?

I would call it A joke--- we do not want to Migrate to Pakistan or any other country ,,India has Given us every right which a citizen of a country deserves and Thank God Our Grand parents didn't opt out to move for pakistan and we are proud of them as they were brave enough and Loyal to Our Motherland (India).Pakistan Don't even exist in our last thoughts ..... Pity the life of Muhajirs who are still longing to be pakistani rather then being called as a muhajir........... GTFO out of your delusion bout Indian Musllims ...... we are Indians till the last drop of our Blood .......... Jai Hind

We got few Mojars in BD... Anybody want them back???? Hello.....

We got illegal Immigrants from Bangladesh too .. do u want them back

In Pakistan, every Punjabi can understand Urdu. Even our elders in villages in Punjab who are not that fluent in Urdu, if you talk to them in Urdu they will understand and reply in Punjabi and most Urdu speakers can also undertand Punjabi even though they cant speak Punjabi.

Out of all the native languages in Pakistan (Punjabi, Pashto, Balochi, Sindhi, Hindko, Pahari, Balti, etc), Punjabi is closest to Urdu.

Btw whats bhojpuri, we dont have that language in Pakistan.

Bhojpuri is a common accent spoken in UP and Bihar

 

[faizahmad]

There is a myth that all Indian Muslims wanted Pakistan. Facts are otherwise. No wonder there are almost equal number of Muslims who decided to live back in India. Here is letter from Indian Muslims to UN;

I am a Mohajir in the purest sense of the word: my mother was born in Ranchi (present day Jharkhand), my father in Patna; my maternal and paternal side were both from Bihar. My grandparents (maternal and paternal) both left along with my parents (who were very young) in 1947, along with some relatives from both sides. There was a lot of family left behind too, namely the siblings of my maternal grandparents as well as most of my maternal side. My maternal grandmother told me recently that she couldn't talk to her sister on the phone after 1947, and she couldn't be in touch with her for a few years. It's my understanding that most Muslims DID want to come, but many belonged to the impoverished states UP and Bihar. Getting to Pakistan was a huge distance, and they couldn't afford it, plus there was also this danger of getting killed on the way via land. My grandparents and my parents took a train for Bombay (because Maharashtra had no direct border with any part of Pakistan, so it was relatively peaceful), and then went to Karachi by ship. They could afford it, other poor people from Bihar (which includes many of my relatives) couldn't. So the Muslims left behind didn't stay because of their choice, they stayed because they couldn't afford to go.

Indian Muslims have always been suffering an inferiority complex against Pakistan after 1947. They have had to endure some very tough times after 1947, where they had to prove they were loyal to India and had nothing to do with Pakistan. They felt that the creation of Pakistan would cause them a lot of harm, and they were very apprehensive about how they would be treated in Hindu majority India. If anyone with links to Pakistan right after 1947 was found, they would be in trouble. And in about 50 of the 60 years of the independence of both countries, Pakistan has performed better economically than India, which is another reason for their inferiority complexes. It's only till recently (after 2000) that India has done better than Pakistan, and look at the "happiness" of these Indian Muslims.

Inferiority complex against pakistan?. What is so great about pakistan which makes us suffer from complex the answer is nothing. if u are Happy Being A Pakistani then we are too proud to be an Indian and Why wouldn't we our ancestral roots belong to this country and so do our adaptability towards many things which is common among all the religons in India which is "Language,culture traditions and much more which do not harm each others in mixing with faith/religion......

 

[INDIC]

Karachi and Stranded Pakistanis are classic examples of what Pakistan turned into.

 

[faizahmad]

Indian muslims cant say anything about India because they will be bur just common sense

We don't have any thing bad to say about India because we are happy here since our fore fathers time

 

[INDIC]

They speak a hodgepodge of half sanskrit and half urdu.

what about Punjabis and Pashtuns of Pakistan who just went through Urdufication. Just consult an Indian Punjabi or an Afghan what they think of their respective groups in Pakistan.

 

[neutral_person]

Man this is a pretty screwed up thread. How about lets just settle for Indians (regardless of religion) stay in India and Pakistanis (regardless of religion) stay in Pakistan.